Latest Coronavirus - Yikes

#45,029
#45,029
Stew Cook said:
Trump really thinks he can ride this fence, simultaneously appearing in control and having no responsibility. The problem is that people who normally don't follow politics very closely are seeing him contradict himself daily, rather than only having Fox News to tell them how great he's doing.

He'll probably realize this soon enough and get back to being the Twitterer in chief.
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I agree with most of this.
 
#45,031
#45,031
volinbham said:
oh man - ok I'll play

1. your first assertion is wrong I have explained repeatedly in substantive terms why your interpretation is wrong but you are so enamored with your view that you ignore them just as you ignore my direct statements throughout criticizing Trump. You are providing the equivalent of "nuh uh". In fact not only do you ignore my repeated and consistent criticisms of Trump you actually imagine that those criticisms somehow make me a devoted supporter of Trump. You may want to perform some self-reflection yourself on your motivation for dragging this out over countless pages. Seems obsessive.

2. yes the POTUS has more authority and responsibility. It's not even an argument and irrelevant to my comments. I care not what this forum does - I don't speak for it nor it for me. It is interesting however that in your critiques of me you routinely lump me into some larger theme you see in the forum. My statements are my own. As author of said statements I know what the intent was. I've repeatedly tried to explain that intent and yet you willfully ignore it with some smug sense that you know "what I really meant". Interesting that you have to couch my comments into some larger assessment you've made of the forum to make your point. You've had to depart from actual statements of mine and view my statement in some larger "conclusion" you've reached about the tone of the forum. It's borderline conspiratorial. Even in this post you say "If you actually accept Trump is flawed". Clearly no amount of saying it over the last 4 years matters because YOU don't believe it - you can see through my ongoing, consistent comments to the real truth. And I'm the one in denial - right.

3. I do believe he'd still be getting repetitive and non-substantive questions - my initial point. You seem incapable of holding multiple thoughts in your head. It is possible for both Trump to be full of crap AND for the press to be wasting our time with dumbass questions. Pointing that out is not changing the story or being a sycophant or whatever you've imagined you've spotted and are so bent about that you have to post again and again about.

Can't wait to see what insanity follows. Knock yourself out.
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Sadly, you probably wasted your time.
 
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#45,032
#45,032
OHvol40 said:
When most people who know anything about the scientific process say “science”, this is what they usually think of:
Make an observation.
Ask a question.
Form a hypothesis, or testable explanation.
Make a prediction based on the hypothesis.
Test the prediction.
Iterate: use the results to make new hypotheses or predictions.

When people who don’t have much experience with science say “science” this is what I imagine they think of:

View attachment 272839
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I fail to see the implied dichotomy in your post. Being something of a mad scientist myself (chemical engineer).
 
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#45,033
#45,033
volinbham said:
Most of the rest of the country will be the opposite. In the end it looks like the US total will be on par with a bad flu year
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Be interested in your opinion of why that is so.

Why the stark differences? The illness is what it is, should be same no matter what, in per capita numbers. So why such different outcomes by location?
 
#45,034
#45,034
allvol123 said:
Be interested in your opinion of why that is so.

Why the stark differences? The illness is what it is, should be same no matter what, in per capita numbers. So why such different outcomes by location?
Click to expand...

Subway? Honestly don't know why it hit NY so hard. The curious cases are Wash St. and California.

Just speculating - hopefully we'll know eventually.

I'd still like to see the explanations of flattening the curve and eventual infection rate predictions.
 
#45,035
#45,035
volinbham said:
Most of the rest of the country will be the opposite. In the end it looks like the US total will be on par with a bad flu year
Click to expand...
This is wrong. By the end of 2020, American deaths from the Coronavirus will be much greater than "a bad flu year" (Virologists predict there will be a resurgence in the summer with a 2nd spike) and that is even with all of the precautions being taken... which are not normally taken to combat the seasonal flu.
 
#45,036
#45,036
BowlBrother85 said:
This is wrong. By the end of 2020, American deaths from the Coronavirus will be much greater than "a bad flu year" and that is even with all of the precautions being taken... which are not normally taken to combat the seasonal flu.
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what will they be? what's the projection and how much worse will it be?

my point is that NY is a clear outlier for assessing the impact on the US.
 
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#45,037
#45,037
volinbham said:
what will they be? what's the projection and how much worse will it be?

my point is that NY is a clear outlier for assessing the impact on the US.
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NY is the US... You can't separate our largest city from the rest of the country because it is convenient to your narrative.
 
