If Trump doesn't win in 2020, the church leaders will be murdered.

I didn’t want to entertain an idiotic statement. But it seems that I must respond now.

Let’s be clear. Donating money to charity, as considerate as it is, will not resolve the systemic issue that exists. Me “setting an example” by splitting my wealth with nurses will certainly not fix the issue, and goes against what I believe in. As shockingly enough, I believe in most aspects of capitalism, and I nor anyone else support a structure in which hard work is not rewarded. These ludicrous statements that any progressive must donate all their money to set an example is utterly ridiculous, and paints this false picture that socialism is guided on purely economic equality for all. This is utterly false. The purpose of socialism, from its origin was to serve as a critique of capitalism and address the flaws. I am not an advocate for outright socialism, nor do I believe any democratic candidate is, despite all of the candidates being labeled socialists (many of whom are far from a socialist ideologically). There is a systemic issue in which unregulated capitalism can lead to exploitation from the wealthy, and that our country has been dominated by corporate interests for decades. But unfortunately we live in a country in which individuals who want an objective conversation and who have a critique on capitalism are quickly labeled as “socialist extremist” or “Venezuela lovers”.

You want to raise taxes to enforce your ideals on others while claiming its ridiculous for you to put your money where your ideals are, at the most local level, before we entertain the conversation with you.

You poo poo the idea of personal charity, where i get to decide what ideals I will support, and level of personal responsibility i will demand before throwing my money into a hole. Yet you want to use the government to forcibly take my money to support your ideals. You dedicate your income to your ideals. Go ahead and exemplify.

PS you ignored the part about Bernie, his shtick, and his third lake house.
 
Single payer health care run by the government. -the V A is all the proof we need this is a bad idea.

Living wage- the minimum wage isn’t supposed to support people it’s an absolute base. The market should drive wages. We have employees at start at 12 dollars an hour as nobody would work for less. As people become more valuable they make more money. Bumping to 15 an hour would result in 2 layoffs from my company until the business stabilized. (We’ve already done the math) those jobs likely would not return for a few years. Even Bern cut hours when his people called him on his BS.

Income taxes on the rich.
The top 1% don’t have income. They made money on dividends and other non-taxable revenue sources. They know this. The rich democrats know this. That’s why most are unconcerned with the taxation talk.

A serious lack of fiscal discipline and a desire to spend money on free cheeses.
That’s everyone up there though.

I could continue but there’s literally nothing that Bernie says that I agree with.


It would be easier if you presented a Bernie issue you’d think I’d agree with and I’ll tell you why it’s crap.

I’m very curious as to which one of these Dem candidates want to answer the question .... So we are going to raise taxes , forgive student debt , medical coverage for all , raise the mw to either $15-$20 and hour , replace restrictions on businesses , what do you think your unemployment numbers and the economy will look like after your first two years in office and do you think you’ll be re-elected based off those results ?
 
I’m very curious as to which one of these Dem candidates want to answer the question .... So we are going to raise taxes , forgive student debt , medical coverage for all , raise the mw to either $15-$20 and hour , replace restrictions on businesses , what do you think your unemployment numbers and the economy will look like after your first two years in office and do you think you’ll be re-elected based off those results ?

I run a dept free business.
The only expense I have are employees.
I survived 2008 when a lot didn’t. When it goes south again I’ll cut employees and survive. Now things are good and I see company’s with new trucks and new buildings. I’m shaking my head thinking “you cannot do business like this is the norm, it will all slow down and all these guys will go broke chasing their dept, just like our country “.

But I digress

The answer would likely be some bailout proposal
 
When three individuals have more wealth than the poorest 160 million individuals combined. I would venture to say no amount of hard work can logically measure up to this much inequality in wealth.
Would you have gone to med school if the pay was equal to working on an assembly line in a manufacturing plant?

This mindset created the “social safety net” along with all of its problems.

Dependence on the government robs people of their motivation to do better for themselves and their children. There are families that have been on government assistance for multiple generations.

A permanent handout doesn’t help anyone help themselves.
 
Single payer health care run by the government. -the V A is all the proof we need this is a bad idea.

