Hard nosed, intelligent, political discussion

You really think that the woman who pushed a plan to have the governement take over 1/7th of the economy via socialized medicine has a snowball's chance in hell of getting big business on board with her?

Now that you mention it, yes, I believe portions of Big Business would love Condi.

*She does have an oil tanker named after her.*

If our next President is going to be a Governor, then who will it be: Mike Huckabee of Arkansas, Ernie Fletcher of Kentucky, Mitch Romney of Massachusetts, Sonny Perdue of Georgia and possibly Rick Perry of Texas?
 
Sort of what I was thinking. Bush may be a Populist on some issues, but Populists typically don't have poll numbers in the low 40s. He's on the "bad" side of polls on a lot of issues like Iraq, the UAE ports deal, stem cell research etc.
 
Bush's poll numbers really only mean something to people who want another tool to bash him with. He is a lame duck. He will never again run for public office and he has so many millions in his blind trust that he can live like a king forever and not worry about who he pisses off. There is a school of thought that if Bush's poll numbers are low enough there could be a repeat of what we saw in 1994 where everyone was mad at Clinton and the Dems got turned out of congress. There is a little merit to this, but only a little. There a a couple of differences between 1994 and 2006.

First, in 1994 I distinctly remember that the congressional democrats defended Clinton, gave us the biggest tax increase in history, and appeared ready to support Hillary's federalization of health care. Therefore, it was very difficult for many democrat members of congress to put any distance between them and Clinton. So what's different now? The congressional republicans are not defending Bush. Many congressional republicans have made some calculated choices to take on their own president on immigration, drilling in the ANWAR, the Dubai Ports deal, and refusing to mess with MediCare. You cannot underestimate the importance of that last one, MediCare reform. That was going to be one of GW's big agenda items and it almost cost him re-election. Old people vote in droves and they tend to favor law and order and conservative "values" so long as you don't mess with their benefits. It's not going to be easy to tie the Bush bell around the necks of a lot of congressional republicans because they have done what they had to do to show that they are independent of the president.

Second, the cost of campaigns is rising steadily which enhnaces the advantages of incumbency. Few few congressional challengers are able to raise as much money as the incumbents. The DNC will target races where it thinks it can clip seats and heavily fund those candidates. Otherwise, most challengers will be on thier own. What a lot of people do not realize is that most challengers fund their campaigns out of their own pockets. Either the candidate has to be wealthy or they have to be able to be willing to personally borrow money in order to pay for their campaign. Incumbernts on the other hand have their war chests ready and through the power of PACs the republicans whop run unopposed will be able to shift money to republicans who are fighting for their seat. Money alone will not win you an election, but it is almost impossible to win without it. Right now the republicans have a lot more money to spend than the democrats.

Third, as usual this spring and summer will will see congressional votes on flag burning, abortion, prayer in schools, displaying the 10 commandments on gvt property, etc. none of it will mean anything but it will solidify and mobilize the hard core republican base to ensure that they show up and vote.

It's hard to say what will happen this fall but it's going to be fun to sit back and watch it unfold.
 
GAVol, sorry to correct you, Bush is not on the bad side of polls. If he were and they were true, then John Kerry would be in office right now. George Bush is on the bad side of the liberal media and their outlets who come up with the polls and then direct ant-Bush questions at them.

Read this column by Ann Coulter and you'll see what I mean:
Polls

Obviously not research, but opinion from Ann, but she does bring up some great points.
 
I find that the polls are not only laughable ways to create news, but they are also barometers for talking points with the dems. Sometimes I feel as though the press runs polls to decide where to attack the republican party next.

How many articles have ever been written by the Times, the Post, or the AP about how republicans can keep the power they have? I have perused countless articles about how the dems can gain ground in their struggle.

 
(Volunteer @ Mar 26 said:
GAVol, sorry to correct you, Bush is not on the bad side of polls.

Notice that I put the word bad in quotation marks.
 
runneth...you have to balance the media out somehow...besides, I never said it wasn't slanted toward the conservative side.

good point GaVol, i see it now.
 
The liberal media that's a joke you are only as liberal as the man who owns you and we all know massive corporations such as Time Warner, News corp etc are oh so liberal.
Oh and yes poll after poll after poll shows Bush slipping whether you want to believe it or not. And Rice getting the Gop nomination now I think we all know that is not realistic do you really think she is going to get gop votes in the south the same states that refuse to remove the confederate flag from their state flags. There is noway in hell she gets close to 15% of black vote much less 40%.
You want to say Hillary has balls but not Anne( am I part horse) coulter c'mon the transvestite on the surreal life looks more fem than it(coulter) does.
:eek:k:
 
The liberal media that's a joke you are only as liberal as the man who owns you and we all know massive corporations such as Time Warner, News corp etc are oh so liberal.

