Bernie Sanders Thread

[Mtntrout]

No really.. The mordern day democrat voter lives off all of free programs by the govt

It's hard to take a poster who says these kinds of things seriously when one knows for a fact that what they're saying just flat out isn't true.

 

[theFallGuy]

Alabama and Mississippi definitely should have been left alone to implement Civil Rights and Voters Rights legislation 👍🏻

I'm glad the government stopped racism #jimcrowlaws

 

[hog88]

It's hard to take a poster who says these kinds of things seriously when one knows for a fact that what they're saying just flat out isn't true.

It's not?

 

[Mtntrout]

It's not?

Statistically, the poorest don't vote much at all. Further, the poorest states tend to be overwhelmingly red. Meanwhile, the largest, wealthiest cities tend to be blue.

How do you square that with the concept that the average democrat is on welfare? it doesn't make a damn bit of sense.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

Literally the only one worth a sh!t and he people it intended to help don't even use it. School lunch? Were you home schooled?? I used to get spaghetti served to me out of a can..OUT OF A CAN...in school.

You can't be serious?

Vocational school funding for young people who aren't going to college or university isn't worth a s**t?

Forbidding discrimination against race isn't worth a s**t?

Ending state and local barriers against African American voters isn't worth a s**t?

Federal student aid for low income young people aspiring to attend college or university isn't worth a s**t?

Low-cost or free lunch for underprivileged children in schools isn't worth a s**t?

Cutting back on pollution isn't worth a s**t?

Health insurance options for poor, disabled, and elderly Americans isn't worth a s**t?

Helping disadvantaged preschoolers isn't worth a s**t?

Funding public libraries, universities, museums, and television isn't worth a s**t?

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

I'm glad the government stopped racism #jimcrowlaws

Racism will never end, but moves can and have been made to make discrimination illegal.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

Statistically, the poorest don't vote much at all. Further, the poorest states tend to be overwhelmingly red. Meanwhile, the largest, wealthiest cities tend to be blue.

How do you square that with the concept that the average democrat is on welfare? it doesn't make a damn bit of sense.

It really doesn't make sense, but that doesn't match the narrative.

 

[tumscalcium]

Statistically, the poorest don't vote much at all. Further, the poorest states tend to be overwhelmingly red. Meanwhile, the largest, wealthiest cities tend to be blue.

How do you square that with the concept that the average democrat is on welfare? it doesn't make a damn bit of sense.

You should get out more.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

This point and that video will fall on deaf ears here. I've made the same discussion for months and all I get is a bunch of guys saying they're tired of paying for lazy people's problems while, on the other hand, being perfectly okay with other people subsidizing their lives with roads, education, social security, police protection, fire departments, military, etc.

Let's see... I pay property taxes which pay for those roads and police protection and fire departments and the military. Welfare recipients are not paying for ANY of those things, and are getting even more of my tax monies for their sustinence. Yeah... those things are equivalent. gtfo

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

So there shouldn't be a safety net for the very poor?

Should that safety net be allowed to become a way of life? At what point would think it reasonable to cut it off? 1 year? 2 years? ever? Or I guess that "looking" for a job would consist of actively trying to get out of the system...

Your two guys are unbelievable.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

Let's see... I pay property taxes which pay for those roads and police protection and fire departments and the military. Welfare recipients are not paying for ANY of those things, and are getting even more of my tax monies for their sustinence. Yeah... those things are equivalent. gtfo

You pay a fraction of what it costs to pave a road, let alone all of the roads you use. Not including interstate highways and roads you use in states outside of where you pay taxes. The same goes for the other services. Yet you get to use them the same amount as someone who pays far more than you do. You're benefiting from those things about as much as welfare recipients are benefiting from what small amount you contribute to their sustenance.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

Should that safety net be allowed to become a way of life? At what point would think it reasonable to cut it off? 1 year? 2 years? ever? Or I guess that "looking" for a job would consist of actively trying to get out of the system...

Your two guys are unbelievable.

For some, yes, our social safety nets are all there is for people. But just like not all corporations and rich people are evil and greedy, not all welfare recipients are lazy leeches.

Of course people who are capable of working should be working, but that isn't always possible or plausible (unfortunately), especially considering most people in that situation are low skilled individuals and the only jobs available for them are low wage jobs that pay comparable to an unemployment check. But when we try to discuss fixing that, people get up in arms about how these same people don't deserve any higher pay, and a previous poster said funding for vocational schools isn't worth a s**t. Well what do people want? A low skilled and uneducated group of people using unemployment benefits or a moderately skilled and educated group of people making a wage that incentivizes them to not collect unemployment checks?

