Coach Franklin Please explain the love for this guy

[WallyBalls]

People assume that because Vandy has been so historically awful that Franklin has the Midas touch -- winning a single game was seen as accomplishment for them. However, what folks haven't taken into account is that: (1) Vandy started scheduling cupcake games and much weaker OOC games than they used to and that scheduling happens to coincide with their 'turnaround' under Franklin (2) Franklin is a decent enough coach to take advantage of teams that are traditional SEC powerhouses being down and/or injury ravished.

IOW, Vanderbilt's brand/reputation is terrible enough to make Franklin (or anyone, for that matter) look like a genius if he wins more than 2 games a year regardless of how those wins came about.

I would add that Bobby Johnson doesn't get near the credit he deserves for scrubbing the Vanderbilt program of some of its faults.

I realize his final year and the Robbie Caldwell year were bad, but he had proven you could win at Vanderbilt (and stocked them full of redshirts).

 

[OrangeBalls]

So after Franklin came along, Vandy finally got it right and started beating crap teams they had trouble beating previously.

Thanks for the validation.

No, Steve Sloan, George MacIntyre got it right some along with Bobby Johnson. There goes those pesky facts again. Frank has had the schedule fall almost perfect for him for the last 2 seasons in catching Auburn when they're down and UT while they're at their lowest point ever. Then they get Ole Miss as their common West opponent. The only West team to have never made it to the SECCG. Couple that with playing UGA and Fla when their teams were a MASH unit and he has had some hellacious good fortune. Only a dimbulb can't/won't look further into who they are playing than just an 8-4 record.

 

[bamawriter]

No, Steve Sloan, George MacIntyre got it right some along with Bobby Johnson. There goes those pesky facts again. Frank has had the schedule fall almost perfect for him for the last 2 seasons in catching Auburn when they're down and UT while they're at their lowest point ever. Couple that with playing UGA and Fla when their teams were a MASH unit and he has had some hellacious good fortune. Only a dimbulb can't/won't look further into who they are playing than just an 8-4 record.

MacIntyre, with his impressive winning percentage of 32%? Johnson with his 31%?

You're giving them each credit for one good season (by Vandy's standards), but not giving Franklin credit for 3?

 

[OrangeBalls]

MacIntyre, with his impressive winning percentage of 32%?

He went 8-4 in 1982 and a bowl game. That wasn't done again until 2008 under Johnson. There also weren't but 11 games back then and not the extra cupcake that Frank gets.

 

[OrangeBalls]

No friend, taking Vanderbilt to three straight bowl games and winning 9 games isn't enough because Vandy's competition isn't very good.

Vandy needs better competition. lol:

Or maybe they need to beat some better teams besides a 7-6 Ole Miss, a 7-6 NC State and a 8-4 UGA team that was a MASH unit. Those are his best wins. LMAO.

 

[bamawriter]

He went 8-4 in 1982 and a bowl game. That wasn't done again until 2008 under Johnson. There also weren't but 11 games back then and not the extra cupcake that Frank gets.

Or maybe they need to beat some better teams besides a 7-6 Ole Miss, a 7-6 NC State and a 8-4 UGA team that was a MASH unit. Those are his best wins. LMAO.

So you are giving Macintyre a big pat on the back for the following wins?

1-10 Memphis
4-7 Tulane
4-7 Ole Miss
0-10-1 Kentucky
7-4 Virginia Tech (the Hokies were essentially a I-AA team at this point)
7-4 UTC (the Mocs have always been I-AA)

The only winning teams that Vandy beat who weren't I-AA were 8-4 Florida and 6-5-1 Tennessee.

That deserves more credit than Franklin's last 3 years?

 

[OrangeBalls]

So you are giving Macintyre a big pat on the back for the following wins?

1-10 Memphis
4-7 Tulane
4-7 Ole Miss
0-10-1 Kentucky
7-4 Virginia Tech (the Hokies were essentially a I-AA team at this point)
7-4 UTC (the Mocs have always been I-AA)

The only winning teams that Vandy beat who weren't I-AA were 8-4 Florida and 6-5-1 Tennessee.

That deserves more credit than Franklin's last 3 years?

No, I'm saying Frank is doing what has already been done a few times by some other Vandy coaches. You and Lawrence seem to want to put him up on some pedestal because of what he's done the last 2 years. His first year he went 6-7. He would've never made a bowl game back then with a 6-6 record.

He's done well for a Vandy coach. I'm not denying that. I'm just saying he hasn't really beaten anyone worth a damn in 3 years. He beat UGA without Gurley and a number of their better players. That's their best win in his entire tenure. His only other wins against a team with a winning record is a 7-6 Ole Miss and 7-6 NC State. Sorry, I'm not as easily impressed as you seem to be.

And if you honestly think he would've beaten a UT or Fla if they had the rosters stocked like they did in the 90's then we'll completely agree to disagree. He's had the fortune of a patsy schedule and the SEC East heavyweights being down. He never would've beaten UGA, UT or Fla unless they were rebuilding or crippled with injuries.