When I studied political science and journalism in college we were taught that liberal editorial staffs were necessary to counter-balance the conservative, pro-business leanings of publishers. Now most newspapers of large circulation are owned by corporations and not wealthy individuals or families. Corporations are controlled by stockholders and most large corporations are hyper-sensitive to any public outcry that will affect their stock value so they try to be as politically correct as possible. Last time I checked the journalism and poly-sci texts were still preaching the need for the liberal editorial slant even though the conservative, pro-business leanings of publishers doesn't really exist anymore (excepting Murdoch). Therefore, what we are left with is a corporate management structure that does not want to upset anyone because everyone is a potential customer and a pool of liberal biased jouralists who make the editoriual decisions regarding what to show and how to show it.

I think when most people are talking about bias in the media they are referring to television news. I would agree with you that Fox/Sky news is biased to the right, but I would also agree with the proposition that the three traditional major networks, PBS, and CNN are tilted the other way to varying degrees.


[/quote] Oh and yes poll after poll after poll shows Bush slipping whether you want to believe it or not. And Rice getting the Gop nomination now I think we all know that is not realistic do you really think she is going to get gop votes in the south the same states that refuse to remove the confederate flag from their state flags. There is noway in hell she gets close to 15% of black vote much less 40%. [/quote]

I've previously addressed the Bush poll number issue and not surpisingly Tim Russert and co. said pretty much the same thing I did on meet the press yesterday. Campaign money, distance from the president on issues of immigration, MediCare/Social Security, Dubai Ports, and the energy policy, and firing up the republican base with meaningless congressional votes on hot button social issues will probably keep the republicans in charge of the senate and the house when the dust settles this fall.

I think Colin Powell or Condelza Rice could get the republican nomination if they want it. Most republicans, like most democrats, want a candidate who will win. I think they will be looking for a centrist. I will agree that if the democrat primary voters are smart enough to nominate someone who republican voters could view as a centrist democrat like John Edwards, or maybe even Phil Bredesen, then racial attitudes might convince some people to vote for "the white guy", particualrly in southern states. However, IMO the democrat party is still under the control of their left wing and they will not be able to resist nominating Hillary. I know that it is hard for liberal idealouges to grasp this concept but most people, not just republicans but all people in this country, hate Hillary more than you hate Bush. If the democrats nominate Hillary then it is hard for me to think of a republican who could not defeat her, even Cheney!

[/quote] You want to say Hillary has balls but not Anne( am I part horse) coulter c'mon the transvestite on the surreal life looks more fem than it(coulter) does.
:eek:k:[/quote]

This is not really germane but typical of the left wing political stratgem. If you can't win an argument based on the facts then just hurl some insults and try to shout down your opponent.
 
(VolunteerHillbilly @ Mar 27 said:
When I studied political science and journalism in college we were taught that liberal editorial staffs were necessary to counter-balance the conservative, pro-business leanings of publishers. Now most newspapers of large circulation are owned by corporations and not wealthy individuals or families. Corporations are controlled by stockholders and most large corporations are hyper-sensitive to any public outcry that will affect their stock value so they try to be as politically correct as possible. Last time I checked the journalism and poly-sci texts were still preaching the need for the liberal editorial slant even though the conservative, pro-business leanings of publishers doesn't really exist anymore (excepting Murdoch). Therefore, what we are left with is a corporate management structure that does not want to upset anyone because everyone is a potential customer and a pool of liberal biased jouralists who make the editoriual decisions regarding what to show and how to show it.

I think when most people are talking about bias in the media they are referring to television news. I would agree with you that Fox/Sky news is biased to the right, but I would also agree with the proposition that the three traditional major networks, PBS, and CNN are tilted the other way to varying degrees.
Oh and yes poll after poll after poll shows Bush slipping whether you want to believe it or not. And Rice getting the Gop nomination now I think we all know that is not realistic do you really think she is going to get gop votes in the south the same states that refuse to remove the confederate flag from their state flags. There is noway in hell she gets close to 15% of black vote much less 40%.

I've previously addressed the Bush poll number issue and not surpisingly Tim Russert and co. said pretty much the same thing I did on meet the press yesterday. Campaign money, distance from the president on issues of immigration, MediCare/Social Security, Dubai Ports, and the energy policy, and firing up the republican base with meaningless congressional votes on hot button social issues will probably keep the republicans in charge of the senate and the house when the dust settles this fall.

I think Colin Powell or Condelza Rice could get the republican nomination if they want it. Most republicans, like most democrats, want a candidate who will win. I think they will be looking for a centrist. I will agree that if the democrat primary voters are smart enough to nominate someone who republican voters could view as a centrist democrat like John Edwards, or maybe even Phil Bredesen, then racial attitudes might convince some people to vote for "the white guy", particualrly in southern states. However, IMO the democrat party is still under the control of their left wing and they will not be able to resist nominating Hillary. I know that it is hard for liberal idealouges to grasp this concept but most people, not just republicans but all people in this country, hate Hillary more than you hate Bush. If the democrats nominate Hillary then it is hard for me to think of a republican who could not defeat her, even Cheney!

