Islam, is it a religion of peace or war?

[BigO95]

Really? Aquinas and Augustine, two of arguably the greatest Christian thinkers endorsed wholesale persecution, torture, and murder of Jews and heretics. All while quoting chapter and verse.

Do I think Islamic doctrine has more to overcome than Christian doctrine? Absolutely. But if Christianity can stumble past burning people alive and driving stakes through bodies, I don’t see why Islam can’t either.

Christianity has Jewish roots, Jesus is a Jew. So it's not too hard to recognize a heritic like Augustine.
Your welcome.

 

[DynaLo]

It has been a few years since I've read the Quaran, but initially Islam was a religion of peace until their prophet was rejected by the Jews. The change in tone and verse reads like he got his feels hurt and went totally opposite extreme with kill them all.

The mistake "infidels" commonly make when trying to reassure themselves that Islam cannot possibly be as hideous as it seems is to interpret the earlier and milder Mecca verses as if they were as valid a part of the whole as the latter vicious Medina verses. They are not, and Islamic theology has “abrogated” these milder verses as not being the last, and therefore dominating, commands of Allah, and therefore invalid.

 

[Wafflestomper]

Jesus taught us to do unto others as you would have them do unto you. There is no qualifier there, and gays would fall under "others".

Paul tells us to "live peaceably with all men". Again, there is no qualifier there. Gays would be included in the group "all men".

No where in the NT are we told to "kill gays". Any supposed "Christian"' who kills gays isn't following Jesus. We are supposed to lead them to Christ via example and teaching in love. Violence should never be part of the equation if we are to follow the teachings of Jesus.

I've not heard of exclusive NT Christianity. Do you not recognize the authority of the OT?

However, Christians killing gays are simply following what the Bible tells them to.

FTFY

If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

 

[Matt2496]

I've not heard of exclusive NT Christianity. Do you not recognize the authority of the OT?



FTFY

I always thought Christians followed the teachings of Jesus.

My mistake.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

Same devils behind every false religion.

Same God.

 

[Wafflestomper]

I always thought Christians followed the teachings of Jesus.

My mistake.

I've always heard that the Bible has no contradictions. My mistake.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

What’s the difference between a false religion and a true religion?

All in the eyes of the believers.

 

[marcusluvsvols]

I appreciate it. Read your post. Think i understand your perspective. I just disagree. I may be wrong because I am not a scholar. If I am wrong, i will be happy to learn the truth.
I understand Allah to be their name for God. Not a god. But THE Great I Am God. Imo, Mohammed is a false prophet who created a religion counter to God's will.

To an extent, I agree with you McDad...and i could be wrong blaming it primarily on Ishmael, and his jealousy of Isaac and Jacob. It could very well be that Ishmael was raised as a Jew, and worshipped our God...most of the Old Testament is contained in the Quran. If that is the case, then islam was merely a sect of Judaism until it was completely bastardized by muhammed, who in no way teaches the same messages of God, or Jesus. Also, 600 years between Christ and muhammed is a very, very long time. Whether it was Ishmael, or muhammed that completely destroyed that religion, and made it a religion of violence, intentional deception, rape , murder, and conquest really isnt the important part though. The important part is that it happened...and when they added all the hate and violence to their doctrine...at that very moment it became a tool of satan, and not of God in any way, shape, or form.

To Jews, the only way to get to God, and to Heaven, is to live their lives as best they can according to the 10 commandments, the mosaic Law, and to make ritual sacrifices and practices to cleanse themselves of sin. Then they are judged according to those sins and if good enough, go to Heaven where they receive a new heavenly body, and spend eternity in bliss, praising and serving God.

To Christians, same code and laws, e cept for those that changed according to Jesus teachings. (No more kosher food, etc) but we rely on our faith in Christ, and he steps in at our judgment, to cover for our sins. He is the perfect sacrifice, no other is needed. Go to the same Heaven, to do the same for the same God.

