Electric Vehicles

[hog88]

no thoughts to this. Just inexcusable. Gonna wreck the nation.
but hey, cast your vote knowing this.

Biden voters can just go to the local supermarket for their food, they don't need truckers.

 

[hndog609]

Alkali metals (at the left end of the Periodic Table) are extremely reactive. Lithium, for example, is combustible in air, and pure lithium is kept covered to prevent combustion. It also reacts violently to water, so you wonder why fire departments are using water on EV fires in the first place.

Sodium instead of lithium but yeah, lively stuff.

 

[NorthDallas40]

We're talking about early adopters. Research could likely show that 50-110 years ago early adopters of combustion engine vehics and cell phones experienced levels of questions and frustrations (few filling stations on "Route 66" required planning ahead ; usage costs of early mobile tech was Very high, etc). I suspect early adopters of desktop computers wished for greater storage capacity --

improvements and greater Peace of Mind came along with time (more filling stations ; decrease in mobile calling costs ; 7.25" discs > 5.5" > thumb drives >> terabytes for pennies or few dollars, etc).

(Dallas40 thinks I'm marketing ev's, with some agenda -- I'm simply discussing the tech and watching the progression / I'm happy with my combustion engine also).

You are marketing the vehicles like a freaking EV dealership salesman trying to make his numbers for the month. It’s obvious to everyone. At this point I’d guess you’re trying to convince yourself more than anyone else Ronald.

 

[NorthDallas40]

Sodium instead of lithium but yeah, lively stuff.

I think pretty much every element in that family is looking for any reason to react and oxygen winds up being a happy participant in so many cases.

 

[KB5252]

We're talking about early adopters. Research could likely show that 50-110 years ago early adopters of combustion engine vehics and cell phones experienced levels of questions and frustrations (few filling stations on "Route 66" required planning ahead ; usage costs of early mobile tech was Very high, etc). I suspect early adopters of desktop computers wished for greater storage capacity --

improvements and greater Peace of Mind came along with time (more filling stations ; decrease in mobile calling costs ; 7.25" discs > 5.5" > thumb drives >> terabytes for pennies or few dollars, etc).

(Dallas40 thinks I'm marketing ev's, with some agenda -- I'm simply discussing the tech and watching the progression / I'm happy with my combustion engine also).

I'm not completely opposed to the idea. I just think we are putting the cart before the horse. We are nowhere near where we need to be to sustain the grid needed to support these vehicles, they are as of right now not as dependable or safe in specific and important aspects.

It seems we've taken the strategy of jumping into the deep end instead of wading carefully into pool. These mandates just seem crazy and unrealistic in implementation and scope.

 

[kiddiedoc]

Since I've been dragged into a fight with the local dealership, does anyone know how many Tesla fires there have been vs catastrophic engine failures and fires in the Hyundai and Kia class action lawsuit settlement?

 

[Orangeslice13]

I'm not completely opposed to the idea. I just think we are putting the cart before the horse. We are nowhere near where we need to be to sustain the grid needed to support these vehicles, they are as of right now not as dependable or safe in specific and important aspects.

It seems we've taken the strategy of jumping into the deep end instead of wading carefully into pool. These mandates just seem crazy and unrealistic in implementation and scope.

I had the backup generator guys out today. It’s being installed in November. Errbody else can deal with the rolling brown outs. I be inside watching tv

 

[Wireless1]

Since I've been dragged into a fight with the local dealership, does anyone know how many Tesla fires there have been vs catastrophic engine failures and fires in the Hyundai and Kia class action lawsuit settlement?

Have I missed something?

 

[NorthDallas40]

Since I've been dragged into a fight with the local dealership, does anyone know how many Tesla fires there have been vs catastrophic engine failures and fires in the Hyundai and Kia class action lawsuit settlement?

Dragged into a fight with the local dealership? And I think it’s a rare event for both ICE and BEVs regardless. It isn’t anything that should sway buying new one way or the other. And water damage is a red flag on all used cars too

 

[AM64]

My brother was a firefighter in the air force.

I've asked him about this and his answer is simple..... Because it's the only fire suppression material that's safe to use in that you don't have to worry about HAZMAT or known carcinogenic exposure to people and environment.

Which makes sense in almost every case to use water, but when you are trying to extinguish a substance that reacts violently to water it does make you wonder. I also see the other problem in having fire trucks that use other retardants just for EV fires.

 

[kiddiedoc]

Have I missed something?

Yes, as did I. Google "Hyundai engine lawsuit."

