Israel vs Palestinians

[KB5252]

You've just discovered that?
But then they're still around. After almost a year and a half it seems like the IDF would have been able to defeat them by now. If they were really trying to and not just trying to make Gaza unlivable that is.

The fact that these Hamas members are still living is just as likely because they are deep underground, likely sheltering under large groups of civilians.

I'm also sure your at least partly correct, that the destruction of Gaza, at least in part, is retribution for Oct7th.

 

[Smokey123]

No one said there were “over 1 million Gazans” kidnapping and killing Jews. That’s a strawman.

There’s 2 million gazans. The majority has been thrown around this thread on numerous occasions.

 

[Smokey123]

Some women and children in “rare footage” ain’t it.

There’s multiple different situations. Again. Sorry you live in a western bubble. But glad you enjoy watching Hamas propaganda

 

[85SugarVol]

There’s 2 million gazans. The majority has been thrown around this thread on numerous occasions.

There are far more providing support than pushing back. You classifying that as “1 million Gazans” is disingenuous, and an easy strawman to attack.

 

[85SugarVol]

There’s multiple different situations. Again. Sorry you live in a western bubble. But glad you enjoy watching Hamas propaganda

Oh yea, the list of notable protests against Hamas ideology and mission just goes on and on.

 

[Smokey123]

There are far more providing support than pushing back. You classifying that as “1 million Gazans” is disingenuous, and an easy strawman to attack.

Show me numbers. I’ve asked and you’ve yet to do that. Sorry you see videos that are literally filmed by Hamas and based your opinion off that

 

[Smokey123]

Oh yea, the list of notable protests against Hamas ideology and mission just goes on and on.

Lack of protest doesn’t equal support, Nor does it mean they aren’t against them. I’m sure the thousands of women that stay with abusers don’t divorce because they support the abuse. That’s the logic you’re using it’s ridiculous.

You just expect hundreds of thousands of Gazans in the street while rockets are flying over their head and Hamas killing them? Tf kind of logic is that

 

[Smokey123]

There are far more providing support than pushing back. You classifying that as “1 million Gazans” is disingenuous, and an easy strawman to attack.

And btw this same conversation was had a few weeks ago. You said the majority of gazans support Hamas actions. Which would mean over a million. But continue to say it’s a strawman. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt though and assume you just didn’t know there were over 2 million people in Gaza

 

[85SugarVol]

Show me numbers. I’ve asked and you’ve yet to do that. Sorry you see videos that are literally filmed by Hamas and based your opinion off that

There are no numbers supporting this notion of widespread pushback. Just a smattering of women and children in what, a few isolated events. Nothing of substance. Nothing of weight.

We have video of widespread celebration after 10/7.
We have actual accounts of citizens hiding hostages.
Gawking at dead Jews in caskets.

 

[85SugarVol]

Lack of protest doesn’t equal support, Nor does it mean they aren’t against them. I’m sure the thousands of women that stay with abusers don’t divorce because they support the abuse. That’s the logic you’re using it’s ridiculous.

You just expect hundreds of thousands of Gazans in the street while rockets are flying over their head and Hamas killing them? Tf kind of logic is that

Ah more of the belief in these mythical Gazans silently weeping for the Jews in secret.

Easy to believe in (for some). But that’s all it is - belief.

 

[Smokey123]

There are no numbers supporting this notion of widespread pushback. Just a smattering of women and children in what, a few isolated events. Nothing of substance. Nothing of weight.

We have video of widespread celebration after 10/7.
We have actual accounts of citizens hiding hostages.
Gawking at dead Jews in caskets.

There’s videos from Rafah (and all over the ME) of celebrations when Sinwar died, there’s videos from Jabaliya refugee camp calling for Hamas to be overthrown.

But congrats on watching celebrations filmed by Hamas and “journalists” that are funded by Hamas

 

[Smokey123]

Ah more of the belief in these mythical Gazans silently weeping for the Jews in secret.

Easy to believe in (for some). But that’s all it is - belief.

Never once said Gazans weep for
Jews, never once even said gazans like Jews. Not sure why you can’t have a honest discussion.

Just like your belief that over 1 million gazans support Hamas actions, nothing more than a belief. It’s odd when you ask for evidence or numbers you expect it to be provided. But when asked in return you’ve done nothing but dodge

 

[Smokey123]

I’ll post it again

 

[85SugarVol]

Never once said Gazans weep for
Jews, never once even said gazans like Jews. Not sure why you can’t have a honest discussion.

Just like your belief that over 1 million gazans support Hamas actions, nothing more than a belief. It’s odd when you ask for evidence or numbers you expect it to be provided. But when asked in return you’ve done nothing but dodge

You keep believing there is widespread opposition to Hamas in Gaza. I’ll go based off of what we can actually see.