To muslims, all their good deeds, and all their bad deeds are weighed on a great scale by their god. If they have 1 more good deed than bad, and it tips the scale to good, they are allowed into their heaven..apparently a great orgy for men to enjoy themselves. Unless, they kill themselves in Jihad, as a suicide bomber etc...in which case none of their sins even matter...and they are rewarded with 46 virgin females...which i have no idea how they got into heaven, or died as virgins, but its not my fairy tale...sp then the men get to have a great orgy with 46 virgins, who are somehow supposed to still be in what is heaven for them, as sex slaves to otherwise garbage men who strapped on a vest. And their god, and their prophet, is cool with giving all the women and virgins the shaft like that. No justice at all.

Do you see how my God and their god cannot possibly be the same god? There is zero sex ever mentioned in Christian Heaven, and we are told that we all have new bodies, likely not even human, since we will feel no sadness, pain, shame, self consciousness, "i am too short, or too fat, or too skinny, etc"...there really are zero similarities betweem their god and my God, or their heaven and my Heaven.

It doesn't really matter when their religion went off the rails...with Ishmael or many hundreds of years later with muhammed. The important part is their religion is about hate, rape, murder. and women and children are possessions, treated like trash. Christianity is about love...for God, our neighbors, and even our enemies...and women are to be loved the way that Christ loved the church, which means to self sacrificially give everything for them. Children are to be treated as a priceless gift, loved and nurtured, not provoked to wrath or anger.

Their beliefs run counter to all that we believe. Their god is against the beliefs of our God...and therefore islam is without a doubt a tool of the devil. If there are over 1 billion muslims on this planet, then islam is responsible for a billion people going to Hell for rejecting Christ...and is a huge tool of satan.

Their religion of hate is not in any way compatible with western culture and life.

 

[joevol33]

Christians in Africa routinely kill gays. Where is the public condemnation for what the Bible teaches?

Blacks in Africa still own slaves, Muslims everywhere else kill gays. Why deflect and refuse to answer my question? Do you condemn what islam extremist teach? nobody from the left cries about today's slavery.

 

[joevol33]

My God has asked me not to judge others. I don't like some Muslim beliefs and actions but who am I to condemn the entire religion? There are Christians in this country who kill in God's name. Besides, I'll be damned lucky if I make it to my own paradise someday.

So it's okay to judge christians, but not Muslims?

 

[Purple Tiger]

So it's okay to judge christians, but not Muslims?

Did I judge Christians? Or anybody? I stated a fact, not a judgement.

 

[Purple Tiger]

Christianity has Jewish roots, Jesus is a Jew. So it's not too hard to recognize a heritic like Augustine.
Your welcome.

Augustine was not Jewish. He was African.

 

[Purple Tiger]

You are dead wrong, allah is not the God of the Bible, of aisaac and jacob. Just because Ishmael was the illegitimate son of Abraham does not make allah the same God. Period. Just because people call the 3 major religions "Abrahamic" does not make the 2 gods the same being. Period. Quit spreading lies...any and I mean ANY BIBLE SCHOLAR or even religious scholar will tell you that they are not the same god.

Let me make an analogy, and then maybe, just maybe, once and for all you, hog, and all these other confused people will understand once and for all.

You are my brother. Abraham is our dad. We are raised Jewish, and believe in the real God. Later in life, Christ comes. I believe in him. You do not. You keep practicing Judaism, nothing changes. Same God
I become a Christian. Worship same God as you...i just believe that he sent his Son, and He has already come and died. I am waiting for the Messiah to come back, for the 2nd time. You are waiting for him to come the 1st time...but still we both worship the same God...a God of peace and Love. Overwhelming message to love everyone, even our enemies. Good so far?


Well. Come to find out...Dad had a concubine on the side. He got her pregnant, and made some dbag named Ishmael. Ishmael hates dad, and everything about him because he is shunned, and has no birthrights to all the riches of dads kingdom like you and I do. Ishmael CREATES HIS OWN RELIGION , HIS OWN GOD...that is nothing like our God. Their holy book is full of hate, and tells them to kill all the descendants of you...and me. They have their own prophet...mentioned nowhere in the Bible, unlike Jesus who is foretold many times in the OT....he marries a 6 year old girl, rapes and kills, and makes up his own set of rules. For everything...how to treat women, to kill gays and everyone except muslims, even an entirely different concept 0F A DIFFERENT HEAVEN, AND AN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT MEANS OF GETTING THERE...there are almost zero similarities between the fictional made up religion of ishmael and his prophet and yours and mine religion which only differs about the messiah
We have religions of peace and love, he has a religion of hate and murder, and rape of women and children...supposedly all told to Ishmael by HIS GOD and HIS PROPHET about 600 years after Christ walked on earth.