My son's car literally seized late Sunday night. Thankfully, he was on a nearby back road, or it could have been a disaster. It also did not catch fire, which has happened in many of the incidents. Fortunately, the tow company informed me of the class action lawsuit, and the driver told me he was taking 20-30/month to the local dealer repair shop. It appears that we are due a new engine replacement, tow, and loaner costs. The settlement affects around 2 million cars and is in excess of $3.1 billion.

I'm extremely disappointed that the local, "reputable" dealer failed to inform me about this issue when I asked the salesman if this was a safe and reliable car for a 16 year old.

I'm still waiting on the inspection results, as they had 27 cars in front of his, with only one engine technician. The service manager estimated 3-6 months for repair, if engine fault is confirmed.

 

[kiddiedoc]

Dragged into a fight with the local dealership? And I think it’s a rare event for both ICE and BEVs regardless. It isn’t anything that should sway buying new one way or the other. And water damage is a red flag on all used cars too

See above. "Rare" is definitely not how I would characterize the 20-teens Hyundai and Kia engine issue. Courts recently ruled that the manufacturers' settlement was not sufficient enough.

 

[NorthDallas40]

See above. "Rare" is definitely not how I would characterize the 20-teens Hyundai and Kia engine issue. Courts recently ruled that the manufacturers' settlement was not sufficient enough.

Oof.

 

[BigOrangeMojo]

Since I've been dragged into a fight with the local dealership, does anyone know how many Tesla fires there have been vs catastrophic engine failures and fires in the Hyundai and Kia class action lawsuit settlement?

5,100 and counting for Kia/Hyundai. That's over 100x the amount of Teslas that catch fire annually...

 

[kiddiedoc]

Oof.

Yes, it could get even worse for Hyundai and Kia. I can't believe the issue has largely been swept under the rug. In honesty, their engine negligence is a much, much, much bigger and more dangerous issue than most anything discussed in this thread, and most people haven't even heard about it.

 

[Willy P]

Yes, it could get even worse for Hyundai and Kia. I can't believe the issue has largely been swept under the rug. In honesty, their engine negligence is a much, much, much bigger and more dangerous issue than most anything discussed in this thread, and most people haven't even heard about it.

Had a ridiculous experience myself with a Hyundai dealership two years ago. We bought a brand new Palisade for my wife and immediately discovered that the whole car smelled like garlic and onions when it sat out in the sun on a warm day. We never had a "new car smell" experience unfortunately. The dealer acted like we were crazy. Turns out, there was a service bulletin for the adhesive used in the headrests - I had to print it out and show it to them. The fix? Take the headrest cover off and spray it with Febreeze. After a new set of headrests and still having a $50K fart box, Hyundai bought the car back from us.

After they bought it back, they were horrible to work with when we tried to order another vehicle.

 

[AM64]

Yes, it could get even worse for Hyundai and Kia. I can't believe the issue has largely been swept under the rug. In honesty, their engine negligence is a much, much, much bigger and more dangerous issue than most anything discussed in this thread, and most people haven't even heard about it.

That seems to be how things have been handled across the car industry for a long time. Deny, deny, deny - then maybe some under the counter fixes for the really persistent - sometimes with one party picking up labor and the other the parts. I thought they'd been doing a bit better with recalls to fix things lately, but it sounds like not all companies got the message.

 

[Franklin Pierce]

Daily on Energy: A sign of Flagging Electric Vehicle Demand​

BATTERY PRICE DROPS HINT AT DEMAND SHORTFALL: The price of batteries used in electric vehicles and energy storage dropped 10% in August, according to a new report from the market research firm TrendForce, with further declines expected through the fall that could force EV makers to decide between the alternatives of either dropping their car prices or slowing manufacturing.


The average price drops for battery cells highlight an “uninspiring growth pattern in the EV market,” the report said.

“Expectations for robust August demand in the energy storage market fizzled out, exacerbated by weakened overseas demand,” it said.

To be sure, U.S. consumers are buying more EVs. But they are not doing so at a pace consistent with current production levels—causing a supply surplus.


According to the most recent data from Cox Automotive, U.S. dealers have more than 92,000 unsold EVs in stock—roughly three times the supply last year.

Daily on Energy: A sign of flagging electric vehicle demand

Subscribe today to the Washington Examiner magazine and get Washington Briefing: politics and policy stories that will keep you up to date with what's going on in Washington. SUBSCRIBE NOW: Just $1.00 an issue!

www.washingtonexaminer.com

 

[UT-Rex]

To be sure, U.S. consumers are buying more EVs. But they are not doing so at a pace consistent with current production levels—causing a supply surplus.