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

For some, yes, our social safety nets are all there is for people. But just like not all corporations and rich people are evil and greedy, not all welfare recipients are lazy leeches.

Of course people who are capable of working should be working, but that isn't always possible or plausible (unfortunately), especially considering most people in that situation are low skilled individuals and the only jobs available for them are low wage jobs that pay comparable to an unemployment check. But when we try to discuss fixing that, people get up in arms about how these same people don't deserve any higher pay, and a previous poster said funding for vocational schools isn't worth a s**t. Well what do people want? A low skilled and uneducated group of people using unemployment benefits or a moderately skilled and educated group of people making a wage that incentivizes them to not collect unemployment checks?

Why does it have to be free? Why can't they work those debts off? Even people that "can't" work can do something. The number that are complete invalids is minute compared to the number that are playing the system. Why should tax deductions and EIC be given to people that continue to have more and more children? For that matter why is ANYBODY getting tax deductions for having children? I want everybody to pay their fair share. Unfortunately the progressive definition of "fair" is skewed way off the reservation.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

You pay a fraction of what it costs to pave a road, let alone all of the roads you use. Not including interstate highways and roads you use in states outside of where you pay taxes. The same goes for the other services. Yet you get to use them the same amount as someone who pays far more than you do. You're benefiting from those things about as much as welfare recipients are benefiting from what small amount you contribute to their sustenance.

My tax bill would make your eyes water. I pay way more than my "fair share" because I don't itemize.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

"These damn lazy people need to get an education, a better job, and stop using MY damn tax dollars to receive food stamps."

Same person says

"These damn lazy people need to quit thinking public education should be affordable and they need to get paid what "the free market" says they're worth."

It is a catch 22 for some people. For example, you want them to get off of government benefits, but you won't support a minimum wage that AT LEAST is adjusted to inflation. Some people can't get out of this vicious cycle, unfortunately, and if it weren't for federal student aid programs, I'd likely be one of them. Sorry if I sympathize with people in these circumstances, and can see what they're capable of if only given a helping hand.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

"These damn lazy people need to get an education, a better job, and stop using MY damn tax dollars to receive food stamps."

Same person says

"These damn lazy people need to quit thinking public education should be affordable and they need to get paid what "the free market" says they're worth."

It is a catch 22 for some people. For example, you want them to get off of government benefits, but you won't support a minimum wage that AT LEAST is adjusted to inflation. Some people can't get out of this vicious cycle, unfortunately, and if it weren't for federal student aid programs, I'd likely be one of them. Sorry if I sympathize with people in these circumstances, and can see what they're capable of if only given a helping hand.

Helping hand.... fine. Handout... not fine.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

Why does it have to be free? Why can't they work those debts off? Even people that "can't" work can do something. The number that are complete invalids is minute compared to the number that are playing the system. Why should tax deductions and EIC be given to people that continue to have more and more children? For that matter why is ANYBODY getting tax deductions for having children? I want everybody to pay their fair share. Unfortunately the progressive definition of "fair" is skewed way off the reservation.

So you're saying my 62 year old grandmother who isn't an invalid, by your definition, should have to work off her welfare benefits? What about my little brother who has muscular dystrophy? He isn't an invalid, but he's 20 and can't climb a set of stairs without a hand rail. He should also be forced to work for what little help he receives? I'm sorry if I want to spare people their dignity.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

My tax bill would make your eyes water. I pay way more than my "fair share" because I don't itemize.

Even if you pay more than your "fair share", your tax bill would pale in comparison to the costs of constructing all of the roads and public services you benefit from.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

So you're saying my 62 year old grandmother who isn't an invalid, by your definition, should have to work off her welfare benefits? What about my little brother who has muscular dystrophy? He isn't an invalid, but he's 20 and can't climb a set of stairs without a hand rail. He should also be forced to work for what little help he receives? I'm sorry if I want to spare people their dignity.

So your brother cannot do a desk job of some sort? How does HE feel about taking a handout forever from people that he doesn't even know? Does he feel "dignified" in doing that? If he does, I find that reprehensible. I am in no way minimizing that terrible disease. But while he is able to work, wouldn't doing something as a form of showing appreciation to others be more dignified in his eyes? Or is he still in the "anger" stage, and feels that he is owed his support from others? Maybe my parents raised me differently. There is pride in earning one's way. Living of the back of someone else is shameful if you can do something to share in that burden. When I was out of college back in the day, I worked three jobs at one point. I was proud that I was self reliant. My parents would have helped me, but it was much more fulfilling to make my own way. I guess I am the freak here.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

Even if you pay more than your "fair share", your tax bill would pale in comparison to the costs of constructing all of the roads and public services you benefit from.