Now...can yall see finally that just because your dad and my dad, Abraham...is the biological father of Ishmael that in no way does that make HIS GOD the same God as yours or mine? No more than it makes his religion the same reliogion as yours or mine...or anything about him the same as us...the only thing that is the same is that Abraham impregnated the women that gave birth to all 3 of us. That is all.

Please quit lying tp yourself and others and saying that his god is our God...it absolutely is not. If you want to remain ignorant about something that you obviously have very little knowledge of, please keep it to yourself.

Sorry, Charlie. Look it up online in Wikipedia or a real encyclopedia. It is the same God. I have a MDiv and have studied this. You have been reading henhouse books and websites. If a preacher told that to you, they were lying.

 

[Purple Tiger]

Would you consider Crusaders fundamentalist Christians?

There were no Fundamentalist Christians until the 1900s. The Crusaders were all Catholics.

 

[McDad]

Do you see how my God and their god cannot possibly be the same god? There is zero sex ever mentioned in Christian Heaven, and we are told that we all have new bodies, likely not even human, since we will feel no sadness, pain, shame, self consciousness, "i am too short, or too fat, or too skinny, etc"...there really are zero similarities betweem their god and my God, or their heaven and my Heaven.

It doesn't really matter when their religion went off the rails...with Ishmael or many hundreds of years later with muhammed. The important part is their religion is about hate, rape, murder. and women and children are possessions, treated like trash. Christianity is about love...for God, our neighbors, and even our enemies...and women are to be loved the way that Christ loved the church, which means to self sacrificially give everything for them. Children are to be treated as a priceless gift, loved and nurtured, not provoked to wrath or anger.

Their beliefs run counter to all that we believe. Their god is against the beliefs of our God...and therefore islam is without a doubt a tool of the devil. If there are over 1 billion muslims on this planet, then islam is responsible for a billion people going to Hell for rejecting Christ...and is a huge tool of satan.

Their religion of hate is not in any way compatible with western culture and life.

Of course I see how the God of our Savior is different from Allah. And in that context, Allah is not I Am. The teachings and practices in Islam are not the teachings of Christ (God in flesh).
God doesn't change, though. He is the Alpha and Omega. Others can corrupt His divine authority and preach a gospel of hate. But God will always be Love.

I think this is who Muslims are referencing when they call Him Allah. They've got His word wrong. They've got His Love wrong. They've got His path to heaven wrong.

My kids call me dad. My father called me son. They see me differently. But i am still the same one.

 

[82_VOL_83]

The ideology is very problematic in most interpretations. Thankfully the majority of Muslims are not radical extremists and pose no threat to us, especially the ones that live in our country.

I'm sure some scared pussy will tell me how wrong I am and that they are all terrorists or terrorist supporters.

I'm always right, but I'm sure some stupid, mouth breathing idiot will tell you I am wrong.

SMFH.

 

[82_VOL_83]

There were no Fundamentalist Christians until the 1900s. The Crusaders were all Catholics.

A conveniently overlooked fact. Therefore one has to ask themselves, why do muslims dislike America so much? We aren't all Catholics so we can't be held responsible for the Crusades.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

A conveniently overlooked fact. Therefore one has to ask themselves, why do muslims dislike America so much? We aren't all Catholics so we can't be held responsible for the Crusades.

We've killed a half million, give or take, Muslims in the last 20 years or so.

 

[DynaLo]

A conveniently overlooked fact. Therefore one has to ask themselves, why do muslims dislike America so much? We aren't all Catholics so we can't be held responsible for the Crusades.

We stand beside and support Israel and those of Jewish faith, their sworn enemy above all others.