You want to say Hillary has balls but not Anne( am I part horse) coulter c'mon the transvestite on the surreal life looks more fem than it(coulter) does.
:eek:k:

This is not really germane but typical of the left wing political stratgem. If you can't win an argument based on the facts then just hurl some insults and try to shout down your opponent.
Sean Hannity, Bill Oreilly, Faux News in general I guess I learn from the best shouters in the buisiness.
To compare ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS to Fox news is a joke There has not been such propaganda from a so called news source since the fall of the USSR(Pravda) Roger Ailles President of Faux News SERVED UNDER NIXON and REGAN and PRODUCED RUSH LIMBAUGHS TV SHOW FAIR AND BALANCED MY ASS.
Oh and the insults started when they said Hillary had balls but you won't say anything to them will you thems' your boys on the same side as you.
WHAT A JOKE.
 
(VolunteerHillbilly @ Mar 27 said:
I think that if you ask social conservatives, of which I am not, they will tell you that when they first saw Fox News it was like some great veil had been lifted and they could finally stand to watch television news. There has always been a pro-liberal slant in our media and I think the thing that pisses so many people off about Fox is that it broke from the party line and now there is something out there that does not reinforce their beliefs, but some other value set that they disagree with.

I could care less about who said who has balls, looks like a horse, or whatever first but I think your retort backs up the point I made about liberal debate tactics. Thanks for playing. Maybe you can find someone on your intellectual level to argue with at your local Association for Retarded Citizens Club. (see how stupid that is?)
See now you are being disingenuous cause you do care or you would not mention it when I typed it did not have a damn thing to type when someone said Hillary had balls did you. Oh and by the way I do not know of many retarded citizens that carry a 135 IQ since that is impossible.
 
The funny thing I find about the media and right/left wing bias is that usually the truth is somewhere in the middle of it all yet the extreme-wings are just too blind to see it
 
I agree with the middle-of-the road assessment U-T. I think of myself as a middle-of-the-roader with some reactionary tendancies and some revolutionary tendancies. Sometimes you just get wrapped up in the "argument" in these threads.
 
Believe it or not I'm conservative on some issues mainly immigration or should I say illegal immigration. My favorite show on cable news is LOU DOBB'S I'd vote for him as president. Oh and by the way I'm not gonna vote Hillary in the primaries I think there will be better candidates to choose from.
:peace2:
 
Well, depending on who there is to choose from I could see myself voting for Bredesen for president but he is probably not well known enough to get nominated. Other Democrats who I would take a look at for 2008 include:
(1) Sen. Bill Nelson, FL
(2) Gov. Jim Doyle, WI
(3) Rep. Jim Matheson, UT
(4) Rep. Ben Chandler, KY

Of course we are talking about an election two and a half years away so who knows if these guys will be alive, in prision, etc. but ehy all seem to have some centrist appeal.
 
Hillary has the nomination wrapped up. When they made The Screamer chairmean of the Dem party the dems showed thier hand. Move the entire party to the "extreme scream" left to make Hillary appear to be centrist if not Republican-like. She's the Trojan Horse for 2008.
 
(TBALLVOL @ Mar 27 said:
Hillary has the nomination wrapped up. When they made The Screamer chairmean of the Dem party the dems showed thier hand. Move the entire party to the "extreme scream" left to make Hillary appear to be centrist if not Republican-like. She's the Trojan Horse for 2008.
heres a curveball for you....what if shes nominated then chooses Bill as her runningmate? Would make for some real debates.
 
(Volunteer @ Mar 21 said:
Milo,
This discussion will be interesting.

My question to you is why stop at homosexuality? How about bestiality? In your scenario, if it's all about the benefits, then why couldn't a man and a horse get married for the sole purpose of receiving benefits? Not bestiality? Why not, because it is against the law or because of moral standards. Do you see the dilemma?

Some may say I am sick for even bringing this into the discussion, but it is sick to whose standards. Would it not be a civil union??????

Horses have no rights under the U.S. constitution. People do. That's where you draw the line.
 
GPS tracking of car mileage.

Milo, you live in Oregon right? Here's an interesting article that you should read. I'll let you read it and then you tell me what you think about it. I'll be interested to hear anyone else who lives in Oregon and what they think.
 
(TBALLVOL @ Mar 27 said:
Hillary has the nomination wrapped up. When they made The Screamer chairmean of the Dem party the dems showed thier hand. Move the entire party to the "extreme scream" left to make Hillary appear to be centrist if not Republican-like. She's the Trojan Horse for 2008.

I hope she does get the nomination. As a conservative I see her as the lightning rod Dems should not put out there. If you thought the Repubs came out in 2004, just wait until she is on the ticket. There is not a more polarizing figure in American politics today. As for Dean, it absolutely amazes me what comes out of his mouth.
 

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