Cbj

[sjt18]

Really? Any more stupid than all the people saying it would be good to lose him?

I'm ok with the reasonable posters who rightfully criticize the coach for the way the season ended up. But the ones who immediately respond with 'good riddance, take the whole staff with him' crap are idiots.

UT does not need another coaching change. That is certain.

The real "idiotic" part is that UT checked off several coaches before getting down to him on the list. That's not a knock just the truth. UT would probably go much deeper on the list if they had to do it again right now.

 

[sjt18]

Like CBJ, but with the talent coming in, we should be able to win 6-8 games and go to a bowl. Don't see any other University trying to hire him at this point. After he gets winning, then I can see other's showing interest.

Anything they do next fall will depend on how they develop, coach up, then coach players who were back ups this year. Any expectation that the '14 class will push them to new heights is just not realistic. For the most part, that would be talented players with no development and no college experience replacing seniors with more talent than many gave credit for and a ton of experience.

Six wins is still very achievable if this is the right staff. But it will be because they can coach... not because of the '14 class.

 

[Doyle Hargraves]

Really? Any more stupid than all the people saying it would be good to lose him?

I'm ok with the reasonable posters who rightfully criticize the coach for the way the season ended up. But the ones who immediately respond with 'good riddance, take the whole staff with him' crap are idiots.

I haven't seen any of these posts.
Are you sure you really have?

 

[Cartervol]

Missouri and Auburn turned out way better than anyone had anticipated. I think most thought a win would come between one of those games. Losing to Vandy just showed that this offense was a complete train wreck at times. You can't expect to beat many teams scoring 10 points.

No one is going to bother CBJ unless he does something with this program. He hasn't even got started yet. Has much to prove before his phone starts ringing with other teams coming for him. He'll be on the right track if he holds onto this top 5 class and it doesn't get cherry picked over the next few weeks. That might would be the most impressive thing i've seen so far.

 

[YorkVol]

UT does not need another coaching change. That is certain.

The real "idiotic" part is that UT checked off several coaches before getting down to him on the list. That's not a knock just the truth. UT would probably go much deeper on the list if they had to do it again right now.

Agree. The whole search process had me scratching my head. That said, I think we did OK and am looking forward to Jones' second year as his history shows year. 2 Is often much better than year 1.

 

[sjt18]

So one of the things I am reading here is Jones must win a bowl game in 2014 or he is going to be on the hot seat? Good Lord. Does nobody know what rebuilding means anymore?

Yes. We do. The better question is "Do you?"

How long do you "rebuild" before actually becoming a competitive football team?

Like it or not, rebuilding at UT is a 3 or at most 4 year project. UT cannot afford to keep a coach longer than that if they aren't making tangible progress. If he has less than six wins next fall... he will be on a hot seat and rightly so. It is just the way it has to be at UT. You keep a losing coach and recruiting will take a nosedive... setting the replacement back even further.


FTR, can you define your meaning for "rebuilding"? I think for most it would mean getting progressively better.... right?

 

[YorkVol]

I haven't seen any of these posts.
Are you sure you really have?

Well, I'm paraphrasing, but from about the 5th reply they are there. Do you want another coaching change?

 

[ainge10heisman]

I will be extremely disappointed if Coach Jones can't get us to a bowl game next season. It will be year two for the players in his system, and there should be a noticeable improvement. There is no reason in the world why we shouldn't be bowling next season. CBJ will be bringing in a great recruiting class if it stays as it is today, which will help. I don't expect many freshman to make a lot of impact on game days besides maybe a few guys in key positions. Where all the freshman will help though is on the overall roster. We will have a upgrade in talent, even though its young talent. Our freshman will make the most impact on the practice field, they will challenge the guys that have been here and will make them step up their game. Having better quality players to practice against bodes well for all UT players. We have got to go bowling to keep up the recruiting success. It will be hard to continue recruiting at a high level without improvement in the W/L column.

 

[sjt18]

Agree. The whole search process had me scratching my head. That said, I think we did OK and am looking forward to Jones' second year as his history shows year. 2 Is often much better than year 1.

