Goodbye Oregon Football

[MaehlMan]

So far, it's not a question of how much dirt, it's a question of whether or not what has happened was within the letter of the rules.

I think that it could go either way. Either the NCAA drops the hammer. Or, they recognize that there is a lot of gray area in the rules about scouts as they are written and use the incident to clarify them.

It's a huge gray area that needs to be clarified, absolutely. I think the posters that are calling Kelly a moron are hyperbolizing a bit. I think that he tried to walk a thin, unclear line, and he may have taken one step too far. Being a successful coach is tough, and I think Chip tried to capitalize on what he believed to be an undefined area.

Unfortunately, I could very easily see the NCAA making an example out of us.

Ultimately, it was foolish for Chip to test the rules so strongly, and the program may end up paying for it. At this point, the program just needs to cooperate fully and not screw around with the NCAA.

 

[justingroves]

What did Kelly do to cover up the payment?

Paying $25,000 for outdated info on recruits while sending a handwritten letter thanking Lyles for all his help getting those kids to Oregon.


At best, they fronted money for an unofficial visit (a big no-no). At worst, they paid $25,000 for a RB.

 

[tvolsfan]

A head coach participating in this is unbelievably stupid.

 

[justingroves]

It's a huge gray area that needs to be clarified, absolutely. I think the posters that are calling Kelly a moron are hyperbolizing a bit. I think that he tried to walk a thin, unclear line, and he may have taken one step too far. Being a successful coach is tough, and I think Chip tried to capitalize on what he believed to be an undefined area.

Unfortunately, I could very easily see the NCAA making an example out of us.

Ultimately, it was foolish for Chip to test the rules so strongly, and the program may end up paying for it. At this point, the program just needs to cooperate fully and not screw around with the NCAA.

The line is very clear. You don't pay money for outdated recruiting info. You don't say "I don't know a Willie Lyles" and then say "Oh but I do know a Will Lyles".

 

[justingroves]

The grandma thing wasn't shady. Lache Seastrunk was raised by his grandmother because his mom had drug/legal problems. Lache has stated himself that the only reason she wanted to control where he went to school was to try and get something out of it herself.

Lache is a victim here.

Instead of his mother getting paid, his handler did.

 

[MaehlMan]

The line is very clear. You don't pay money for outdated recruiting info. You don't say "I don't know a Willie Lyles" and then say "Oh but I do know a Will Lyles".

I'm talking about the line between "handlers", "street agents", "mentors", and whatnot.

 

[justingroves]

A head coach participating in this is unbelievably stupid.

Yes it is.

Until Emmert arrived, you could let an assistant do all the dirty work and fire them for cause and receive a slap on the wrist.

 

[wheaton4prez]

Pretty much nothing, which is even stupider. Hand-written notes with your signature on them are dead giveaways.

What about the thank you note clearly indicates that he cheated? Coaches thank vendors, parents, etc. all the time.

wheaton, yet again being a raging homer with his head in the sand. Color me shocked.

I'm open to hear where my reasoning is off.

Reading the comments here, for a few people here, it's obvious that there are personal reasons to want Oregon to be sanctioned whether they broke rules or not.

 

[justingroves]

I'm talking about the line between "handlers", "street agents", "mentors", and whatnot.

There's no line. They are one and the same. They're all trying to make money off of kids without a strong home.

 

[tvolsfan]

Yes it is.

Until Emmert arrived, you could let an assistant do all the dirty work and fire them for cause and receive a slap on the wrist.

You think Kelly would ever coach again?

 

[MaehlMan]

There's no line. They are one and the same. They're all trying to make money off of kids without a strong home.

I know. What I'm trying to say is the NCAA needs to draw a line on what and what not these guys can do. I'd like to see them eradicated completely, but I'm sure that's not logically going to happen.

 

[tvolsfan]

If there's money involved, consider the line safely crossed.

 

[justingroves]

What about the thank you note clearly indicates that he cheated? Coaches thank vendors, parents, etc. all the time.



I'm open to hear where my reasoning is off.

Reading the comments here, for a few people here, it's obvious that there are personal reasons to want Oregon to be sanctioned whether they broke rules or not.

I've never seen a coach thank someone after sending them a $25,000 check. Everyone with a functioning brain should realize these "handlers" are already extremely close to being over the line. Writing a thank you note for getting kids on campus is mildly retarded.

I have no personal vendetta against the Ducks. It is what it is.

 

[tvolsfan]

Agreed. I'd much rather Auburn get hit than Oregon.

 

[NashVol11]

Did Cal not pay Lyles as well?

What did Kelly do to cover up the payment?

1. "In a wide-ranging, multi-day interview, Lyles said Kelly “scrambled” in late February and asked Lyles to submit retroactive player profiles to justify the $25,000 payment to his company." It seems like he basically sent Kelly what Cal bought a year before (for 20K less), which is why almost all of the players were from Texas.

2. Then, hours before the Yahoo! story broke on March 3 (and long after the payment), Kelly had Lyles send him a spreadsheet of random 2012 and 2013 recruits (with basically nothing more than name, height, and weight) so that the school would have some kind of response to the story. $25,000 for a list of names with zero scouting info isn't all that strong a response, but hey, it's Chip Kelly.

