Kyle Rittenhouse - The Truth in 11 Minutes

#2,854
#2,854
My original post...

ClearwaterVol said:
The group in power never riots. It is always those that feel powerless that riot.
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volinbham said:
per your earlier post they were the oppressed group that is powerless. riots are the natural reaction
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I never mentioned oppressed. I clearly said,
It is always those that feel powerless that riot.
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I sure as hell never said or even implied that "riots are a natural reaction."

ClearwaterVol said:
You are nothing but a liar. You love to argue by starting with a premise that is nothing but a lie.

You have zero ethics.
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#2,855
#2,855
DynaLo said:
I watched the prosecution request to add the additional lesser charges and the provocation charges on the morning that the jury instructions were being discussed. 🤷‍♀️
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They’re adding instructions. The elements of those crimes are included within the offenses that were indicted by the grand jury.

Jeopardy attaches when the jury is sworn, the prosecution can’t just realize they’re losing and add more charges once that happens.
 
#2,858
#2,858
RockyTop85 said:
They’re adding instructions. The elements of those crimes are included within the offenses that were indicted by the grand jury.

Jeopardy attaches when the jury is sworn, the prosecution can’t just realize they’re losing and add more charges once that happens.
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Is there really a prosecution in this case?

Curious since I haven't really seen one...
 
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#2,861
#2,861
RockyTop85 said:
They’re adding instructions. The elements of those crimes are included within the offenses that were indicted by the grand jury.

Jeopardy attaches when the jury is sworn, the prosecution can’t just realize they’re losing and add more charges once that happens.
Click to expand...

So the prosecution didn’t have to state any lesser requested charges in the original charging documents?

Court Documents Detail Rittenhouse Charges
 
#2,862
#2,862
rjd970 said:
Or how about just not go at all, or if you really feel the need carry concealed instead of having a rifle strapped to your chest - making yourself a target for idiots that want to play stupid games?
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Why are we catering to idiots? The judge already threw out the weapon charge, so he was legally allowed to carry the rifle. He has the right to go wherever he wants, whether it's a bad idea or not. Also, someone else mentioned it, the making yourself a target bit sounds a lot like women wearing a short skirt. I'm done pandering to pathetic low lifes and making rules for them. He's not on trial for being a dumb kid, he's on trial for murder, which he didn't commit. All other circumstances are irrelevant.
 
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#2,863
#2,863
ClearwaterVol said:
My original post...





I never mentioned oppressed. I clearly said,

I sure as hell never said or even implied that "riots are a natural reaction."
Click to expand...

Feeling powerless and actually being powerless are two different things. It’s amazing the business owners that had property destroyed didn’t feel powerless enough to riot, isn’t it? And if they were to stand guard and shoot looters they would be eviscerated in the media and undertones of racism shooting unarmed blacks would be plentiful.

Just admit these riots are the product of hoodlums and morons looking for any excuse to get on camera, get free stuff, etc.. The “powerless” mantra is bogus.
 
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#2,866
#2,866
Ttucke11 said:
Why are we catering to idiots? The judge already threw out the weapon charge, so he was legally allowed to carry the rifle. He has the right to go wherever he wants, whether it's a bad idea or not. Also, someone else mentioned it, the making yourself a target bit sounds a lot like women wearing a short skirt. I'm done pandering to pathetic low lifes and making rules for them. He's not on trial for being a dumb kid, he's on trial for murder, which he didn't commit. All other circumstances are irrelevant.
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I’m not arguing he wasn’t legally allowed to carry a firearm. He was. I’m questioning the intelligence of willingly putting yourself in the situation when he didn’t need to. Rittenhouse is a full fledged moron, but he is not a criminal.

It is without question had he stayed home and played video games, smoked some reefer, and ordered a pizza none of this would have happened and he wouldn’t be on trial for murder.
 
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#2,868
#2,868
rjd970 said:
Feeling powerless and actually being powerless are two different things. It’s amazing the business owners that had property destroyed didn’t feel powerless enough to riot, isn’t it? And if they were to stand guard and shoot looters they would be eviscerated in the media and undertones of racism shooting unarmed blacks would be plentiful.

Just admit these riots are the product of hoodlums and morons looking for any excuse to get on camera, get free stuff, etc.. The “powerless” mantra is bogus.
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I am in favor of all rioters being given their day in court. I do not and never have supported any rioting.
 
#2,869
#2,869
rjd970 said:
I’m not arguing he wasn’t legally allowed to carry a firearm. He was. I’m questioning the intelligence of willingly putting yourself in the situation when he didn’t need to. Rittenhouse is a full fledged moron, but he is not a criminal.
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We are in total agreement. Sorry, over hearing some stupid conversations at work has me fired up.
 
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#2,871
#2,871
DynaLo said:
So the prosecution didn’t have to state any lesser requested charges in the original charging documents?

Court Documents Detail Rittenhouse Charges
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No, because the elements of the lesser offenses are included within the indicted offenses.

So he’s charged with first degree murder, which typically includes some heightened mental state like premeditation or malice aforethought plus use of force and death of another.

Second degree murder is typically the same but with a lower mental state requirement.

So all of the elements are technically in the indictment. If the prosecution fails to prove premeditation then the jury can still find second or something less than that.

Usually the defendant wants those in there and cases can actually be overturned for failure to include all of the lesser included offenses under a theory that the jury might have reached the bottom of the list and gone back to a higher crime when there was a better fit that wasn’t charged.
 
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#2,872
#2,872
ClearwaterVol said:
My original post...





I never mentioned oppressed. I clearly said,

I sure as hell never said or even implied that "riots are a natural reaction."
Click to expand...

it was an explanation for why one group riots and the other doesn't. (or whatever # of groups there are). power status is a predictor of proclivity to riot per your statement.

I asked if that means the Jan 6 rioters fit that mold and got nothing.
 
#2,874
#2,874
RockyTop85 said:
Lesser Included Offenses
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Thanks for the link. Interesting read. It appears to be a way for the prosecution to say “if you don’t believe he committed the crime we charged him with than find him guilty of something else”. That doesn’t seem like it should be legal. Why should the prosecution be allowed to charge him with the highest offense they can but then say if we didn’t prove the crime we charged him for, then give him this charge. It seems an unfair process to me. If the prosecution doesn’t have enough evidence, then don’t charge him for the higher crime.
 
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