Erik Ainge-Heisman Rank-CBS.Sportsline

#102
#102
hatvol96 said:
Let's all be honest. As the NFL proved, Hornung was Secretariat, Majors was a plowhorse.
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Hat, I am not sure what the NFL has to do with the Heisman. Is the Heisman some kind of "Best future NFL player in the nation"? I always thought it was the best college player in the nation. %&*( me
 
#103
#103
VolBeef88 said:
hate you would be surprised how often it is brought up by non UT folks when I travel. I'm sure they don't to you. But then again if you are like how you post... then I would guess you're not the most approachable fella.
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The reason they bring it up is that it's an easy conversation starter. They think all UT fans were riding their tractors up to Bristol, CT with flaming pitchforks in an attempt to storm the ESPN studios. That is a misconception I love to disavow anyone who mentions it to me of.
 
#104
#104
My question is, if UT went to the National Championship game in 2003, would Mark Jones have won the Heisman?

Comparison:

Charles Woodson 97:

5 attempts 21 yards 1 TD. 12 receptions 238 yards 2 TDs
36 punt returns 301 yards 1 TD
47 Tackles, 5 tfl, 1 sack, 9 pass break ups, 8 INTs

Mark Jones 03:

7 attempts 65 yards. 36 receptions 556 yards 5 TDs
20 punt returns 303 yards 1 TD
20 Tackles, 2 INTs, 3 pass break ups

Mark Jones was better offensively and on punt returns, while Charles Woodson was better on defense. But overall, similar stats, no?
 
#105
#105
thirdsaturday said:
Hat, I am not sure what the NFL has to do with the Heisman. Is the Heisman some kind of "Best future NFL player in the nation"? I always thought it was the best college player in the nation. %&*( me
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Hornung was obviously a better college player. The NFL merely confirmed what was obvious.
 
#106
#106
JAllen18MVP said:
My question is, if UT went to the National Championship game in 2003, would Mark Jones have won the Heisman?

Comparison:

Charles Woodson 97:

5 attempts 21 yards 1 TD. 12 receptions 238 yards 2 TDs
36 punt returns 301 yards 1 TD
47 Tackles, 5 tfl, 1 sack, 9 pass break ups, 8 INTs

Mark Jones 03:

7 attempts 65 yards. 36 receptions 556 yards 5 TDs
20 punt returns 303 yards 1 TD
20 Tackles, 2 INTs, 3 pass break ups

Mark Jones was better offensively and on punt returns, while Charles Woodson was better on defense. But overall, similar stats, no?
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Not really. Jones played far more on offense than Woodson did. Also, since UT lost 3 games, it's too far fetched a scenario.
 
#107
#107
hatvol96 said:
Hornung was obviously a better college player. The NFL merely confirmed what was obvious.
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I am not saying Majors was better or that he should have won. I am just pointing out that it is like you are arguing how great a high school student a person was based on their performance in college.
 
#108
#108
JAllen18MVP said:
My question is, if UT went to the National Championship game in 2003, would Mark Jones have won the Heisman?

Comparison:

Charles Woodson 97:

5 attempts 21 yards 1 TD. 12 receptions 238 yards 2 TDs
36 punt returns 301 yards 1 TD
47 Tackles, 5 tfl, 1 sack, 9 pass break ups, 8 INTs

Mark Jones 03:

7 attempts 65 yards. 36 receptions 556 yards 5 TDs
20 punt returns 303 yards 1 TD
20 Tackles, 2 INTs, 3 pass break ups

Mark Jones was better offensively and on punt returns, while Charles Woodson was better on defense. But overall, similar stats, no?
Click to expand...
If anyone watched Charles Woodson and Mark Jones play and claims they are equivalent players, they should be immediately drug tested and committed to a mental facility for their own protection.
 
#109
#109
thirdsaturday said:
I am not saying Majors was better or that he should have won. I am just pointing out that it is like you are arguing how great a high school student a person was based on their performance in college.
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No, I'm simply pointing out that the voters were ultimately vindicated in that instance.
 
#110
#110
VolBeef88 said:
hate you would be surprised how often it is brought up by non UT folks when I travel. I'm sure they don't to you. But then again if you are like how you post... then I would guess you're not the most approachable fella.
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They might get get a cup of coffee or vodka tossed in their face.:)
 
#113
#113
JAllen18MVP said:
My question is, if UT went to the National Championship game in 2003, would Mark Jones have won the Heisman?

Comparison:

Charles Woodson 97:

5 attempts 21 yards 1 TD. 12 receptions 238 yards 2 TDs
36 punt returns 301 yards 1 TD
47 Tackles, 5 tfl, 1 sack, 9 pass break ups, 8 INTs

Mark Jones 03:

7 attempts 65 yards. 36 receptions 556 yards 5 TDs
20 punt returns 303 yards 1 TD
20 Tackles, 2 INTs, 3 pass break ups

Mark Jones was better offensively and on punt returns, while Charles Woodson was better on defense. But overall, similar stats, no?
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Hate or somebody, Look up Carl Pickens stats in 1989 Tennessee finished 11-1 that year. He was multi type player that a scored touchdowns 5 different ways.
 
#114
#114
SWS22 said:
Hate or somebody, Look up Carl Pickens stats in 1989 Tennessee finished 11-1 that year. He was multi type player that a scored touchdowns 5 different ways.
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Pickens, one of my personal favorites, had very limited impact defensively. He made a big interception against Vandy and that was about it.
 
#118
#118
Didn't Pickens get at least 1 pick in the Cotton Bowl against Arkansas? I'm pretty sure he was the Defensive MVP that day.
 
#119
#119
GAVol said:
Didn't Pickens get at least 1 pick in the Cotton Bowl against Arkansas? I'm pretty sure he was the Defensive MVP that day.
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Webb's performance that day kind of overshadows my memories of anything else that happened during the game.
 
#120
#120
hatvol96 said:
The interception that clinched the Vanderbilt game is the only one that stands out to me.
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I would be willing to say his overall stats are better than Woodson's or Jones and he only played defense in a limited role due to ut's shortage of db's. Pickens did'nt start playing defense until the 6th game of the season
 
#121
#121
VolBeef88 said:
Well then, that settles that!
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I didn't say my memory was conclusive. However, unlike the Manningophiles, I don't worship at the altar of statistics. I prefer to remember how many truly important plays a player made. An interception that saved a victory that led to an SEC title qualifies.
 
#124
#124
Hey I was thinking that the Ward argument, is better suited for Bailey. If you want to make that argument that is.
 
#125
#125
SWS22 said:
I would be willing to say his overall stats are better than Woodson's or Jones and he only played defense in a limited role due to ut's shortage of db's. Pickens did'nt start playing defense until the 6th game of the season
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Mark Jones was pretty awesome. Unfortunately, we were shorthanded at a number of positions and he was forced to stay on the field for close to 60 minutes. I think if he could have played either solely offense or defense he might have ended up being really special.

Other factors that hurt him: He was a great returner, but played on one of the nation's worst special teams units. That's one advantage Woodson had over him. Also, his position coaches (Larry Slade and Pat Washington) were the definition of lackluster. In spite of all that, he made it to the NFL. I'm impressed.
 
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