Is the SEC still a “southern” conference?

#126
#126
the lost33 said:
I’m talking about modern day. Not 160 years ago. And both KY and MO had confederate governments, soldiers, and stars on the battle flag. Lincoln did some clever political maneuvering to convince those states to stay loyal. And if need be. He was rolling into the state, to arrest the legislature. Like he did in Maryland. In Kentucky the unionist position was “slavery was in the union for 100 years. It’s better protected in the union than a risky confederacy”. Kentucky realized it got duped in about 1863. But it was too late then. The state was occupied and martial law was imposed in 1864, due to Kentuckians becoming confederate guerrillas.


It wasn’t about feeling northern or southern. It was a political decision. Kentucky and Missouri thought staying loyal would protect slavery. It didn’t.
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Kentucky and Missouri will never be southern.

They’re just a buffer state. There are some southerners in those states, as happens on a border. Until you see Southerners in Ohio, Kentucky isn’t Southern.
 
#127
#127
VFL-82-JP said:
I think you need better sources. :)

Southerners aren't defined by religious extremism, misogyny, or racism, no matter how much some Northerners would like to paint us in those colors.

Go Vols!
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FYI, Maxwell is Southern. That said, you are correct that the South is much more diverse than those characteristics suggest. That said, these are characteristics of the region’s dominant ideology — regardless of how much you might convince yourself otherwise.

The South is all of these things and more. There are lotsa good people here but the dominant regional identity conceals that diversity.
 
#129
#129
#131
#131
the lost33 said:
With the inclusion of Texas, Oklahoma, and Missouri. Is the SEC still a culturally southern conference?
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All of the states with current SEC teams were represented by stars on the confederate flag (MO and KY had stars), except OK which was then an Indian Territory. Being part of the Confederate States is nothing to brag about but most people would consider that pretty southern.
 
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#132
#132
Vol865 said:
Based on a map....yes. Why wouldn't Texas and Oklahoma be culturally southern? Missouri is an anomaly
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Not that much when you consider where the school is (in Southern Rural Missouri which is like the South. Heck it is closer to Branson than St Louis).

UK is actually the most northern school in the SEC.
 
#134
#134
volbound1700 said:
Not that much when you consider where the school is (in Southern Rural Missouri which is like the South. Heck it is closer to Branson than St Louis).

UK is actually the most northern school in the SEC.
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Friend, Mizzou is in Columbia, which is midway between St Louis and Kansas City. It's in the northern half of that state. And is well north of Lexington, where UK resides.

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#135
#135
njvols said:
Was curious how NC was left out of SEC, and searched...interesting that I think the size of SEC is getting to the point where history could be repeated in some form in the future...

Dr. William Dudley, a chemistry professor at Vanderbilt, answered the call for an affiliation of southern schools. Representatives from seven schools—Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Georgia Tech, North Carolina, Sewanee, and Vanderbilt—met Dudley on December 22, 1894 at the Kimball House in Atlanta to form the Southern Intercollegiate Athletic Association (SIAA), the grandfather of the SEC. The SIAA was formed, according to Dr. Dudley, to provide faculty regulation and control of all college athletics. A year later, 12 more schools were added, including Clemson, Kentucky, LSU, Mississippi, Mississippi State, Tennessee, Texas, and Tulane.

The SIAA held together through the 1920 season. At the annual conference on December 10, 1920, a disagreement among the schools took place. The smaller SIAA schools, through their collective vote, passed a rule allowing freshmen players to compete immediately with the varsity and voted down a proposition to abolish a rule that allowed athletes to play summer baseball for money. Additionally, the SIAA had reached 30 members making it very difficult for the schools to play one another and crown a true champion. Led by University of Georgia English professor Dr. S.V. Sanford, 18 schools left to form the Southern Intercollegiate Conference (Southern Conference) on February 25, 1921 in Atlanta. At that point, the SIAA became a conference for small colleges and eventually disbanded in 1942.

The Southern Conference grew to 23 schools by 1932. Again, the league was too big. Dr. Sanford convinced the 13 schools west and south of the Appalachian Mountains—Alabama, Auburn, Florida, Georgia, Georgia Tech, Kentucky, LSU, Mississippi, Mississippi State, Sewanee, Tennessee, Tulane, Vanderbilt–to reorganize as the Southeastern Conference. Play began in 1933. By December 1953, eight other schools—Clemson, Duke, Maryland, North Carolina, North Carolina State, South Carolina, Virginia, Wake Forest—had left the Southern Conference to form the Atlantic Coast Conference. The Southern Conference survives to this day.
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Yeah, the history is out there for people to read.

