Football Practice

[jakez4ut]

you know, ever since last season, all anyone has wanted was change....everything we do and have been doing for hte past 5 years is antiquated and needs an overhaul. Well, I just think this is part of the change.

I agree that this really isn't a big deal, and as for accoutabiity, it isn't a reporter's job to hold the head coach of a Univiersity like Tennessee accountable. It's his job to write, period. What he writes is up to him. CPF knows that and at this point, why on Earth would he want to put anyting up for debate with a member of the meida??

this is simply a move to remove distractions.....not only from the team, but from him. Personally, i think it's a good move. this way he controls it.

this really isn't that big a deal....like volracerx said, open or closed practices won't have one thing to do with any W or L we get in 06, so who cares really?

 

[WA_Vol]

I think someone already brought up this point, but UT closed practices last year. It didnt help, UT went 5-6. Its not like UT is preparing for Florida or GA right now.

 

[jakez4ut]

agreed...yeah, they closed practice last year after the 1st 20 minutes or so....

 

[patrick]

Exactly ^^


The entire coaching staff has talked about "execution" for years. If you execute your plays, it doesn't matter if the other team knows what is coming they cant stop it........(this statement has been made many times in reference to the Vols and their coaching philosophy).

Listen, Tennessee like most other schools in the nation (except where there is new coach) run the same offenses and defenses year end year out with only minor modifications (aka "wrinkles"). So the argument that the media will report on "secret plays" is bogus".

The distraction thing likewise I believe has little weight. Tell why players can't focus when media is around? Why can't coaches coach when the media is around? The players should be motivated by last season to pay attention and to focus.

I have heard from a few people who used to attend practices regularly who have stated that in their opinions practices were previously being closed because you could see first hand Tennessee's lack of execution and discipline specifically offensively. They have spoken of dropped passes, wrong routes, missed blocking assignments, fumbles, and laziness in their personel observations of practice.

IMO, the majority of practices should be open! However, it is the coaching staff's perogative. I am just tired of everyone running to the defense of poor pitiful Coach Fulmer about every freaking thing!

The fact is the team had a horrible year last year. Fulmer, being the head coach, should be held to the highest level of accountability and responsibility! If he turns it around great; if he doesn't, there are a half a dozen top level coaches who would love this job!!!

We will see in about five months how much progress the Vols have made.

 

[VolBeef88]

Exactly ^^
The entire coaching staff has talked about "execution" for years. If you execute your plays, it doesn't matter if the other team knows what is coming they cant stop it........(this statement has been made many times in reference to the Vols and their coaching philosophy).

Listen, Tennessee like most other schools in the nation (except where there is new coach) run the same offenses and defenses year end year out with only minor modifications (aka "wrinkles"). So the argument that the media will report on "secret plays" is bogus".

The distraction thing likewise I believe has little weight. Tell why players can't focus when media is around? Why can't coaches coach when the media is around? The players should be motivated by last season to pay attention and to focus.

I have heard from a few people who used to attend practices regularly who have stated that in their opinions practices were previously being closed because you could see first hand Tennessee's lack of execution and discipline specifically offensively. They have spoken of dropped passes, wrong routes, missed blocking assignments, fumbles, and laziness in their personel observations of practice.

IMO, the majority of practices should be open! However, it is the coaching staff's perogative. I am just tired of everyone running to the defense of poor pitiful Coach Fulmer about every freaking thing!

The fact is the team had a horrible year last year. Fulmer, being the head coach, should be held to the highest level of accountability and responsibility! If he turns it around great; if he doesn't, there are a half a dozen top level coaches who would love this job!!!

We will see in about five months how much progress the Vols have made.