 

[marcusluvsvols]

Sorry, Charlie. Look it up online in Wikipedia or a real encyclopedia. It is the same God. I have a MDiv and have studied this. You have been reading henhouse books and websites. If a preacher told that to you, they were lying.

Nah, you are mistaken. No religion that sends billions of people to Hell is of my god, and when they made up their prophet, their supposedly holy book, and corrupted His Word, they became a religion of antiChrists, or those against Christ. God is the Word. The great I AM. Their god and my God are not the same entitity. Billions will go to Hell because of worshipping allah and muhammed, as we are commanded in the 10 that " we shall have no other gods before Him."

My dad graduated from Carson Newman BTW, and he disagreed with you. What are the last words in the Bible? A solemn warning, not to add to or change the Word of God, lest anyone be led astray. When muslims added to and changed the Word, they became heretics and antiChrists. It is very sad, as many are very devout and disciplined. Christians would do well to take their faith as seriously as the muslims generally do, myself included.

 

[joevol33]

Did I judge Christians? Or anybody? I stated a fact, not a judgement.

How is saying murder is wrong judging? I guarantee you have no problem saying that the white guy in New Zealand was wrong, but you can't say it's wrong for islam to teach murder? I have asked countless times for one of you to say it's wrong, and not one will do it. You respond with "but Christians ", or "I can't judge". Simple question with a yes or no answer, not some lame excuse or deflection. Is it wrong to teach killing gay's, and those who don't convert to Islam, yes or no? That's not judging.

 

[Wafflestomper]

Blacks in Africa still own slaves, Muslims everywhere else kill gays. Why deflect and refuse to answer my question? Do you condemn what islam extremist teach? nobody from the left cries about today's slavery.

I don't think I'm deflecting anything. I'm not an Islamic scholar but I would condemn any call for violence or slavery that it makes. Can you now condemn the Bible for commanding the killing of gays?

 

[joevol33]

I don't think I'm deflecting anything. I'm not an Islamic scholar but I would condemn any call for violence or slavery that it makes. Can you now condemn the Bible for commanding the killing of gays?

It's been mentioned, but Jesus changed everything, and Christians don't preach that, and I don't agree that's it's right to kill them. Unlike their even moderates, they teach they should die today. But bravo for finally one of you saying it.

 

[T-TownVol]

I don't think I'm deflecting anything. I'm not an Islamic scholar but I would condemn any call for violence or slavery that it makes. Can you now condemn the Bible for commanding the killing of gays?

You continue to plant your flag on a hill that was "washed" away.

 

[DynaLo]

Nah, you are mistaken. No religion that sends billions of people to Hell is of my god, and when they made up their prophet, their supposedly holy book, and corrupted His Word, they became a religion of antiChrists, or those against Christ. God is the Word. The great I AM. Their god and my God are not the same entitity. Billions will go to Hell because of worshipping allah and muhammed, as we are commanded in the 10 that " we shall have no other gods before Him."

My dad graduated from Carson Newman BTW, and he disagreed with you. What are the last words in the Bible? A solemn warning, not to add to or change the Word of God, lest anyone be led astray. When muslims added to and changed the Word, they became heretics and antiChrists. It is very sad, as many are very devout and disciplined. Christians would do well to take their faith as seriously as the muslims generally do, myself included.

Did you intend that to come across as arrogant as all get out? Because it does. What makes your beliefs the correct ones and the only ones that count?

The original bible verses were written in ancient Hebrew, ancient Aramaic and common Greek that were then all translated into Greek by Alexander the Great.

The original Catholic version, in Latin, that was in use for over 1400 years was a 4th century translation. The Catholic Bible contains more books than the Christian version although they did a pick and choose of books.

In 1611 the King James version was translated from Hebrew and Aramaic to conform to the tenants of the Anglican denomination. Seeing as Aramaic was replaced by Arabic in 650 AD, who in England was actually fluent enough in it to accurately translate it?

The Quaran was written in western Arabic as Mohammed was from Mecca and it's usually written in eastern Arabic, so there may be translation issues there as well.

How can anybody stand up and say my way is the only way? Relying on translations of translations that all had agendas of power behind them is a shaky platform.