​

According to the most recent data from Cox Automotive, U.S. dealers have more than 92,000 unsold EVs in stock—roughly three times the supply last year.

Daily on Energy: A sign of flagging electric vehicle demand

Subscribe today to the Washington Examiner magazine and get Washington Briefing: politics and policy stories that will keep you up to date with what's going on in Washington. SUBSCRIBE NOW: Just $1.00 an issue!

www.washingtonexaminer.com

Sure, 48% year over year qtrly growth is likely difficult to sustain (mfr's will have to manage production rates / $prices may start falling = good for consumer).


Wednesday July 12, 2023
Nearly 300,000 new electric vehicles (EVs) – full battery-electric vehicles – were sold in the U.S. in Q2, a record for any quarter and an increase of 48.4% from Q2 2022.

Electric Vehicle Sales in Q2 Strike Another Record, but Growth Ahead Will Be Hard Fought - Cox Automotive Inc.

Cox Automotive publishes a quarterly Kelley Blue Book new-vehicle sales report enumerating electric vehicle sales.

www.coxautoinc.com

 

[kiddiedoc]

Daily on Energy: A sign of Flagging Electric Vehicle Demand​

BATTERY PRICE DROPS HINT AT DEMAND SHORTFALL: The price of batteries used in electric vehicles and energy storage dropped 10% in August, according to a new report from the market research firm TrendForce, with further declines expected through the fall that could force EV makers to decide between the alternatives of either dropping their car prices or slowing manufacturing.


The average price drops for battery cells highlight an “uninspiring growth pattern in the EV market,” the report said.

“Expectations for robust August demand in the energy storage market fizzled out, exacerbated by weakened overseas demand,” it said.

To be sure, U.S. consumers are buying more EVs. But they are not doing so at a pace consistent with current production levels—causing a supply surplus.


According to the most recent data from Cox Automotive, U.S. dealers have more than 92,000 unsold EVs in stock—roughly three times the supply last year.

Daily on Energy: A sign of flagging electric vehicle demand

Subscribe today to the Washington Examiner magazine and get Washington Briefing: politics and policy stories that will keep you up to date with what's going on in Washington. SUBSCRIBE NOW: Just $1.00 an issue!

www.washingtonexaminer.com

Sweet! That would likely mean a drop in price.

 

[Orangeburst]

Surprised about Hyundai as I though5 they were high quality. Be curious to know if these engines were mfg in US

 

[NorthDallas40]

Sure, 48% year over year qtrly growth is likely difficult to sustain (mfr's will have to manage production rates / $prices may start falling = good for consumer).


Wednesday July 12, 2023
Nearly 300,000 new electric vehicles (EVs) – full battery-electric vehicles – were sold in the U.S. in Q2, a record for any quarter and an increase of 48.4% from Q2 2022.

Electric Vehicle Sales in Q2 Strike Another Record, but Growth Ahead Will Be Hard Fought - Cox Automotive Inc.

Cox Automotive publishes a quarterly Kelley Blue Book new-vehicle sales report enumerating electric vehicle sales.

www.coxautoinc.com

Yet another example of you completely misrepresenting what one of your articles says again Ronald . The message in that article doesn’t bode well for further BEV adoption

 

[UT-Rex]

Yet another example of you completely misrepresenting what one of your articles says again Ronald . The message in that article doesn’t bode well for further BEV adoption

^^ This is unwarranted and getting old. Please cease. I simply replied to another poster's article reference with another article (from same Source, Cox Automotive) showing relevant related data.

 

[NorthDallas40]

^^ This is unwarranted and getting old. Please cease. I simply replied to another poster's article reference with another article (from same Source, Cox Automotive) showing relevant related data.

You started this with the over the top marketing hype you brought at me Ronald. And you pulled it again in that post I replied to. Maybe if you weren’t such a Homer people wouldn’t point at you and call you a Homer. And hey you can fix it yourself with one simple click !

 

[UT-Rex]

Sweet! That would likely mean a drop in price.

This (media's / Cox Autom's focus on abundant supply leading to what you're suggesting could be a likely drop in price) could be what gets the next round of buyers in the next few years (i.e. the followers, after this first round of early adopters). Lower prices might be attractive to some background lurkers, weighing the fuel costs savings (and those families who might add a ev bev or hydrogen to their lineup).

"46% of those earning less than $30,000 annually cited EVs’ upfront costs as a major hurdle and a third said they had no place to charge where they lived."

Why are Americans less interested in owning an EV? Cost and charging still play a part.

EV concerns have eased, but fewer people want to buy one, a survey shows. Low-income shoppers are most wary of costs and having places to charge.

www.usatoday.com