Living wage- the minimum wage isn’t supposed to support people it’s an absolute base. The market should drive wages. We have employees at start at 12 dollars an hour as nobody would work for less. As people become more valuable they make more money. Bumping to 15 an hour would result in 2 layoffs from my company until the business stabilized. (We’ve already done the math) those jobs likely would not return for a few years. Even Bern cut hours when his people called him on his BS.

Income taxes on the rich.
The top 1% don’t have income. They made money on dividends and other non-taxable revenue sources. They know this. The rich democrats know this. That’s why most are unconcerned with the taxation talk.

A serious lack of fiscal discipline and a desire to spend money on free cheeses.
That’s everyone up there though.

I could continue but there’s literally nothing that Bernie says that I agree with.


It would be easier if you presented a Bernie issue you’d think I’d agree with and I’ll tell you why it’s crap.

The VA is perfectly fine. Please spare me any anecdotal evidence of how bad the VA is.

The living wage is probably my least important resolution amongst all the issues, as some states will be hit hard by this.

Oh please let’s not act like that accounts for the entire 1%.
 
The VA is perfectly fine. Please spare me any anecdotal evidence of how bad the VA is.

The living wage is probably my least important resolution amongst all the issues, as some states will be hit hard by this.

Oh please let’s not act like that accounts for the entire 1%.


Sticking your head in the sand and pretending things are ok doesn’t make them ok.


The VA and our treatment of our veterans is a ****ing disaster.

I now understand you. Detached from reality and seeing the world as you’d like it to be.


Shalom
 
You want to raise taxes to enforce your ideals on others while claiming its ridiculous for you to put your money where your ideals are, at the most local level, before we entertain the conversation with you.

I would be happy to pay my fair share of taxes as individuals similar to my income. What you and others are asserting is that I must donate money to the poor to show that I want to help the poor. Because that's what socialism is entirely about, am I right? No. Simply untrue. It's as if you missed my message on the systemic issue.
No amount of individual charity work can fix a corrupt systemic issue.

You poo poo the idea of personal charity, where i get to decide what ideals I will support, and level of personal responsibility i will demand before throwing my money into a hole. Yet you want to use the government to forcibly take my money to support your ideals. You dedicate your income to your ideals. Go ahead and exemplify.

Forcibly take your money? They are already taking your money. How about we focus on infrastructure rather than a grossly disproportionate military budget? And if you are talking about medicare for all, you would be saving money despite an increase in taxes, due to savings from deductibles, premiums, and copays.

PS you ignored the part about Bernie, his shtick, and his third lake house.

Refer to my first point.
 
Sticking your head in the sand and pretending things are ok doesn’t make them ok.


The VA and our treatment of our veterans is a ****ing disaster.

I now understand you. Detached from reality and seeing the world as you’d like it to be.


Shalom

You're wrong. Do I need to send you information on why you are wrong?

Not sure what the Shalom is all about.
 
Would you have gone to med school if the pay was equal to working on an assembly line in a manufacturing plant?

This mindset created the “social safety net” along with all of its problems.

Dependence on the government robs people of their motivation to do better for themselves and their children. There are families that have been on government assistance for multiple generations.

A permanent handout doesn’t help anyone help themselves.

No one is saying that a physician needs to be paid as much as an assembly line worker.
 
You're wrong. Do I need to send you information on why you are wrong?

Not sure what the Shalom is all about.
You can keep your garage propaganda about the V A. My knowledge is personally observed on many occasions involving many different people. I know for a fact that the VA is **** and very poorly administered from extensive personal observation.

Shalom means “peace “

It can mean many things but in this case it means you’re Willfully ignorant on a topic I find important and conversation with you is no longer beneficial to you, me, or anyone reading along.
 
You can keep your garage propaganda about the V A. My knowledge is personally observed on many occasions involving many different people. I know for a fact that the VA is **** and very poorly administered from extensive personal observation.

Shalom means “peace “

It can mean many things but in this case it means you’re Willfully ignorant on a topic I find important and conversation with you is no longer beneficial to you, me, or anyone reading along.

