Cbj

[Brianchevy]

Franklin is supposedly also candidate for the Browns and Redskins jobs.

That's because Hasalam wants UT to win the "State Championship" next year -- he, as Browns owner, wants to hire CJF away.

 

[Wylo]

I want us to go to a bowl game as bad as anyone. But I cannot start to put Butch on a hot seat if he goes 5-7 again. We didn't get this bad in 2-3 years. Now I would consider him to be on the hot seat if he doesn't go at least 6-6 in 2015.

three years to get to 6 wins? that attitude is why UT keeps settling for loser coaches and loser results. Not saying Butch is a loser, but UT does have a habit of hiring poorly in several sports.

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

It baffles me people expected Jones not to get blown out by 4 of the top teams in America when those teams are even blowing out ranked teams.

I don't know why more people do not understand this.

 

[vol_in_ar]

CBJ has done an excellent job in his first year as UT coach, especially when you factor in the potential 2014 signing class. He seems very well respected throughout college football. With that being said, do you think Penn State's national search committee will reach out to CBJ? I have read that James Franklin is high on their list. I think CBJ would not interview even if contacted, but it might be even more positive national exposure if CBJ was contacted and turned down the interview. What do you guys think?

I wouldn't call losing to Vandy, excellent

 

[gnm53108]

I wouldn't call losing to Vandy, excellent

Me either.

 

[jkleno]

Why would he consider Penn St? UT is the better job...

Please read 1st post- question never asked if he would consider leaving.

 

[jkleno]

I wouldn't call losing to Vandy, excellent

I replied that I was wrong in using "excellent."

 

[jkleno]

I mentioned yesterday that the AU game would mark a game years from now that would signal the fall of the Tide. I think last night helped my point. Now I see why Saban decided to stay at Bamer and not go to Texas- too much Sooner butt kicking. It looked like the Bamer fans were given enemas at halftime. The close ups of their fans are always priceless when they lose.

 

[TGVol]

Now I see why Saban decided to stay at Bamer and not go to Texas

He probably no longer has that Texas option - hard to imagine them hiring someone who just got handled by Oklahoma's freshmen QB (even with his resume that may be a tough pill to swallow for Texas fans).

 

[vol_in_ar]

He probably no longer has that Texas option - hard to imagine them hiring someone who just got handled by Oklahoma's freshmen QB (even with his resume that may be a tough pill to swallow for Texas fans).

if he would go, the boosters writing checks at Texas would be a mile long

 

[titansvolsfaninga]

OP No! If Butch and CO. bolt for PSU, then we will lose the best staff in America.

If you had a brain, you would be dangerous.

 

[titansvolsfaninga]

He probably no longer has that Texas option - hard to imagine them hiring someone who just got handled by Oklahoma's freshmen QB (even with his resume that may be a tough pill to swallow for Texas fans).

Are you serious? Bamas' Secondary has sucked all year. If you make decisions based on one occurrence, I feel sorry for you.

 

[TGVol]

Are you serious? Bamas' Secondary has sucked all year. If you make decisions based on one occurrence, I feel sorry for you.

I don't loot at it short term at all but I'm not your typical fan. For example, I felt CDD did a good job and needed more time.

 

[jkleno]

Are you serious? Bamas' Secondary has sucked all year. If you make decisions based on one occurrence, I feel sorry for you.

If you think Bama's secondary has sucked all year, then I feel sorry for YOU. Maybe you are basing decisions based on one game. Bama went into game with 4th ranked defense nationwide and last I looked that took a team effort.

 

[gnm53108]

Are you serious? Bamas' Secondary has sucked all year. If you make decisions based on one occurrence, I feel sorry for you.

Agree but if TN was conducting a coaching search I dont think Vol Nation would be too excited if we were after a guy who's last game was a loss to one of our biggest rivals.

 

[jkleno]

Agree but if TN was conducting a coaching search I dont think Vol Nation would be too excited if we were after a guy who's last game was a loss to one of our biggest rivals.

Agreed.

 

[orangeluvr]

penn state= Bugger U.

 

[sjt18]

Inconsistentcy with a bad team? You think?

No. Inconsistency with bad coaching. You keep trying to make this a player only issue. It isn't. The talent was there to win 7 or at least 6 games. And wins STILL don't cancel out bad losses. If UT is to EVER rise to where I hope we all want to see them... they need a coach that wins all games where he has the better roster, most of the ones where the rosters are equal, and at least some of the games where he's undermanned. In short, UT needs an elite coach. What we saw from this staff this year wasn't even good much less "elite".

UF was not a terrible team when we lost to them.

Yes they were. It was not quite known yet but they were. Their O was already bad then lost its QB during the game... but Jancek managed to make the back up who had little preparation look like a Heisman candidate. They had an OL go down and multiple defensive players.

And you have yet to answer my question. How in the world has he done less than what we expected?