Interestingly, the SIAA also fell apart initially because Vandy accused Alabama of cheating in Baseball... somethings never change.

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#136
#136
VFL-82-JP said:
Friend, Mizzou is in Columbia, which is midway between St Louis and Kansas City. It's in the northern half of that state. And is well north of Lexington, where UK resides.

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For some reason, I thought it was in the South near Branson. (You can't get more Southern than Branson). Yeah, Northern Missouri is pretty Midwestern in Culture and location.

EDIT: It is Springfield (the Capital of the state) that is in the South near Branson. That was what threw me off.
 
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#138
#138
volbound1700 said:
For some reason, I thought it was in the South near Branson. (You can't get more Southern than Branson). Yeah, Northern Missouri is pretty Midwestern in Culture and location.

EDIT: It is Springfield (the Capital of the state) that is in the South near Branson. That was what threw me off.
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Please go back and review your state capitols. Springfield Missouri is NOT the capital of Missouri.
 
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#139
#139
volbound1700 said:
For some reason, I thought it was in the South near Branson. (You can't get more Southern than Branson). Yeah, Northern Missouri is pretty Midwestern in Culture and location.

EDIT: It is Springfield (the Capital of the state) that is in the South near Branson. That was what threw me off.
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That's, um, not the capital of Missouri.
 
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#142
#142
VFL-82-JP said:
Coal's not big in east Tennessee. At least, not the way it is big (and I mean HUGE...culture-defining) in West Virginia, Ohio, and Pennsylvania.

I would think West Virginians would identify more with the midwest, particularly those two states, than the south. I get that "rural culture" and "Appalachian culture" are often seen as parts of "southern culture", but they're not really the same. You can be a country boy in Nebraska, a dairy farmer in Wisconsin, or an Appalachian in the Catskill Mountains of upstate New York, but you're certainly not southern.
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Other than some residual immigrant culture, coal's got very little to do with it. There's coal in Colorado, Wyoming, and China too. People in Rainelle, Beckley, or Greenbrier Co. WV are pretty Southern in my experience.
 
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#145
#145
woodpusher said:
There's one in New Orleans. Apart from being Catholic, I don't believe it's connected to any of the others.
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Thinking about it, and not meaning any disrespect to the Catholic Faith, if a state has a major Catholic University, it's not a Southern state.

Again, no disrespect, it's just part of noticing that despite DC being below the Mason-Dixon, Georgetown and Catholic University of America simply couldn't be further from the South.
 
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#146
#146
SayUWantAreVOLution said:
Thinking about it, and not meaning any disrespect to the Catholic Faith, if a state has a major Catholic University, it's not a Southern state.

Again, no disrespect, it's just part of noticing that despite DC being below the Mason-Dixon, Georgetown and Catholic University of America simply couldn't be further from the South.
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Maryland is historically Southern and Louisiana still is very much Southern. There are a whole lot of Catholics in Mississippi too.
 
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#148
#148
EasternVol said:
Maryland is historically Southern and Louisiana still is very much Southern. There are a whole lot of Catholics in Mississippi too.
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Maryland of the past was definitely Southern but there really isn't much "Southern" about Maryland today. Ohio is more Southern than Maryland in the modern era. Virginia has also lost a lot of its Southern. Ironically, the South and the Midwest (Ohio, Indiana, Iowa, Nebraska, etc.) seem to be coming together culturally while the Northeast Atlantic down to Virginia seems to be a different culture.
 
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#149
#149
volbound1700 said:
Maryland of the past was definitely Southern but there really isn't much "Southern" about Maryland today. Ohio is more Southern than Maryland in the modern era. Virginia has also lost a lot of its Southern. Ironically, the South and the Midwest (Ohio, Indiana, Iowa, Nebraska, etc.) seem to be coming together culturally while the Northeast Atlantic down to Virginia seems to be a different culture.
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The demographics have certainly changed in Virginia and Maryland with the expansion of the federal government since the Reagan era. Eastern Shore Maryland and some rural areas west of DC are still fairly Southern.
 
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