 

[Boca Vol]

No, Steve Sloan, George MacIntyre got it right some along with Bobby Johnson. There goes those pesky facts again. Frank has had the schedule fall almost perfect for him for the last 2 seasons in catching Auburn when they're down and UT while they're at their lowest point ever. Then they get Ole Miss as their common West opponent. The only West team to have never made it to the SECCG. Couple that with playing UGA and Fla when their teams were a MASH unit and he has had some hellacious good fortune. Only a dimbulb can't/won't look further into who they are playing than just an 8-4 record.

What does this have to do with 2012-13? UT has been to 5 SECCG's, UF has been to 10, and UGA has been to 5 and Vandy beat all 3 this year.

Yes, there were other circumstances as you mentioned but using Ole Miss' history isn't really relevant in this case.

 

[GoDucks349]

Trust me, your issues with UF's OOC schedule has nothing to do with you getting worked over in this thread. lol:

So...in your opinion...Franklin needs to leave Vandy, where he's only the second coach in the program's history to win 9 games, go to another program, have a couple 10-win seasons, before you deem him worthy of running a major FBS program.

Larry AGAIN NO I didn't say he needs to leave Vandy. Where did you get that idea? If he's that good he can do it at Vandy. Any school can turn their football program around.

 

[Lawrence Wright]

Larry AGAIN NO I didn't say he needs to leave Vandy. Where did you get that idea? If he's that good he can do it at Vandy. Any school can turn their football program around.

I got the idea from this post of yours....

I never said he had to do it at Vandy. He can do it at any BCS school.

:whistling: :thumbsup: :lolabove: lol:

 

[Lawrence Wright]

Or maybe they need to beat some better teams besides a 7-6 Ole Miss, a 7-6 NC State and a 8-4 UGA team that was a MASH unit. Those are his best wins. LMAO.

LMAO at debating which of Vandy's eight wins were quality wins, given their history.

 

[OrangeBalls]

What does this have to do with 2012-13? UT has been to 5 SECCG's, UF has been to 10, and UGA has been to 5 and Vandy beat all 3 this year.

Yes, there were other circumstances as you mentioned but using Ole Miss' history isn't really relevant in this case.

It has everything to do with 2012-13. So, you think playing Ole Miss every single year is akin to playing Bama? Hell, I'd love that schedule trade. Ole Miss is an average program historically. Bama is one of the top, if not the top, programs of all time. Which is the easier route to padding the W column? Freeze has gotten Ole Miss more competitive lately, but Bama is by far the tougher team year in and year out. I think I'd take my chances against Ole Miss every year as my common West opponent rather than a Bama, LSU or Auburn. There is a reason Ole Miss, Vandy and Ky have never been to Atlanta for a SECCG. It's because they usually suck and are average to barely above average in their best years.

 

[Dragon18]

LMAO at debating which of Vandy's eight wins were quality wins, given their history.

I'm with you on this LW. People don't need to like him, I don't like him, but 8 wins is 8 wins. Especially at a perennial cellar dweller like Vandy has been and will be again soon.

 

[Lawrence Wright]

It has everything to do with 2012-13. So, you think playing Ole Miss every single year is akin to playing Bama? Hell, I'd love that schedule trade. Ole Miss is an average program historically. Bama is one of the top, if not the top, programs of all time. Which is the easier route to padding the W column? Freeze has gotten Ole Miss more competitive lately, but Bama is by far the tougher team year in and year out. I think I'd take my chances against Ole Miss every year as my common West opponent rather than a Bama, LSU or Auburn. There is a reason Ole Miss, Vandy and Ky have never been to Atlanta for a SECCG. It's because they usually suck and are average to barely above average in their best years.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that playing Ole Miss is the same as playing Alabama, or that Vandy has a tougher West schedule than Tennessee.

I'm comparing Vandy under Franklin versus Vandy prior to Franklin's arrival, in an attempt to help the OP understand why Franklin "gets so much love", only he doesn't want to understand.

Using your Ole Miss example, Vandy trails the all-time series against Ole Miss by nine games, and that's after Vandy won the first NINETEEN games from 1894-1928.

Since then, Vandy's had the following losing/winless streaks against Ole Miss:
19 games (0-17-2) from 1952-1973
6 games from 1975-1980
6 games from 1985-1990
6 games from 1993-1998
5 games from 2000-2004

Conversely, since 1928 Vandy's longest winning streak against Ole Miss is THREE games, and its only happened twice....from 1949-1951 and 2010-2012.

Ole Miss owns Vandy, like many other SEC schools. But playing Vandy under Frankin is anything but the automatic "W" it used to be.