That is an idiotic argument. Of course I am not paying for miles and miles of roads to be built, but I am paying far more than those that pay nothing and get those same benefits.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

So your brother cannot do a desk job of some sort? How does HE feel about taking a handout forever from people that he doesn't even know? Does he feel "dignified" in doing that? If he does, I find that reprehensible. I am in no way minimizing that terrible disease. But while he is able to work, wouldn't doing something as a form of showing appreciation to others be more dignified in his eyes? Or is he still in the "anger" stage, and feels that he is owed his support from others? Maybe my parents raised me differently. There is pride in earning one's way. Living of the back of someone else is shameful if you can do something to share in that burden. When I was out of college back in the day, I worked three jobs at one point. I was proud that I was self reliant. My parents would have helped me, but it was much more fulfilling to make my own way. I guess I am the freak here.

Of course he doesn't feel entitled,. He hates that his body is basically as strong as an elderly man's, and it will only get weaker. If he stands for too long, his legs quiver. If he sits for too long, his back spasms. He is in college now, and has to use a scooter to get around campus at UT.

Since my family hit the mother lode of health disasters (mom had a brain tumor, non malignant, but left her having seizures for the rest of her life, step dad was injured on a welding job and has had three back surgeries, dad had prostate cancer and has to wear diapers to keep from urinating on himself, and little brother was born with muscular dystrophy) healthcare bills (a whole other discussion) have since put them in dire straits. My little brother is only able to afford college because of federal student aid, like myself. He plans on dropping the benefits when he finishes his degree, but in the mean time I don't want to push arbitrary tasks on him so he can feel like he's earned his keep in society.

I feel obligated, as an American and a human being, to help people like my brother, my granny, my mom, my dad, and step dad, and whoever else out there that literally cannot help the misfortunes that have befallen them, which is the majority of people who receive government benefits.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

That is an idiotic argument. Of course I am not paying for miles and miles of roads to be built, but I am paying far more than those that pay nothing and get those same benefits.

It isn't idiotic. If this is the case, you deserve to use no more of the roads than a billionaire who pays more taxes than you. If we're going by a person's contribution levels, you basically pay as little as the "nothing" a poor person does when compared to a person like Donald Trump.

 

[FLVOL69]

Of course he doesn't feel entitled,. He hates that his body is basically as strong as an elderly man's, and it will only get weaker. If he stands for too long, his legs quiver. If he sits for too long, his back spasms. He is in college now, and has to use a scooter to get around campus at UT.

Since my family hit the mother lode of health disasters (mom had a brain tumor, non malignant, but left her having seizures for the rest of her life, step dad was injured on a welding job and has had three back surgeries, dad had prostate cancer and has to wear diapers to keep from urinating on himself, and little brother was born with muscular dystrophy) healthcare bills (a whole other discussion) have since put them in dire straits. My little brother is only able to afford college because of federal student aid, like myself. He plans on dropping the benefits when he finishes his degree, but in the mean time I don't want to push arbitrary tasks on him so he can feel like he's earned his keep in society.

I feel obligated, as an American and a human being, to help people like my brother, my granny, my mom, my dad, and step dad, and whoever else out there that literally cannot help the misfortunes that have befallen them, which is the majority of people who receive government benefits.

I was right with you up until your last sentence, there's a new mindset out there today.

 

[G0 BIG 0RANGE]

I was right with you up until your last sentence, there's a new mindset out there today.

The mindset of compassion?

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

I feel obligated, as an American and a human being, to help people like my brother, my granny, my mom, my dad, and step dad, and whoever else out there that literally cannot help the misfortunes that have befallen them, which is the majority of people who receive government benefits.

Well here again, do you believe that government is better able to distribute monies destined to "help" people like your brother, or would private charity better do that. Hint: If you say the government is, then you and I can discuss this no further as it would be pointless and I will wish you a good night.

But another story. My sister in law worked for the state of TN years ago talking to welfare recipients about their prospects for getting work. She told me that not a few (but rather many) would come in to her office demanding... demanding to know when they "were gonna get paid". Paid. Therein is the problem, and it is not nearly as small as you want to believe.