I HAVE ANSWERED THIS QUESTION AD NAUSEUM. I have answered it so many times that a guy put me on "ignore" the other day because I keep repeating the same answer(s). They underachieved the talent the had. The roster was not great. It was not a 8+ win roster vs that schedule. But it also wasn't a roster that should have been rolled that badly by Mizzou, Aub, Bama, and Oregon. It is not a roster that should have struggled with So Alabama. It is not a roster that with 2 weeks of prep and competent coaching should have lost to Vandy AT HOME.

What more do you really want? I have gone into more specific details all over this board.

What has he not done to make you happy with what he has in such little time? Should we have expected him to go 7-5?

We should have expected him to go 6-6. We should have expected him to not look completely outclassed by other coaches even with the talent disparities he had to deal with. We should have been able to hope that with solid coaching 7 was attainable.

"Little time"? He had all spring, August, then 12 weeks of the season to prepare for Vandy.

Look, you can turn a blind eye all you want but what we saw from the coaches this fall looked eerily like the waning years of Fulmer and also what we saw from Dooley. Tight games against what should have been homecoming fodder. Losses to lesser opponents. Blowouts to the better teams on the schedule.

If we can't expect better coaching then there was very little sense in changing to start with going all the way back to Sanders' firing.

 

[sjt18]

three years to get to 6 wins? that attitude is why UT keeps settling for loser coaches and loser results. Not saying Butch is a loser, but UT does have a habit of hiring poorly in several sports.

There are people here who seriously believe it takes that long to improve the season win total by one game. They also believe that the promises of better days being sold to recruits right now will still sell if that happens.

If Jones cannot show signs of life by year 3... then he is unlikely to ever succeed at UT. You have to cut losses.

 

[vol_in_ar]

I replied that I was wrong in using "excellent."

you can edit it to mediocre

 

[sjt18]

I don't know why more people do not understand this.

It isn't a lack of understanding. We completely understand the point you are trying to make... it simply is not valid. At some point in time if you are a very good coach... it shows up. Not only was Oregon limited more by lesser talented teams, they were beaten by lesser rosters. Mizzou had tighter games against less talented teams. Auburn did as well.

If he's blown out 2 or even 3 times but manages to make one of those games closer than it was expected to be then maybe you'd have a point... if he had not lost to Vandy too.

I really can't understand why some of you are so determined to blind yourself that you cannot recognize the simple truth that this staff did not get the most out of the 13 roster that it could have.

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

Are you serious? Bamas' Secondary has sucked all year. If you make decisions based on one occurrence, I feel sorry for you.

Please tell me you're joking. Is that why the 2 best WRs in the SEC (LSU's) were held in check by Bama? Is that why Moncrief and Treadwell was shut down because their secondary sucked? lol:

Maybe you should say their secondary was not as good as last year.

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

It isn't a lack of understanding. We completely understand the point you are trying to make... it simply is not valid. At some point in time if you are a very good coach... it shows up. Not only was Oregon limited more by lesser talented teams, they were beaten by lesser rosters. Mizzou had tighter games against less talented teams. Auburn did as well.

If he's blown out 2 or even 3 times but manages to make one of those games closer than it was expected to be then maybe you'd have a point... if he had not lost to Vandy too.

I really can't understand why some of you are so determined to blind yourself that you cannot recognize the simple truth that this staff did not get the most out of the 13 roster that it could have.

Ok so most picked us to go 5-7 or 6-6 at best last season. This was before Auburn and. Mizzou balled out and became top 10 teams. So I see one game in which there was underachievement, the Vandy game. CBJ coached that game in a very weird way, I will admit that. Considering we almost won playing that bad shows that he made a coaching error. So what? It happens.

Oregon was beaten by lesser rosters? Wow the fact that you said that shows a lot. It's not even worth arguing over because you're just blind. You're obviously a recruiting star gazer. Every game is different. One game cannot predict the outcome of another.

Look at last nights game. OU does not have anywhere near the talent that Bama has on either side of the ball. But what happened? The tide got rolled. What you cannot seem to realize is it doesn't matter how close or how competitive a game is played. Do you think people look at OUs schedule and see that they barely beat WV? Or the fact that Auburn barely beat TAMU? No. It's wins and losses and that's it. If FSU only won all of their games by 3 points and only beat Auburn by 3 points, would people be saying wow they barely won all of their games? No. They would be saying they went undefeated and won the NC.

According to you us being more competitive in our blow out losses would have made some kind of difference. It would have only made a difference to you. Like I have said before, if we would have been more competitive those losses would still have been losses. The coaching staff did make some mistakes this season, but given the situation they were in and the schedule, I am proud of what they accomplished. Now if they don't make any improvements by 2015 then I will start thinking about putting them on the hit seat.

Oh and I guess beating the #11 team in the country, something Missouri or Clemson couldn't do, means nothing right?

 

[TGVol]

Ok so most picked us to go 5-7 or 6-6 at best last season. This was before Auburn and. Mizzou balled out and became top 10 teams. So I see one game in which there was underachievement, the Vandy game.

