Different camera angle on Pig Fumble. MUST SEE!

[UT_Tix79]

Coach Butch Jones " I'm sick for Alton because he's a great kid, he played his tail off, this team played their tails off, and we came up 1 yard short. That fumble hurt me, it hurt me for Alton, it hurt me for this team because they gave it everything they had. We teach ball security everyday here, that's one of our maxims, but he was trying to make a play, he was trying to win us the game, and the ball just slipped out. I'll never fault a player for giving his all for Tennessee, sometimes, bad things happen, we'll learn from this, and will emerge stronger for this. Alton did nothing wrong, what a great play, he just came up 1/2-1yard short."

But, again, he's wrong also I'm sure. And he has watched it on their own camera's, the CBS game film, and more angles than anyone else has....

 

[Vols520]

I never visit other teams boards. Yes it was clearly a fumble! The question is when the fumble happened. If the ball breaks the plane then the fumble doesn't matter. It is a TD!

If that's a td then I got some ocean front property to sell you in Nebraska. I'll cut u a nice deal.

 

[volatil]

The clear replays on tv not some gif were clear as day . It was obvious .

I have seen a lot of dumb things on volnation but this thread takes the cake .

It's why I stay out of the ff usually.

I was at the game. Haven't seen those replays.

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

The people calling it a dumb rule are the best.

It is obviously a fumble. This is the only site it's being debated.

I am sure the posters who are arguing we got screwed are the same posters who make fun of other teams boards for having meltdowns after a loss.

Yes a fumble not recovered by the opposing team, that automatically gives said team possession simply because the fumble occurred in the end zone is a good rule. If you really believe that's a good rule then I don't know what to tell you.

It's a dumb rule in the NFL and its a dumb rule in the NCAA. If the opposing team recovers the fumble in the end zone, they get possession. No problems.

 

[Vols520]

I was at the game. Haven't seen those replays.

I respect the passion of those of u arguing, however, it wasn't even close .

Those watching on tv knew after first replay we were doomed. I actually turned off the tv and hoped I would wake up to goood news.

 

[Vols520]

Yes a fumble not recovered by the opposing team, that automatically gives said team possession simply because the fumble occurred in the end zone is a good rule. If you really believe that's a good rule then I don't know what to tell you.

It's a dumb rule in the NFL and its a dumb rule in the NCAA. If the opposing team recovers the fumble in the end zone, they get possession. No problems.

It's a fantastic rule to prevent teams from intentionally trying to fumble the ball forward.

Just because it hurt TN doesn't mean it's. A bad rule.

 

[volinSmyrna]

Having contact with the ball does not equal having control of the ball. The ball does not "separate" from his hand until crossing goalline, but he does not have control it at that point. Couldn't have said it better than CBJ did...you feel terrible for Pig because he was just trying to make a play.

 

[Vols520]

Having contact with the ball does not equal having control of the ball. The ball does not "separate" from his hand until crossing goalline, but he does not have control it at that point. Couldn't have said it better than CBJ did...you feel terrible for Pig because he was just trying to make a play.

Great post.

 

[American Pig]

American Pig, you're wrong. I'm sorry, restating the same thing over and over does not make you right. In fact, it makes you look crazy.

Your pride-fueled hot air is not evidence. I'm looking at the EVIDENCE. The EVIDENCE shows a ball in hand at plane of goal.

Until you can provide EVIDENCE that the ball is out prior to touching plane you have no basis for your claim.
Blustering is not evidence.
Explain what basis in evidence exists that the ball is separated from Pig's hand BEFORE reaching the plane.

Explain what indisputable evidence exists that fingers and thumb on ball at plane = loss of possession?

That's a touchdown people. Overturning that score is an outrage.

[/QUOTE][/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

 

[Vols520]

Your pride-fueled hot air is not evidence. I'm looking at the EVIDENCE. The EVIDENCE shows a ball in hand at plane of goal.

Until you can provide EVIDENCE that the ball is out prior to touching plane you have no basis for your claim.
Blustering is not evidence.
Explain what basis in evidence exists that the ball is separated from Pig's hand BEFORE reaching the plane.

Explain what indisputable evidence exists that fingers and thumb on ball at plane = loss of possession?

[/QUOTE][/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

This guy is awesome.

 

[American Pig]

Having contact with the ball does not equal having control of the ball. The ball does not "separate" from his hand until crossing goalline, but he does not have control it at that point. Couldn't have said it better than CBJ did...you feel terrible for Pig because he was just trying to make a play.

What basis do you have for claiming fingers and thumb on ball at goal plane = indisputable evidence of loss of control?

It's like you guys are making excuses for an indefensible ruling. Surreal.

 

[Vols520]

Your pride-fueled hot air is not evidence. I'm looking at the EVIDENCE. The EVIDENCE shows a ball in hand at plane of goal.

Until you can provide EVIDENCE that the ball is out prior to touching plane you have no basis for your claim.
Blustering is not evidence.
Explain what basis in evidence exists that the ball is separated from Pig's hand BEFORE reaching the plane.

Explain what indisputable evidence exists that fingers and thumb on ball at plane = loss of possession?

[/QUOTE][/QUOTE][/QUOTE]


It's so obvious he doesn't have control it's ridiculous to argue becuse u have established such an insane position.

Good luck to u in life.

 

[majic73]

watching this end zone video ..it is without a doubt that Pig had 100% control and possession until his right arm was 1 to 2 inches from the pylon .

