Gay Marriage

#226
#226
therealUT said:
Our pile of laws are also completely ridiculous.
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You can probably move and find a set more to your liking elsewhere, but be forewarned that morality will be the basis of most sets of laws except those of nature.

I'd argue that much of the strength of our nation is due to the rule of law and the set of laws which rule.
 
#227
#227
therealUT said:
Here is a question I have for you:

Should the government serve a moral capacity? Should the government determine what is morally acceptable behavior and what is not?

With an eye to these question, now consider the following:

If the government sanctions heterosexual marriage yet prohibits homosexual marriage, is the government determining what is and is not moral behavior?
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To some extent I see your point however, yes the government does determine much of our moral behavior, drugs, stealing, murder and on and on. Why is it against the law if a 15 year old and 25 year old want to get married- because the government regulates that. Why can't we have more than one wife- the government regulates that and while I'm not morman they have in the past had more than one wife but the government does not allow them to do that. So YES the government does regulate morality to a lagre degree.
 
#228
#228
having one wife is bad enough, I can't imagine the horror two or three would create.
 
#229
#229
I personally can't understand homosexuality, but at the same time, Gay Marriage is a non-issue for me. It doesn't affect my life in any way, shape, or form, I know all of 2 gay people, and theyre not like the weird ass "queer eye" guys, they are actually good people. So my conservative Libertarianism says to those who oppose it, "How will it affect you personally?" I can't cite research, but i highly doubt that the % of gay child molesters and such is any higher than straight ones, it just is more sensational and is therefore reported more.
 
#230
#230
BigPapaVol said:
You can probably move and find a set more to your liking elsewhere, but be forewarned that morality will be the basis of most sets of laws except those of nature.

I'd argue that much of the strength of our nation is due to the rule of law and the set of laws which rule.
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I could move, but most likely would not find a system of government more to my liking.

Also, the Constitution of the United States, you know that document that all elected officials are sworn to uphold, it is extremely void of any moral over or undertones. The wonderful premise of this country is as follows:

Leave me be and I will leave you be. Don't take away my opportunities, but do not hand me anything. I will work for what I need and want, and I expect the same from my fellow countrymen.
 
#231
#231
JZVOL said:
To some extent I see your point however, yes the government does determine much of our moral behavior, drugs, stealing, murder and on and on. Why is it against the law if a 15 year old and 25 year old want to get married- because the government regulates that. Why can't we have more than one wife- the government regulates that and while I'm not morman they have in the past had more than one wife but the government does not allow them to do that. So YES the government does regulate morality to a lagre degree.
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I have absolutely no problem with someone who wants to marry more than one wife. If you think that the system we have right now keeps that from happening, you are dead wrong. The system we have actually encourages polygamy. Men are still taking multiple wives in Utah, Arizona, New Mexico, etc., yet, when they have children, they are single moms with no income...hence they receive welfare. So, in essence, the government trying to legislate Trinitarian Morality into that situation in effect takes my money to raise those children.
 
#232
#232
JZVOL said:
To some extent I see your point however, yes the government does determine much of our moral behavior, drugs, stealing, murder and on and on.
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Stealing and murder have to do with causing harm to another human being. the war on drugs is a dismal failure against something that is no more harmful than alcohol.

JZVOL said:
Why is it against the law if a 15 year old and 25 year old want to get married- because the government regulates that.
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It was quite common in the 19th and early 20th century for a 15 year old to marry a 25 year old. It was up to the young girl's family to give consent. It is against the law now because the government has gotten into the business of raising kids.

JZVOL said:
Why can't we have more than one wife- the government regulates that and while I'm not morman they have in the past had more than one wife but the government does not allow them to do that. So YES the government does regulate morality to a lagre degree.
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The holier than thou christians of the 19th century saw the mormons as a cult, and the anti polygamy laws were passed so that the government would have a tool to persecute mormons.

I personally believe that polygamy should be legal as long as all parties are consenting.
 