The distraction is not the reporters being there at practice so much as it is the stroies they write and the affect it has on the players, coaches and the administration.
Here is another reason to close practice.
Back to Arky.
In 2004 they had one of the worst D's in the nation so in 05 they brought in a new D coodinator who was very hard nosed. If a player messed up or didn't play hard he made them wear a pink jersey in practice. The media made a big deal about that and the type of language he was using and the pressure mounted so Houston Nutt made him stop.
That folks, by any account is interference and it is much easier to just make it not happen. It is amazing to me that no matter what CPF does many on here will tear him up. "Make changes because we need changes" "fire Randy Sanders he is horrible" "accept responsibility for the team" "hold the players accountable".
He does all of those and what happens?
1.He makes changes in practice and "he is trying to avoid criticism"
2.He fired Randy Sanders. "CRS was just a scape goat for Phil"
3. He has repeatedly accepted responsibility in both spoken word, written word and in action. "the letter was done just to save his fat butt just like bringing in new staff was to save his fat butt"
4.He calls out his players. "Phil is throwing his players under the bus to save his fat butt".

The emotional hatred of some is amusing to me, but sadly is fodder for bammers.

 

[KYVolFan]

I agree! If it was anyone it was Fulmers's fault these kids were playing for the names on the back of their jerseys rather than the "T" on the helmet. I know you have heard it before but TAKE THE NAMES OFF THE JERSEYS. :gun:

I agree, and I have said it at least 20-30 times. GET THE NAMES OFF THOSE JERSEYS. Demand discipline, responsibility and intensity. Nothing short of 100% effort in Games and Practices should be acceptable. Any player or wannabee who isn't willing to to toe-the-mark should be sent packing.

 

[jakez4ut]

The distraction is not the reporters being there at practice so much as it is the stroies they write and the affect it has on the players, coaches and the administration.

which as we all know is what fuels most fires from fans these days....add to that a horrible season and it's a firebomb for anyone and everyone to keep dousing gasoline on....

it doesn't matter what Phil does right now, everything he does or does not do, will have it's own perception attached to it by someone, positively or negatively. the truth is, none of this matters right now. Show me W's and L's in the upcoming season, and then we can judge on our own. But to sit here and go back and forth on the merits of closing or not closing practice is ridiculous.

And guess who got it started? a reporter who's upset he can't find anything in practice to report on so he attaches his negative percepiton of the decision and reports it that way, and hence a 3 page debate...if he had just kept his mouth shut, none of us would have probably cared one way or another.

talk about feeding the trolls. and Mike Griffin is a troll, make no mistake about it. He's a bama also ran....don't forget that folks.

 

[WA_Vol]

The distraction is not the reporters being there at practice so much as it is the stroies they write and the affect it has on the players, coaches and the administration.

You can't blame the media for last years poor play. The media writing stories about the players or coaches had little to do with last years poor season. That rests on the players and coaching staff alone.

I don't like reading about how players like Ainge are blaming their poor play on being rotated in and out games or some other external factor. Fulmer plays the blame game as well. One of the problems this team has is a lack of accountability. The team alone need to take responsibility for their poor play. If the players and coaches staff confidence is so fragile that a critical news story is going to throw their game off, I'm not sure these guys will excel at the this level.

The football program is entertainment. Like it or not Fulmer has a responsibility to create interest in the football program. Providing info to the media to write stories is a part of that. Look at what a great job Pearl did in this respect.

 

[jakez4ut]

You can't blame the media for last years poor play. The media writing stories about the players or coaches had little to do with last years poor season.

Providing info to the media to write stories is a part of that. Look at what a great job Pearl did in this respect.

On these two points:

I don't think anyone is blaming the media for the poor play. I think it is more or less just a reaction to the known fact that the media, espeically this year, will be heavily scrutinizing everything they do, good or bad. and why deal with that if you don't have to? Easy solution, don't give 'em anything. That's what they're doing here. I don't think closing the practice is pointing the finger at the media saying "you did this to us last year, and we're not going to let you do it again" type of thing....

and the other point, there will be enough to write about with all the what ifs after last year that no one will be searching for storylines. And as for Pearl, it's two different situations. Pearl is in a situation where his team and men's bball program in general was getting NOTHING from the media, good or bad. What he was doing was a necessity for recruiting, exposure, getting us on TV to play more in the future etc....CPF has been raked thru the coals in the media for the better part of the past 3-4 years with all the court stuff, qb contraversy, firing, hiring of coaches etc....he's already got a media light on him, and it wasn't a good one.