 

[Volrog]

Winning 8/9 games at Vandy is an accomplishment, but let's be serious here for a minute. Franklin has 23 wins in 3 seasons, but only 4 of them have come against teams that went/will go to a bowl game. The teams he beat have had average records of 3.8 wins and 8.2 losses. His signature win to date is an 8 win Georgia team, period.

 

[bamawriter]

Winning 8/9 games at Vandy is an accomplishment, but let's be serious here for a minute. Franklin has 23 wins in 3 seasons, but only 4 of them have come against teams that went/will go to a bowl game. The teams he beat have had average records of 3.8 wins and 8.2 losses. His signature win to date is an 8 win Georgia team, period.

How did previous Vandy coaches do against similar opposition?

 

[Lawrence Wright]

How did previous Vandy coaches do against similar opposition?

It's like they're trying on purpose not to get it.

UGA's worst season in the past 25 years was 1990 when they went 4-7. UGA beat Vanderbilt by double digits that year.

 

[bamawriter]

It's like they're trying on purpose not to get it.

UGA's worst season in the past 25 years was 4-7 back in 1990. They beat Vanderbilt by double digits that year.

It's like watching the greatest wheelchair basketball player ever, then crapping on his accomplishments because he's never dunked.

 

[utvolCO]

It's like they're trying on purpose not to get it.

UGA's worst season in the past 25 years was 1990 when they went 4-7. UGA beat Vanderbilt by double digits that year.

LW you seem to have done research on Vandy's stats. Has their schedule been easier than normal in recent years(under Franklin)? I want to say for some reason that Vandy generally had a tough schedule.

I could be wrong though. That has really been the only reason I have questioned whether he is ready for the big time. Not saying he is not a good coach.

 

[Volrog]

It's like they're trying on purpose not to get it.

UGA's worst season in the past 25 years was 1990 when they went 4-7. UGA beat Vanderbilt by double digits that year.

You're right, I just don't get it. If you think that Vandy hasn't softened their OOC schedule and admissions for him you are mistaken. He's done a good job and he'll get a better job, but I contend he caught the SEC east at the right time while avoiding the best of the SEC west. He better get out while he can because he's taken Vandy about as far as it can go.

 

[utvolpj]

It's like they're trying on purpose not to get it.

UGA's worst season in the past 25 years was 1990 when they went 4-7. UGA beat Vanderbilt by double digits that year.

and the 3 UT/Vandy games from 95-97 were all decided by a TD or less. What are we proving here?

 

[Lawrence Wright]

LW you seem to have done research on Vandy's stats. Has their schedule been easier than normal in recent years(under Franklin)? I want to say for some reason that Vandy generally had a tough schedule.

I could be wrong though. That has really been the only reason I have questioned whether he is ready for the big time. Not saying he is not a good coach.

I spent all of ten minutes on cfbdatawarehouse.com looking up Vandy's all-time record against Ole Miss, and since several people here were critical of Franklin's biggest win being a banged up 8-4 UGA squad, I checked to see how UGA's worst team in recent memory did against Vanderbilt that particular season.

If anyone wants to argue Vandy plays an extra game, and therefore has another opportunity to log a win, I'm okay with that. But you also have to admit there were many years Vandy could have played 20 regular season games, and would have struggled to win six games playing against 20 bottom feeders.

The "SEC East is down" argument doesn't fly with me either. Florida and Tennessee are down. Missouri and South Carolina are both Top 10 teams, like we used to be. That's a wash as far as I'm concerned. UGA at 8-4 is about right going back to the start of divisional play. Kentucky is now what Vandy used to be. Vandy has improved.

 

[Lawrence Wright]

and the 3 UT/Vandy games from 95-97 were all decided by a TD or less. What are we proving here?

Vandy almost beat us in 96. We usually played them the week after UGA, and we didn't get juiced to play them.

Fred Vinson and Corey Chavous locked down Reidel Anthony and Ike Hilliard like no one I've ever seen.

 

[GoDucks349]

I got the idea from this post of yours....



:whistling: :thumbsup: :lolabove: lol:

Perhaps you didn't understand what "ANY" means. As in ANY BCS school. I consider Vandy a BCS school of course if you are saying not all schools in the SEC are BCS schools that's up to you.

You think Franklin is such a great coach, do you think he'd have won 8 games this year if he'd been head coach at Florida?

 

[Sandvol]

It has everything to do with 2012-13. So, you think playing Ole Miss every single year is akin to playing Bama? Hell, I'd love that schedule trade. Ole Miss is an average program historically. Bama is one of the top, if not the top, programs of all time. Which is the easier route to padding the W column? Freeze has gotten Ole Miss more competitive lately, but Bama is by far the tougher team year in and year out. I think I'd take my chances against Ole Miss every year as my common West opponent rather than a Bama, LSU or Auburn. There is a reason Ole Miss, Vandy and Ky have never been to Atlanta for a SECCG. It's because they usually suck and are average to barely above average in their best years.

Yes, but Vanderbilt does play us every year and they're kicking our arse.