It's less about the W-L record than what we looked like most of the year while losing - blown out too many times while looking completely impotent on offense and almost as bad as under Sal on defense. Also, I'm convinced that if Malzahn walked into the exact same roster CBJ found here at UT he would have won more games with the exact same players (since you bring up Mizzou their coach would have probably done better as well). That's what the issue is - some of us us feel that our talent level was not as poor as the performances we saw on the field and that the coaches did not use what talent they had properly (and therefore there is suspicion that even when we do load up with better talent how much better are we really going to be if the quality of coaching does not improve).

 

[sjt18]

Ok so most picked us to go 5-7 or 6-6 at best last season.

No. The vast majority said 6 wins. Stop trying to drop the bar after the fact. There were more saying 8 than 5.

Don't be dishonest.

This was before Auburn and. Mizzou balled out and became top 10 teams.

And before UF proved to be a total trainwreck. You can't have it both ways.

So I see one game in which there was underachievement, the Vandy game.

So you think So Alabama should have played UT that tight? You think the 4 big losses should have been only as competitive as the mid-majors those teams played?

Remember 09? Kiffin didn't have the guns to compete with UF or Bama. But he gameplanned to keep it close. He figured out a way to frustrate not only teams with better rosters but teams with better coaches. Kiffin has since tanked... but somehow you are OK with Jones getting blown out like that and being able to do nothing at all about it?

CBJ coached that game in a very weird way, I will admit that. Considering we almost won playing that bad shows that he made a coaching error. So what? It happens.

It happened other times as well. You just don't want to face it.

Oregon was beaten by lesser rosters? Wow the fact that you said that shows a lot. It's not even worth arguing over because you're just blind.

No. I've just looked at who beat them.

OK. I'll spoon feed you again. They were beaten by Arizona. Arizona was a 4-5 Pac12 team. They came into that game off two losses with the 2nd one being to a very weak WSU team. They BLEW OREGON OUT. The next week... They were crushed by ASU.

Arizona's talent is around the Vandy level. They have less talent than UT did this past year.

You're obviously a recruiting star gazer.

Ah, so the one thing everyone is high on this staff for is based on a ranking system that cannot be trusted to correctly evaluate athletic talent? And no, not necessarily. "Stars" mean something but not everything. They are generally accurate so that you can correctly say that a group averaging high stars has talent but not a particular individual. Overall, they're accurate. But they miss individual players with some frequencey.

Every game is different. One game cannot predict the outcome of another.

Several games that all tend the same direction can be an indicator of a coach's ability though.

Look at last nights game. OU does not have anywhere near the talent that Bama has on either side of the ball. But what happened? The tide got rolled. What you cannot seem to realize is it doesn't matter how close or how competitive a game is played. Do you think people look at OUs schedule and see that they barely beat WV? Or the fact that Auburn barely beat TAMU? No. It's wins and losses and that's it. If FSU only won all of their games by 3 points and only beat Auburn by 3 points, would people be saying wow they barely won all of their games? No. They would be saying they went undefeated and won the NC.

You could not have pointed to a worse example or attempted more strained reasoning based on it.

Margins matter. They indicate competitiveness and especially when there are large margins one way or the other in multiple games. It absolutely DOES matter how competitive a game is played. What you said there is ridiculous in the extreme. By that logic, I guess you would argue that someone with a 1.5 gpa is no further from becoming a successful student than one with a 2.9, right?

According to you us being more competitive in our blow out losses would have made some kind of difference.

No. It would have SHOWN some kind of difference. It would have demonstrated the staff's ability to outcoach someone in spite of having less talent. Do you really... I mean honestly... not understand that? You really don't get that it takes a better coaching performance to keep a mismatch close than to be blown out?

It would have only made a difference to you.

I can just about bet you that it would have made a difference to MANY objective observers... not the least of which are recruits.

Like I have said before, if we would have been more competitive those losses would still have been losses.

But there would have been far more reason to believe the coaches could compete with the big boys.

The coaching staff did make some mistakes this season, but given the situation they were in and the schedule, I am proud of what they accomplished.

That.... is a truly sad statement. You have set the bar low enough that any midget can walk under it. Congratulations.

Oh and I guess beating the #11 team in the country, something Missouri or Clemson couldn't do, means nothing right?

Are you dense? How many times do I have to repeat that USCe was a good win? A thousand?

Take this as a personal message JUST TO YOU. USCe was a good win. If it had been backed up with competitiveness in other games then I'd be leading the cheerleading squad for the coaching ability of this staff. It wasn't.

They had one good win. They had one "good" loss.

They had one bad win. They had 5 bad losses if you don't count UF.

BTW, have you or would you agree that the UGA game was a good loss? Would you say that it showed something on the part of the staff? I would. If it does then your whole argument above blows up. If a loss is just a loss then it would not have mattered if UGA had blown UT out too.