For those two separate situations, i think both coaches are making the right decisions regarding the media.

 

[WA_Vol]

On these two points:

I don't think anyone is blaming the media for the poor play. I think it is more or less just a reaction to the known fact that the media, espeically this year, will be heavily scrutinizing everything they do, good or bad. and why deal with that if you don't have to? Easy solution, don't give 'em anything. That's what they're doing here. I don't think closing the practice is pointing the finger at the media saying "you did this to us last year, and we're not going to let you do it again" type of thing....

Points well taken.

The problem with this is, cutting the media access to your program is not going to get them to look at Fulmer or the program more favorablely. If anything it will make them more critical of the program, since Fulmer is making their job more difficult. I don't think Fulmer can blame the media for writing critical stories on the team this year, he's opening himself up to it.

Fulmer puts too much attention on what goes on outside of the program. Last year it was alabama's recruiting violations, this year its the media criticism. He needs to focus on the team play and not the the media, alabama recruiting, etc. His attention off the field should be on players and making sure they are staying out of trouble, making grades, etc; not the media criticism, other teams recruiting violations, etc.

 

[jakez4ut]

Points well taken.

The problem with this is, cutting the media access to your program is not going to get them to look at Fulmer or the program more favorablely. If anything it will make them more critical of the program, since Fulmer is making their job more difficult. I don't think Fulmer can blame the media for writing critical stories on the team this year, he's opening himself up to it.

Fulmer puts too much attention on what goes on outside of the program. Last year it was alabama's recruiting violations, this year its the media criticism. He needs to focus on the team play and not the the media, alabama recruiting, etc. His attention off the field should be on players and making sure they are staying out of trouble, making grades, etc; not the media criticism, other teams recruiting violations, etc.

I thnk those two points right there are more than enough reason not to allow the media access...face it, we know the media is going to carve him up (no pun intended for any pork jokes to soon follow.... ). So he's in a catch 22. He's damned if he does, or damned if he doesn't. At least this way, he controls what goes to the media. after that, it's all opinion.

and i think by closing practices it sends a message to everyone involved with the program from him on down, that we are going to focus on one thing and one thing only. football. TN football.

I hear what your saying, but nothing good could come of opening practice except to appease a few media members, which in the long run could turn out to cause more outside issues and more criticism. He's going to get criticisized anyway...why give the vultures access the meal?

 

[jakez4ut]

But to sit here and go back and forth on the merits of closing or not closing practice is ridiculous.

i guess i should follow my own advice.....

 

[Volunteer]

Patrick,
Please tell me the list of coaches you would have here rather than Fulmer. If you think Mike Hamilton is going to snap his fingers, bring in a new coach to replace one that stunk (i.e. Pearl for Peterson) and win an SEC Championship, please pass what you are smoking.

Fulmer is and has always been accountable for the football program, obviously we (yes, I include myself) are long due for an SEC championship. But I don't know what other high profile coach out there can get it done at the University of Tennessee right now.

 

[crazyguy]

IMO closed practices take away a necessary layer of accountability, especially considering all that we have heard about the general lax attitudes and lack of effort in last year's practices.

yeah, we need a bunch of crazy fans holding the coaching staff acountable....

 

[crazyguy]

Patrick,
Please tell me the list of coaches you would have here rather than Fulmer. If you think Mike Hamilton is going to snap his fingers, bring in a new coach to replace one that stunk (i.e. Pearl for Peterson) and win an SEC Championship, please pass what you are smoking.

Fulmer is and has always been accountable for the football program, obviously we (yes, I include myself) are long due for an SEC championship. But I don't know what other high profile coach out there can get it done at the University of Tennessee right now.

I completely agree.

 

[VolBeef88]

Points well taken.