#233
#233
JZVOL said:
Here's a thought/question I just had: Why should we change laws and/or traditions our nation has had for over 200 years because certain people choose to live an alternative lifestyle? Please don't use the answer of what about civil rights and slavery and we changed those things because that is a far cry from choosing to be gay. I understand we have freedoms to live how we want in America as long as it doesn't hurt anybody but I don't see how this could help our country. Just as one could argue heterosexual marriage success rates or lack there of is hurting our society, homosexual marriage rates would likely be even lower. I guess I just don't see how it would benefit our society in any way.
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This kind of mindset is, especially the last line, is why our country is extremely FUBAR right now.
 
#234
#234
Not sure what FUBAR means but please tell how gay people marrying would benefit America. It hasn't been legal for over 200 years and I think we have done ok for ourselves. The only benefit is for the people in the relationship and I'm not sure why someone choosing to be gay should get tax breaks and benefits. You can call my views outdated but I will use the Bible as my compass on all these matters.
 
#235
#235
JZVOL said:
Not sure what FUBAR means but please tell how gay people marrying would benefit America. It hasn't been legal for over 200 years and I think we have done ok for ourselves. The only benefit is for the people in the relationship and I'm not sure why someone choosing to be gay should get tax breaks and benefits. You can call my views outdated but I will use the Bible as my compass on all these matters.
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Please show me where the bible says that the government should be in the business of discriminating against a group of people.
 
#237
#237
well i have a friend that is a 2 yrs younger than me that is still playin college ball where i played. well i found out she went to likin oscar meyers weiner a lot, to licking a softball players carpet. this is very disappointing cause this girl is so fine, w/ a great asset
 
#238
#238
JZVOL said:
Not sure what FUBAR means but please tell how gay people marrying would benefit America. It hasn't been legal for over 200 years and I think we have done ok for ourselves. The only benefit is for the people in the relationship and I'm not sure why someone choosing to be gay should get tax breaks and benefits. You can call my views outdated but I will use the Bible as my compass on all these matters.
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I would ask your legislative officials to use the Constitution as their compass on all matters concerning the public domain. They can use the Bible all they want in their private lives and the government of their family.
 
#247
#247
MyBloodRunnethOrange said:
Please show me where the bible says that the government should be in the business of discriminating against a group of people.
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Not being allowed to do something and being discriminated against are two very different things. Please show me where the Bible condones homosexuality. The Bible calls it a perversion. In our country homosexuals have a right to be gay, but why should we change laws and or traditions because they choose this lifestyle? Again I will ask how does this benefit our society? Just because some people choose to smoke weed doesn't mean we should change our laws to accomidate them. I don't hear people saying we are discriminating against people who choose to smoke weed or use drugs in the privacy of their own home.
 
#248
#248
JZVOL said:
Not being allowed to do something and being discriminated against are two very different things. Please show me where the Bible condones homosexuality. The Bible calls it a perversion. In our country homosexuals have a right to be gay, but why should we change laws and or traditions because they choose this lifestyle? Again I will ask how does this benefit our society? Just because some people choose to smoke weed doesn't mean we should change our laws to accomidate them. I don't hear people saying we are discriminating against people who choose to smoke weed or use drugs in the privacy of their own home.
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Imagine my surprise to find out you are also in favor of government legislation against the use of recreational drugs. :boredom:
 
#249
#249
MyBloodRunnethOrange said:
Stealing and murder have to do with causing harm to another human being. the war on drugs is a dismal failure against something that is no more harmful than alcohol

It was quite common in the 19th and early 20th century for a 15 year old to marry a 25 year old. It was up to the young girl's family to give consent. It is against the law now because the government has gotten into the business of raising kids.


The holier than thou christians of the 19th century saw the mormons as a cult, and the anti polygamy laws were passed so that the government would have a tool to persecute mormons.

I personally believe that polygamy should be legal as long as all parties are consenting.
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I'm with you on that for sure! There is actually a special that comes on the history about how certain drugs came to be illegal and it is very interesting. Caffeine was actually almost made illeagal too wich I thought was interesting.
I generally agree with most of your points I was just trying to show examples of the gov't regualting morality, they do it all the time.
 
#250
#250
Perversion in the Bible has a wide range of coverage. Many of which seem to be condoned in today's society. Now why are some perversions allowed and condoned but others aren't?
 
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