You’re extremely perceptive
 
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I would be happy to pay my fair share of taxes as individuals similar to my income. What you and others are asserting is that I must donate money to the poor to show that I want to help the poor. Because that's what socialism is entirely about, am I right? No. Simply untrue. It's as if you missed my message on the systemic issue.

I'm pointing out the hypocrisy in your stance and the difference between your worldview and mine. Of course socialism isn't volunteerism. That's part of my point. Of course you don't want to personally support your ideals. You want everyone else to.

That's the point.

You are for socialism, which is forcibly taking my money to support your ideals. I am for volunteerism, where we all get to support our own ideals. You are claiming that your worldview is better by somehow convinving yourself that you don't have to support your ideals, and instead we all should.

I say kick rocks.

(And if you want to start curing the 1% wealth (not wage) gap, you'd be for abolishing the federal reserve and limiting gov't power. That's the first step in fixing the systemic issues, not giving the gov't more power to cash-grab from us.)

No amount of individual charity work can fix a corrupt systemic issue.

No amount of socialism has ever worked. Ever. Anywhere.

You just want to give the government more power over me by giving it more responsibility for everyone.

Again, as a small gov't libertarian, I say kick rocks and support your own ideals. You'll be a doctor. You'll make huge earning potential, be able to live incredibly modestly and make a huge local impact. Your heart seems to be in a decent place. Let your wallet follow

Forcibly take your money? They are already taking your money. How about we focus on infrastructure rather than a grossly disproportionate military budget? And if you are talking about medicare for all, you would be saving money despite an increase in taxes, due to savings from deductibles, premiums, and copays.



Refer to my first point.

I'm for shrinking the budget radically, including gutting the good ol' boy military complex, military spending, etc...

Now, ss to your last point about them already forcibly taking my money. That's the point. You're a doctor. Let's see if that same logic works elsewhere.

"There's a little **** in your patient's IV. What do we do about it?"

"That's obvious. Put more **** in it."

If that's the logic you use, get on and post which hospital you go to work in so we can all go somewhere else.
 
Last edited:
You can keep your garage propaganda about the V A. My knowledge is personally observed on many occasions involving many different people. I know for a fact that the VA is **** and very poorly administered from extensive personal observation.

Shalom means “peace “

It can mean many things but in this case it means you’re Willfully ignorant on a topic I find important and conversation with you is no longer beneficial to you, me, or anyone reading along.

Lol. Wow that's some quality anecdotal evidence.

I'll just go ahead and drop some links.

Poll: Veterans oppose plans to 'privatize' VA

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outl...ory.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.309c0f920915

Is the VA really that bad - seriously consider this question. : Veterans

I would hardly call the VA a distaster. Especially considering that the majority of veterans still oppose any plans to privatize despite the disastrous conditions.
Veterans worry that private insurance companies care too much about profit and would make decisions for the care of veterans based on money."
So please spare me with your anecdotal observations. As mileage may vary.
 
I'm pointing out the hypocrisy in your stance and the difference between your worldview and mine. Of course socialism isn't volunteerism. That's part of my point. Of course you don't want to personally support your ideals. You want everyone else to.

That's the point.

You are for socialism, which is forcibly taking my money to support your ideals. I am for volunteerism, where we all get to support our own ideals. You are claiming that your worldview is better by somehow convinving yourself that you don't have to support your ideals, and instead we all should.

I say kick rocks.

(And if you want to start curing the 1% wealth (not wage) gap, you'd be for abolishing the federal reserve and limiting gov't power. That's the first step in fixing the systemic issues, not giving the gov't more power to cash-grab from us.)



No amount of socialism has ever worked. Ever. Anywhere.

You just want to give the government more power over me by giving it more responsibility for everyone.

Again, as a small gov't libertarian, I say kick rocks and support your own ideals. You'll be a doctor. You'll make huge earning potential, be able to live incredibly modestly and make a huge local impact. Your heart seems to be in a decent place. Let your wallet follow



I'm for shrinking the budget radically, including gutting the good ol' boy military complex, military spending, etc...