The problem with this is, cutting the media access to your program is not going to get them to look at Fulmer or the program more favorablely. If anything it will make them more critical of the program, since Fulmer is making their job more difficult. I don't think Fulmer can blame the media for writing critical stories on the team this year, he's opening himself up to it.

Fulmer puts too much attention on what goes on outside of the program. Last year it was alabama's recruiting violations, this year its the media criticism. He needs to focus on the team play and not the the media, alabama recruiting, etc. His attention off the field should be on players and making sure they are staying out of trouble, making grades, etc; not the media criticism, other teams recruiting violations, etc.

I have read anything that CPF has said about the media. He just closed practice and the media guys don't like it. I understand why they don't, it's their job. But CPF has not blamed them for anything.
I gave examples of how the media can be a distraction.
Like I said, no matter what he does some will lay into him.

 

[hatvol96]

Patrick,
Please tell me the list of coaches you would have here rather than Fulmer. If you think Mike Hamilton is going to snap his fingers, bring in a new coach to replace one that stunk (i.e. Pearl for Peterson) and win an SEC Championship, please pass what you are smoking.

Fulmer is and has always been accountable for the football program, obviously we (yes, I include myself) are long due for an SEC championship. But I don't know what other high profile coach out there can get it done at the University of Tennessee right now.

I'm not sure I understand your point. If you're saying that Bob Stoops, Pete Carroll, Butch Davis, or a number of other guys couldn't walk in and win tomorrow at UT, I think you're wildly erroneous in your assumption. If you're saying that, realistically, finding a quality replacement would be more difficult than most think, then I agree.

 

[jakez4ut]

I'm not sure I understand your point. If you're saying that Bob Stoops, Pete Carroll, Butch Davis, or a number of other guys couldn't walk in and win tomorrow at UT, I think you're wildly erroneous in your assumption. If you're saying that, realistically, finding a quality replacement would be more difficult than most think, then I agree.

i think it's the latter....of a list of "realistic" replacements, the list is very short of people that could come in and win period. the pool to choose coaches in D1 big time football is much shallower than in any other sport, at least for the big time programs. YOu better hit a home run with the 1st replacement, or you could be in for a rough time for a while....ask UGA, Bama and Nebraska and Notre Dame for that matter...

 

[VolBeef88]

I'm not sure I understand your point. If you're saying that Bob Stoops, Pete Carroll, Butch Davis, or a number of other guys couldn't walk in and win tomorrow at UT, I think you're wildly erroneous in your assumption. If you're saying that, realistically, finding a quality replacement would be more difficult than most think, then I agree.

CPF has won and will win this year. Book it!

 

[hatvol96]

i think it's the latter....of a list of "realistic" replacements, the list is very short of people that could come in and win period. the pool to choose coaches in D1 big time football is much shallower than in any other sport, at least for the big time programs. YOu better hit a home run with the 1st replacement, or you could be in for a rough time for a while....ask UGA, Bama and Nebraska and Notre Dame for that matter...

With Oklahoma being my second favorite team, I'm very aware of the phenomenon you describe. The Gibbs/Schnellenberger/Blake years weren't exactly paradise.

 

[jakez4ut]

With Oklahoma being my second favorite team, I'm very aware of the phenomenon you describe. The Gibbs/Schnellenberger/Blake years weren't exactly paradise.

yep...and, i know we've had this debate before, but i'd hate for us to get in to a situation like that. things have worked out for some of those teams, but look at how long Bama was mediocre? UGA? hell we beat them 10 straight years for goodness sakes....and while i wouldn't say ND sucked out right, they were not the ND, ND fans thought they should be during the Bob Davie and Ty Willingham experiments.

And OK is another good example...they were completley off the map...and sure things are fine now with Stoops, but look at what you had to go thru to get there...

Do we really want to go thru that? Not that it's a sure bet it would be that way, but just as it's not a sure bet a change would reap beneifts with no drop off at all.....

 

[WA_Vol]

I think UT has 2 coaches on staff that could do as well or better then Fulmer, Chavis and Cutcliffe.