I never once stated “1 million Gazans” - that was your invention. You can’t produce any real numbers of weight, but you’re pretty good at strawmen.

 

[Smokey123]

You keep believing there is widespread opposition to Hamas in Gaza. I’ll go based off of what we can actually see.

I never once stated “1 million Gazans” - that was your invention. You can’t produce any real numbers of weight, but you’re pretty good at strawmen.

Ahhh yes I too only believe what I can see that’s filmed from Hamas and their journalists

I’ve asked for numbers multiple times You've yet to provide anything of substance. I’ve already stated there’s no numbers to support either opinion. It’s subjective

 

[Smokey123]

You keep believing there is widespread opposition to Hamas in Gaza. I’ll go based off of what we can actually see.

I never once stated “1 million Gazans” - that was your invention. You can’t produce any real numbers of weight, but you’re pretty good at strawmen.

So you don’t think the majority support Hamas? You think the majority disapproves of them?

 

[hog88]

I mean you really think if over 1 million Gazans were kidnapping and killing Jews only 1200 would be dead since oct 7th?

If just 250,000 Gazans actively opposed Hamas they would be out of power

 

[Orangeslice13]

Sure, if you wanna call it that. During the BLM riots they would classify 3 people with a poster as a “protest” - it’s how they got the numbers for “97% peaceful”.

No one is ever going to convince me that the people of Gaza, in any real numbers, object to Hamas’ genocidal crusade against the Jews - because there is zero evidence to suggest they do.

Because they don’t.
Or a very small number do and anyone who speaks out is squashed.
Thats what all the evidence says

 

[Orangeslice13]

You expect them hold giant protests with 10’s of thousands of people while getting bombs dropped on their home by Israel while also being murdered by their own government? You’re right, Maybe they should stop running for shelter and instead go into the terror tunnels to protest Hamas. I’m sure that will drive out Hamas and save their life

There’s no numbers to suggest either way. It’s a subjective opinion

They had 15 years and said almost nothing.
They had months after 10/7 before the bombs and said almost nothing. Because they overwhelmingly support the destruction of Israel by whoever they think can get it done

 

[Orangeslice13]

Yes, I'm sure.

"Lack of resistance" is a fun way of saying "stores hostages, hides terrorists, and celebrates the slaughter of innocent civilians or does nothing in the face of all three."

"Prove that someone didn't do something," is extremely dishonest.

What do we say about arguments from silence and those who try to make them?

 

[Orangeslice13]

Hamas can do whatever they want when they are controlled by the IRGC and they murder anyone they deem out of line. They beat and killed multiple gazans the day after the ceasefire for “collaborating with the Zionists”

So clearly you’re in favor of Israel freeing that small percentage from the vast majority who is oppressing them?

 

[norrislakevol]

They had 15 years and said almost nothing.
They had months after 10/7 before the bombs and said almost nothing. Because they overwhelmingly support the destruction of Israel by whoever they think can get it done

The very fact that there is a state of Israel is likely a hated fact by many in the Arab world.

 

[LSU-SIU]

The US government, the military, is often the arresting party.
I wouldn't take the Obama DOJ as an example of how things should be done.

Why would the U.S. be the arresting party for war crimes? Heck, the U.S. was bombing wedding parties.

Actually it happened under GW as well, not murder that I know but torture for sure. Of course, it probably happens under every President, they just keep it quiet.

Under U.S. law foreign people have no rights including journalist. The President could send a nuke down on an awards ceremony for journalist on purpose and the current U.S. position is not only is it legal, there is no judicial review.... even if the target is American. (the last part to me is wrong, but not the first part) What Hillary was wanting to do to Julian actually was not against the Law, now the reason why should wanted it done was.

 

[Vol8188]

Sure, if you wanna call it that. During the BLM riots they would classify 3 people with a poster as a “protest” - it’s how they got the numbers for “97% peaceful”.

No one is ever going to convince me that the people of Gaza, in any real numbers, object to Hamas’ genocidal crusade against the Jews - because there is zero evidence to suggest they do.

“They can’t oppose them! Hamas will murder them!”- I’ll assume that’s their only available counter argument.

If there’s an overwhelming force they can’t resist, who everyone here would agree is evil, and they do truly oppose this force….

If those things are all true, everyone should celebrate helping the people of Gaza escape

 

[Orangeslice13]

“They can’t oppose them! Hamas will murder them!”- I’ll assume that’s their only available counter argument.

If there’s an overwhelming force they can’t resist, who everyone here would agree is evil, and they do truly oppose this force….

If those things are all true, everyone should celebrate helping the people of Gaza escape

If there was any sizable amount of Gazans who oppose Hamas then that argument would be no deterrent