People say that often but it doesn't mean anything to the current situation. The excuse has been used ad nauseum that he lost so much on O. And he did. But now he does again... all five starting OL's and his best offensive player (statistically). He also loses most of his experienced talent on the DL and alot of experience at LB.

But the biggest thing is that he's not in the MAC or Big East anymore. The competition level simply is not comparable. I would love to expect more but honestly believe that six wins in '14 will take as good of a coaching job as 7 would have in '13.... and I honestly think he needs six wins to avoid all kinds of negative pressure and recruiting headed into '15.

 

[Cartervol]

He'd probably have to miss a bowl game in year 3 to not get a year 4.

 

[sjt18]

He'd probably have to miss a bowl game in year 3 to not get a year 4.

If so, his replacement will be in a hole roster wise... again.

 

[Cartervol]

If so, his replacement will be in a hole roster wise... again.

He'd have to have the same results as Dooley. If his recruiting class falls apart next year and isn't in the top ten. If he doesn't make a Bowl in year 3. Then it's possible they move in a different direction. I'd say it would take that to make it a possibility.

 

[Other_Guy]

If you're not sold on CBJ that's fine-I don't think really you can say anything-but think about this...

What exactly could he have done better or his staff? Let's really think about it.
-Beating Vandy? Sure, but I think beating SCjr evens out.
-Recruting an A+ of course.
-I think they've done a good job with the QBs growing by simplifing the gamplan. Throwing Peterman into the Florida game maybe not such a good idea, but everyone wanted it didn't they?
-Off the field has been good.

He's done what we could expect, a little more maybe. If he does what we expect NEXT year then we will be sitting good in 2016.

 

[Other_Guy]

I will be extremely disappointed if Coach Jones can't get us to a bowl game next season. It will be year two for the players in his system, and there should be a noticeable improvement. There is no reason in the world why we shouldn't be bowling next season. CBJ will be bringing in a great recruiting class if it stays as it is today, which will help. I don't expect many freshman to make a lot of impact on game days besides maybe a few guys in key positions. Where all the freshman will help though is on the overall roster. We will have a upgrade in talent, even though its young talent. Our freshman will make the most impact on the practice field, they will challenge the guys that have been here and will make them step up their game. Having better quality players to practice against bodes well for all UT players. We have got to go bowling to keep up the recruiting success. It will be hard to continue recruiting at a high level without improvement in the W/L column.

Oklahoma, possible bad QB play and a brand new OL would like to differ.

 

[xfactorutk]

Wait, do y'all even like Coach Jones? I really can't tell.

I was just asking as a joke. I do like Coach Jones, but I understand it's a business. I think he will get us where we want to be, or at least close. But I also think speculating about his job might be a little premature. The jury is still out for me. I'm waiting until next year is over and there is another recruiting class on its way. I'm not one to jump the gun. Not saying anybody on here is.

 

[GrowVol]

Next year's schedule has 3 built in "should definitely wins" with 4 more "probable" to "toss up" games.

If this staff is worth a flip, they will get 6. If not, somebody's seat (perhaps assistant) will literally be on fire. I listed UGA & SC as 'L' because those were close games and we lose home field advantage. Florida sucks worse than we do right now, but they'll probably still win.

vs Utah State - ?
vs Arkansas State - W
@ Oklahoma - L
@ Georgia - L
vs Florida - ?
vs Chattanooga - W
@ Ole Miss - ?
vs Alabama - L
@ South Carolina - L
vs Kentucky - W
vs Missouri - L
@ Vanderbilt - ?

Aaron Murray-gone
Conner Shaw-gone

 

[GrowVol]

Anything they do next fall will depend on how they develop, coach up, then coach players who were back ups this year. Any expectation that the '14 class will push them to new heights is just not realistic. For the most part, that would be talented players with no development and no college experience replacing seniors with more talent than many gave credit for and a ton of experience.

Six wins is still very achievable if this is the right staff. But it will be because they can coach... not because of the '14 class.