Here is the list of coaches/school who have recently changed coaches and all of them are better because of it: Florida (Meyers), Auburn (Tubberville), LSU (Saban, Miles), SC (Spurrier). Show me the programs that are in worse shape because of a coaching change? The majority are better off, and the rest stayed in mediocrity, they didn't get worse.

2.2 million a year can get you a really good coach in my opinion. I think there are lots of quality nfl assistants who would make themselves available for that kind of money. I could be wrong.

 

[jakez4ut]

Here is the list of coaches/school who have recently changed coaches and all of them are better because of it: Florida (Meyers), Auburn (Tubberville), LSU (Saban, Miles), SC (Spurrier). Show me the programs that are in worse shape because of a coaching change? The majority are better off, and the rest stayed in mediocrity, they didn't get worse.

that's a good list, and yep, all did get better. But to get to the guy that got those teams where they are now, let's look:
Florida...Ron Zook...i think we all know how UF fans felt about that hire....and let's not forget UF hasn't "done" anything yet....though that could change this year.
Auburn...the Terry Bowden experiment wasn't exactly a rousing success....
LSU...Gerri Denardo and Mike Archer. nuff said.
SC...ok, they get a pass, but it's not like Lou brought them any championships. Just a couple of New Year's day bowl games, which was huge for that program, but not what i could call the standard bearer in SEC play, as far as we're concerned.

the difference in each of those cases, was the coach that was replaced, some times in multiple cases, was because the previous coach that was brought in didn't do anything more than the previous coach(es), so they were forced to make a change.

My point is are we ready to deal with the fact that if we fire Fulmer right now, that we may have to go thru at least one maybe two more coaches in the next 5-8 years to find "our" guy? my answer is NO. right now.

there are no guarantees, positive or negative, and RIGHT NOW, i'm willing to go with the guy that i know has gotten us there in the past. I don't want to be sitting here in 2 years going "what a terrible hire, we need to get (fill in the blank with the next hottest name)".

And i'm not convinced Chavis could be a HC. Cut might do pretty well....

 

[volmanjr]

Here is the list of coaches/school who have recently changed coaches and all of them are better because of it: Florida (Meyers), Auburn (Tubberville), LSU (Saban, Miles), SC (Spurrier). Show me the programs that are in worse shape because of a coaching change?

Meyers? lets wait a few seasons before we drop the gavel on that one, Tubby? you're kidding right, Miles? again lets talk after 4 or 5 yrs in the SEC. (Saban is gone so he doesn't count) I'll give you Spurrierbut still a monkey could have followed Lou and made improvements.

 

[jakez4ut]

Meyers? lets wait a few seasons before we drop the gavel on that one, Tubby? you're kidding right, Miles? again lets talk after 4 or 5 yrs in the SEC. (Saban is gone so he doesn't count) I'll give you Spurrierbut still a monkey could have followed Lou and made improvements.

i know what he's getting at, and at this point in time for those schools, they are better, at least perceived to be better...though i would agree with you about Miles....but that's even a bit different because Saban left on his own accord, so they had to make a change, they would have preferred not to, i'm sure.

but to answer his question on which schools made changes and got worse, i would point to each of those schools including Neb, and ND, as schools that either got worse or no better by making changes, at the time they made the changes.

LSU is widely cosidered nowadays to be one of the elite teams in the SEC, as is Auburn, UGA and UF. But each of those schools made coaching changes way back when (and UF is similar to LSU in that SS left on his own accord, and would hav preferred not make a change) that did not pan out originally. And it started a ripple affect for the next coach, and the next and the next until you get to the Sabans, Tubbervilles and Richts of the world.

Sure, if UGA could have gotten Mark Richt 10 years ago, you could say that that was a great move, but to go thru Ray Goof and Jim Donnan before you get to Richt....that's a long time of mediocrity. Same for LSU....i would dare say had LSU had Nick Saban for the entire tenru that Denardo and Archer were there, things might have been different for the tigers, but they had to go thru those sub par years to get where they are now, and now they aren't really any better off than they were then.