Now, ss to your last point about them already forcibly taking my money. That's the point. You're a doctor. Let's see if that same logic works elsewhere.

"There's a little **** in your patient's IV. What do we do about it?"

"That's obvious. Put more **** in it."

If that's the logic you use, get on and post which hospital you go to work in so we can all go somewhere else.

Lots of odd analogies in here. Nontheless you and I have different viewpoints and that is fair. But I have to ask you this. Do you think that healthcare is a privilege or a right?
 
Lots of odd analogies in here. Nontheless you and I have different viewpoints and that is fair. But I have to ask you this. Do you think that healthcare is a privilege or a right?

I think it's a privilege. We live in a fallen creation that groans for redemption, where the wages of sin is death. We'll have the poor with us always. There will always be suffering. We will all die. Nothing will stop that. None of us have the right, nor the ability, to escape that. You're seeking an unobtainable utopia.

Now, I make extremely good money. My wife and I, while making really good money, have lived a modvery modest lifestyle, so we have a life where we own our own home/property, vehicles, etc, completely out of debt. I could literally stop working and go into full time ministry for a LOT less $$$, but I don't because we live this modest lifestyle in a very charitable way.

I don't say that to get any honor, as I don't want it. I say that to assure you that we put our money where our ideals are. I don't feel that healthcare or equal in come is a right at all. I reaffirm that we live in a bad world where bad happens, but that doesn't stop us from trying to alleviate the hurt, harm, suffering and death as much as we humanly can.

And we do have differing viewpoints. You are admittedly not passionate enough about the income gap to find some level at which you can personally and locally create equity with others, but you are passionate enough to steal from the innocent in order to make yourself feel better about the world. You'd use the government the way a common criminal uses a gun in a dark alley. You'd use the government to take money from others by force and threat.

You're not willing to give until it hurts to create equity, but you'll use the catch phrases to shake everyone else down.

I won't even tell you how much taxes I paid last year. Tens and tens of 1000s of dollars that the gov't took before I even saw it. That's 10s and 10s of 1000s of dollars that we couldn't volunteer to help others, but was used for the military complex, welfare programs to literally breed generational poverty with little or no responsibility tied to the handouts. And that was just Feds. The state got theirs. The county. The city.

The federal tax money has a % used on what are probably good intentioned programs, but how much money gets syphoned into black programs? How much gets "lost" every year? How much gets misdirected as crony capitalism?

The gov't is the system that is creating the wealth gap--forcibly taking money from us through taxes and spreading it among the elite. Yet you want to argue for giving the government more responsibility, more power, and more access to our money in the name of income equality.

And to top it off, your logic for all this is, "We live in a crime-ridden neighborhood where the criminals are already mugging you every day in the alleys, why not just agree to get more forcibly mugged more often?" "They're raping you already, a gang rape sounds even better, huh?"

Yah. We see things differently.

You go show what you're willing to do with your income. You go prove your dedication and then come back for a chat.
 
Lol. Wow that's some quality anecdotal evidence.

I'll just go ahead and drop some links.

Poll: Veterans oppose plans to 'privatize' VA

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outl...ory.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.309c0f920915

Is the VA really that bad - seriously consider this question. : Veterans

I would hardly call the VA a distaster. Especially considering that the majority of veterans still oppose any plans to privatize despite the disastrous conditions. So please spare me with your anecdotal observations. As mileage may vary.

Wa post.
Awesome

No leftist ******** propaganda there.
 
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I run a dept free business.
The only expense I have are employees.
I survived 2008 when a lot didn’t. When it goes south again I’ll cut employees and survive. Now things are good and I see company’s with new trucks and new buildings. I’m shaking my head thinking “you cannot do business like this is the norm, it will all slow down and all these guys will go broke chasing their dept, just like our country “.

But I digress

The answer would likely be some bailout proposal
I applaud you. You remind me of me.
 
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I can get a CT for my dog same at the vet but my brother Had to wait 3 weeks on the VA. Instead we paid out of pocket local. (The same day that we decided not to wait)

Gaaawwwd help us if these morons elect someone like Bernie.
 

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