 

[justingroves]

I know. What I'm trying to say is the NCAA needs to draw a line on what and what not these guys can do. I'd like to see them eradicated completely, but I'm sure that's not logically going to happen.

There is a line drawn. It says "Don't pay them money".

The NCAA sat around and watched college basketball get taken over by scum like this. They are going to try their damnedest to keep them out of football.

Oregon is the first step imo.

 

[MaehlMan]

If there's money involved, consider the line safely crossed.

And that brings up another question-should schools be allowed to pay "scouts" for info, videos, etc. even if it is legitimate information?

 

[MaehlMan]

There is a line drawn. It says "Don't pay them money".

The NCAA sat around and watched college basketball get taken over by scum like this. They are going to try their damnedest to keep them out of football.

Oregon is the first step imo.

Unfortunately, you may very well be right. I don't want to see it happen, but I'm afraid we may be losing some scholarships and not participating in a bowl for a year or two.

 

[justingroves]

You think Kelly would ever coach again?

High school or D-II.

If he's smart, he'll try to jump on with an NFL team

 

[justingroves]

And that brings up another question-should schools be allowed to pay "scouts" for info, videos, etc. even if it is legitimate information?

Yes if it's legit.

If the NCAA is going to go down that road, they need to start a licensing service to insure those guys are legit.

What will probably happen is schools can only pay 3 to 5 recruiting services for info.

 

[justingroves]

Unfortunately, you may very well be right. I don't want to see it happen, but I'm afraid we may be losing some scholarships and not participating in a bowl for a year or two.

Seastrunk and anyone else involved with Lyles will be ineligible until money is paid back too.

 

[MaehlMan]

Yes if it's legit.

If the NCAA is going to go down that road, they need to start a licensing service to insure those guys are legit.

What will probably happen is schools can only pay 3 to 5 recruiting services for info.

I like that idea. The services should constantly be monitored and kept clean, and licensing would be a good way to make sure of their authenticity.

 

[CountVolcula]

That article starts off with a false statement. Lyles did not say that Oregon paid him to steer recruits. He has denied that he was ever paid to steer recruits anywhere multiple times.

However, he now says Oregon did not pay him for his work as a traditional scout, but for his influence with top recruits and their families and his ability to usher prospects through the signing and eligibility process. That dual role as mentor to prospects and paid contractor to Oregon is believed to be a focus of the NCAA probe.

6 on one hand, half a dozen on the other

 

[milohimself]

I've read (on some random board) that there might be non-conference game bans as a replacement for the TV ban.
Posted via VolNation Mobile

Again, would be penalizing other teams. Postseasons bans, schollies and probation are the best way to hit a single school with minimal collateral damage.

I'm not all knowing, but I seem to recall the Duck fans coming here and showing far more class than SEC trolls and even many of our own fans. They actually talked football and girls instead of being obnoxious. Please give credit where credit is due.

One of the worse ones is posting in this thread.

generally speaking travelling fanbases are pretty friendly. it's when you visit where the real asshats come out and oregon has more than any other team in the pac-10.

IMO Tucson has the nastiest fanbase in the conference, but Eugene and Seattle are right behind. I've never seen an opposing fan at Autzen who wasn't at least heckled or confronted in the tailgating areas, unless they were very old or very young (and even then, that wasn't safe).

Agreed. I'd much rather Auburn get hit than Oregon.

I'd rather they both get crushed.

 

[wheaton4prez]

It's a huge gray area that needs to be clarified, absolutely. I think the posters that are calling Kelly a moron are hyperbolizing a bit. I think that he tried to walk a thin, unclear line, and he may have taken one step too far. Being a successful coach is tough, and I think Chip tried to capitalize on what he believed to be an undefined area.

Unfortunately, I could very easily see the NCAA making an example out of us.

Ultimately, it was foolish for Chip to test the rules so strongly, and the program may end up paying for it. At this point, the program just needs to cooperate fully and not screw around with the NCAA.

Agreed. Though, I'm not sure that Kelly even thought he was pushing a boundary. It sounds like he leaned on the compliance office to let him know what he could and could not do. It will be interesting to hear his side of the story.

Paying $25,000 for outdated info on recruits while sending a handwritten letter thanking Lyles for all his help getting those kids to Oregon.

At best, they fronted money for an unofficial visit (a big no-no). At worst, they paid $25,000 for a RB.

Lyles sent video and gave information about recruits outside of the documents that he sent. Besides, how would paying too much for something be a cover-up anyway?

Thanking Lyles for his involvement to help recruits make it to an event does not demonstrate that Oregon paid $25k to get a visit. As far as we know, the athletes didn't receive any money and wanted to go on the visit on their own. Lyles just helped coordinate it. Who does that benefit? The athlete or Oregon?

The line is very clear. You don't pay money for outdated recruiting info. You don't say "I don't know a Willie Lyles" and then say "Oh but I do know a Will Lyles".

What you're saying isn't very clear. It's a violation to pay too much for something?

He said that he didn't know "Willie Lyles" because he knows him as "Will". I agree that is a questionable statement. But, it was in response to an anti-Oregon shock-jock. Not some official that he has an obligation to.