Exactly! 6 wins regardless should be the expectation this season, or its on the coaching staff.

 

[YorkVol]

People say that often but it doesn't mean anything to the current situation. The excuse has been used ad nauseum that he lost so much on O. And he did. But now he does again... all five starting OL's and his best offensive player (statistically). He also loses most of his experienced talent on the DL and alot of experience at LB.

But the biggest thing is that he's not in the MAC or Big East anymore. The competition level simply is not comparable. I would love to expect more but honestly believe that six wins in '14 will take as good of a coaching job as 7 would have in '13.... and I honestly think he needs six wins to avoid all kinds of negative pressure and recruiting headed into '15.

No excuses. Plus, I think he kept some key players out to preserve them for '14 and give himself a core to build around.

you lost me with the MAC/BE comment. You succeed at whatever level you compete and you are being successful. His past successes weren't a fluke. He needs to replicate it next year, certainly, but you can't discount it.

 

[Other_Guy]

Aaron Murray-gone
Conner Shaw-gone

Georgia will be fine. SCjr will be lucky to win 8 gamrs.

 

[Wylo]

Georgia will be fine. SCjr will be lucky to win 8 gamrs.

keep dreaming.. USCe will win 7-8 games, easily. Spurrier will not use that as an excuse like many of you do.

He will have a qb ready and a gameplan to contend.

 

[ainge10heisman]

Oklahoma, possible bad QB play and a brand new OL would like to differ.

Good thing our old line wasn't that great to begin with anyways huh? You never know what you are going to get with OU, they are more than capable of laying a big egg in any game.

 

[Wylo]

No excuses. Plus, I think he kept some key players out to preserve them for '14 and give himself a core to build around.

you lost me with the MAC/BE comment. You succeed at whatever level you compete and you are being successful. His past successes weren't a fluke. He needs to replicate it next year, certainly, but you can't discount it.

How many of those junior championships did he win outright? how many times did he own the tiebreaker and get the big bowl? how many times did he go undefeated?

Not many or zero are the answers. If he can't blow away those crappy conferences, how do you expect him to battle for titles at UT?

 

[jkleno]

Ridiculous or not, Jones is 0-2 right now on things that really would have boosted his chances of making it past year 3 or 4.

It isn't fair so you can call it "ridiculous" if you want. But he needed a better recruiting class than he got in '13. He needed a top shelf RB and didn't get it. Again, not fair. Dooley set him up to fail. But "fair" doesn't pay the light bill. He has to win regardless. A great '13 class would have helped tremendously.

Second, he needed to prove he was an SEC level coach with an SEC level staff this season. On the whole, they didn't do that. Seven would have been a statement. Six would have gotten a pass. Five was underachievement. A six or 7 win season could be spun to gain credibility. You just can't do that with 7 losses and some historically bad statistical performances.

There is no leeway to give. Coaches who survive have some success early. Sometimes it is nothing more than one win over the previous year. Sometimes it is better than that. Starting out by posting the same kind of season both statistically and in wins as the guy who just got fired... simply does not scream "I'm the guy to save the program".

It isn't really true that most first years are tough. Spurrier improved UF and USCe in his first year. Richt did. Saban improved Bama by one win and LSU by more than that. Sumlin doubled the win total. I think Freeze did as well. Mullin made an immediate impact. Meyer did. Malzahn did as well. Franklin did.

If you look at the guys who either tread water or win less... it isn't good... Dooley, Muschamp, Croom, Sherman, Zook,...

1) I don't think it is fair to compare CBJ to what the aforementioned coaches inherited. Malzahn inherited a team loaded with consecutive top 10 classes- one even a top 5.
2) Schedule- if CBJ played a "normal" SEC schedule and cupcake non conference games, like Saban did in his 1st year, the record would be better.
* I respect your opinion, but CBJ did about all that we could ask for except the team's performance against Vandy.

 

[NashVOL93]

His first year at UT is now part of his track record. It was a subpar performance and underachievement of the talent on the roster.