Looking at the original sideline video after knowing this ..should lead you to the point that the ball was well over the goal line as demonstrated when you review both videos and compare the timing and the landmarks . There is no dispute in this at this point , however the goal line footage was not available when the decision was made.

 

[Vols520]

watching this end zone video ..it is without a doubt that Pig had 100% control and possession until his right arm was 1 to 2 inches from the pylon .

Looking at the original sideline video after knowing this ..should lead you to the point that the ball was well over the goal line as demonstrated when you review both videos and compare the timing and the landmarks . There is no dispute in this at this point , however the goal line footage was not available when the decision was made.

Is this other video available outside of Facebook?

 

[American Pig]

It's so obvious he doesn't have control it's ridiculous to argue becuse u have established such an insane position.

Really, then where is your evidence? Explain exactly what basis in evidence exists that a thumb and fingers on ball turning it at plane = loss of possession? You can't.

Your posturing is not evidence. Facts Matter.

 

[volinSmyrna]

What basis do you have for claiming fingers and thumb on ball at goal plane = indisputable evidence of loss of control?

It's like you guys are making excuses for an indefensible ruling. Surreal.

The ball is clearly moving before he gets to the goalline. That is the main thing that replay looks at in determining fumbles/loss of control....where does it start to move? It is no different than a RB in a pile and somebody clubs the ball out. There is a brief time that the RB is still in contact with the ball, but doesn't have "CONTROL" because it is moving and on the way out....still a fumble.

I'm not making excuses...it was the right call. I wish like heck that it wouldn't have been overturned. My stomach wouldn't have been in such knot the last 24 hours.

 

[majic73]

Really, then where is your evidence? Explain exactly what basis in evidence exists that a thumb and fingers on ball turning it at plane = loss of possession? You can't.

Your posturing is not evidence. Facts Matter.

to support your point , when you watch the new endzone footage and compare it to the original sideline footage...you can see that pig clearly had control of the ball as he wrist rotate inward and down . On the sideline footage ..it looks as though his wrist went forward and the ball was coming out .

This is not the case when this new footage is viewed in conjunction with the sideline film.
His entire hand with football was into the endzone when he lost control .

 

[Vols520]

to support your point , when you watch the new endzone footage and compare it to the original sideline footage...you can see that pig clearly had control of the ball as he wrist rotate inward and down . On the sideline footage ..it looks as though his wrist went forward and the ball was coming out .

This is not the case when this new footage is viewed in conjunction with the sideline film.
His entire hand with football was into the endzone when he lost control .

Is this avail outside of fb?

 

[Bryan1]

to support your point , when you watch the new endzone footage and compare it to the original sideline footage...you can see that pig clearly had control of the ball as he wrist rotate inward and down . On the sideline footage ..it looks as though his wrist went forward and the ball was coming out .

This is not the case when this new footage is viewed in conjunction with the sideline film.
His entire hand with football was into the endzone when he lost control .

Cant tell these people that. No use, I've tried!

 

[majic73]

The ball is clearly moving before he gets to the goalline. That is the main thing that replay looks at in determining fumbles/loss of control....where does it start to move? It is no different than a RB in a pile and somebody clubs the ball out. There is a brief time that the RB is still in contact with the ball, but doesn't have "CONTROL" because it is moving and on the way out....still a fumble.

I'm not making excuses...it was the right call. I wish like heck that it wouldn't have been overturned. My stomach wouldn't have been in such knot the last 24 hours.

Must disagree. If you watch the endzone footage ...he looses control when his right side is 1-2 inches from the pylon . Now watch the original footage from the sideline..the ball is well over the goal line at that point.

The original footage creatws an illusion the way his wrist seems to fall down and forward as if the ball is leaving his hand. Watching the new video and syncing to the old ...you will clearly see that the ball is not falling out at this point. His wrist and hand are rotating inward and down and the ball is under his control and clenched between fingers and thumb .

BTW ..I am in Smyrna and have been by whole life.

 

[majic73]

Is this avail outside of fb?

not sure Vol520..but you dont have to log into FB to view it. Just click on the link provided by the OP.

 

[cpavol]

It's a fantastic rule to prevent teams from intentionally trying to fumble the ball forward.

Just because it hurt TN doesn't mean it's. A bad rule.

The rule is inconsistent with the rule for a fumble that goes out of bounds beyond the point of the fumble. The ball is spotted at the point of the fumble for the team with the ball. It's a bad rule.

 

[Orange Blazer]

I was at the game. It was a fumble, it sux but it is what it is. GBO

Does being at the game make you more credible?

 

[volnomnom]

Must disagree. If you watch the endzone footage ...he looses control when his right side is 1-2 inches from the pylon . Now watch the original footage from the sideline..the ball is well over the goal line at that point.

The original footage creatws an illusion the way his wrist seems to fall down and forward as if the ball is leaving his hand. Watching the new video and syncing to the old ...you will clearly see that the ball is not falling out at this point. His wrist and hand are rotating inward and down and the ball is under his control and clenched between fingers and thumb .

BTW ..I am in Smyrna and have been by whole life.

Yup, I agree with you completely, this was a touchdown. It does really really suck that this was a blown call. And after all the team and fans have been through the past 5 years or so it would have been so incredible to pull out a W, but it is probably time that we get over it. I'm sure that it's been driving you crazy, and me too. But either way we can't do anything about it. The future is looking bright GBO!

 

[WesternKyVol]

Inconclusive.