So was his 4-8 year at Cincy a subpar performance and underachievement of the talent on the roster, as well? What about the subsequent 10-win seasons? You gonna give him credit for those, too? Was that an OVER-achievement? Is he a chronic underperformer or overperformer? Make up your mind.

No. If you look at the record you will find that he succeeded in two conferences with nowhere near the level of competition he will face in the SEC. The combined records of the teams he faced at Cincy was around 40% wins. He won't see that at UT.

This means literally nothing. Where else would you have had him start? By this reasoning, Chris Petersen and Charlie Strong are doomed to fail at their next jobs because they had the nerve to win a lot of games at their old crappy low-level jobs. It's football. Someone has to win and someone has to lose. Jones won fair and square against comparable competition at Cincy and CMU. What more would you have had him do?

Mentioned... not called apparently. The O was not worse than the D. The D was the second worse scoring D (behind Sunseri's disaster) in at least 70 years. This was NOT the worst D talent UT has had during that period. It was the first time since the 1920's that UT was beaten by 4 opponents by a margin of 28+ pts.

You have zero proof of them not being called. So much for fact-based posting. As for the defense, since you apparently may not have noticed, the SEC is becoming an offensive league. Georgia hung 44 points on LSU...then only 34 on UT. Vandy hung 31 on Georgia and 34 on Florida...and only 14 on UT. South Carolina scored 31 on Clemson...and only 21 on UT. Our problem wasn't the defense was bad, it was that the offense was worse. Like 2012, but the opposite.

The only body of work that counts anymore is what they do and have done at UT.

Yeah, okay. Saban's 2003 National Championship was worthless after he went 6-6 with a disastrous home loss to ULM his first year at Alabama, then, right? He just backed into that NC, didn't he? No way that could have been because he knew what he was doing.

Tell you what. Take a job that challenges your skill level then anytime anyone points to a failure or shortcoming... direct them back to the resume you used to get the job. That should work well for you.

Do you not understand the irony of this? So few jobs are so easily quantified as coaching is...yet so few jobs depend on so much more than just the W-L record as coaching does. I wouldn't ordinarily point to my past resume as a rationalization for underperformance...but I WOULD if that resume showed a consistent history of initial struggle followed by subsequent over-performance...you know, like Jones' does.

It would if he had not lost to the worst UF team in decades, needed a last minute INT to beat USA, lost to Vandy, and lost 4 games by blowout. Against that backdrop... the win against Spurrier is the exception... not a rule.

UF wasn't nearly the same team when we played them. I don't like losing to them either, but that's a fact. It's like saying the Auburn team about to play for all the marbles was the same one that struggled with Washington State early in the season. We beat USA...with a defensive performance, I might add. Win is a win. Vandy was unfortunate and I do agree that game should not have been a loss. That being said, if Worley doesn't get injured, we probably win. Again, South Carolina counts as a win just as much as Vanderbilt counts as a loss. He's already done something Dooley never could.

 

[sjt18]

If you're not sold on CBJ that's fine-I don't think really you can say anything-but think about this...

What exactly could he have done better or his staff? Let's really think about it.
-Beating Vandy? Sure, but I think beating SCjr evens out.

No it doesn't. That's inconsistency. You make that a rule... and he's never better than a .500 coach. Wins don't cancel out losses and even if it did... he still lost to a terrible UF team, was blown out 4 times, and almost lost to USA.

-Recruting an A+ of course.

Based on recruiting sites... right? The same one's who called McNeil, Coleman, J Smith, McCullers, Miller, Walls, 4 of 5 OL's, Neal, Lane, Croom, Bowles, etc blue chip prospects? You know... the guys who folks here say have no talent now.

-I think they've done a good job with the QBs growing by simplifing the gamplan. Throwing Peterman into the Florida game maybe not such a good idea, but everyone wanted it didn't they?

So a coach should make decisions based on public opinion? That'll work well.....

He's done what we could expect, a little more maybe. If he does what we expect NEXT year then we will be sitting good in 2016.

No. He has NOT done what we "could" expect. He has done significantly less than what we "could" expect and less than what we should have been able to reasonably expect.