#45,038
#45,038
volinbham said:
Subway? Honestly don't know why it hit NY so hard. The curious cases are Wash St. and California.

Just speculating - hopefully we'll know eventually.

I'd still like to see the explanations of flattening the curve and eventual infection rate predictions.
Click to expand...

I've yet to find fault in your idea that deaths should essentially be around the same as long as you dont get a treatment/vaccine and or you dont overburden the HC system. They just happen over a shorter or longer range depending on strategies.

I guess maybe you could say mass transit in northeast. Virus spreads like wildfire there. Spreads slower in other areas and as warmer temps creep in it slows. Idk.
 
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#45,039
#45,039
Stew Cook said:
Those people dying due to hydroxychloroquine treatments are really pissing off those who are already complaining about inflated COVID deaths.
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My reply is not concerned with "inflated" numbers or whatever.

I haven't seen exactly how many deaths can be attributed directly to the medication. Did the patients go into anaphylaxis, and did the doctors anticipate that reaction and prep them with something (as NurseGoodVol indicated) to prepare for a potential allergic reaction? Did they even know about the patient's allergies? Did the patient know about his or her own allergies? (Not everybody does.) Did the hydrochloroquine react with another medication on the patient's regimen? (And I posted up a link here to a site a few days back that talked about the risks of quinolones and how each drug in the class had differences, many of the results were fatal, and how each patient on many of the drugs in that spectrum of antibiotics had to be treated on a case-by-case basis.)

Quinolones can be weird in general, and I say that just based on my limited personal experiences (which the smart folks have now come to call "anectodal," glad folks have a new word now). My mother went into respiratory arrest (on a ventilator) several years ago after taking Cipro and we almost lost her, but she can take Levaquin. This was after the Anthrax scare, with Cipro being touted as the way to get rid of that. I had an allergic reaction to Tequin (my thighs swelled and I had to cut my gym shorts off with garden shears), but I can take Cipro.

All medication has risks. I would think any doctor prescribing anything would look at it as risk vs. reward. That all sounds great. But in the situation of dealing with something like COVID-19, any mistake in judgment (which all people will make) will be magnified and become part of a statistic to put into the grist mill. Hopefully, it won't be ground up as an ingredient in aquarium cleaner, I guess.

Around here in East TN, if I go to urgent care with an upper respiratory deal, I sometimes get a shot of Omnicef and a week or ten days' worth of say Cephalex. It's pretty common, and it works on that type of bacterial infection. Give that medication to my wife and daughter for a week and it could very well kill them. We were lucky there, because they showed symptoms of extreme allergies within the first day, and we could stop. What about someone who is intubated?

There are just so many variables here, I think, and I'm not a medical person at all.

Sorry for the long post.
 
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#45,040
#45,040
volinbham said:
Subway? Honestly don't know why it hit NY so hard. The curious cases are Wash St. and California.

Just speculating - hopefully we'll know eventually.

I'd still like to see the explanations of flattening the curve and eventual infection rate predictions.
Click to expand...

Nah.. it was probably one hotdog vendor serving up red hot COVID dogs. Other than that, there has been some speculation that the west coast COVID is not as deadly as the New York.

If the virus really does slow down during warmer weather, maybe that will offset more people getting back to business. I suppose we'll find out sooner than later.
 
#45,041
#45,041
GordonC said:
My reply is not concerned with "inflated" numbers or whatever.

I haven't seen exactly how many deaths can be attributed directly to the medication. Did the patients go into anaphylaxis, and did the doctors anticipate that reaction and prep them with something (as NurseGoodVol indicated) to prepare for a potential allergic reaction? Did they even know about the patient's allergies? Did the patients know about his or her own allergies? (Not everybody does.) Did the hydrochloroquine react with another medication on the patient's regimen? (And I posted up a link here to a site a few days back that talked about the risks of quinolones and how each drug in the class had differences, many of the results were fatal, and how each patient on many of the drugs in that spectrum of antibiotics had to be treated on a case-by-case basis.)

Quinolones can be weird in general, and I say that just based on my limited personal experiences (which the smart folks have now come to call "anectodal," glad folks have a new word now). My mother went into respiratory arrest (on a ventilator) several years ago after taking Cipro and we almost lost her, but she can take Levaquin. This was after the Anthrax scare, with Cipro being touted as the way to get rid of that. I had an allergic reaction to Tequin (my thighs swelled and I had to cut my gym shorts off with garden shears), but I can take Cipro.

All medication has risks. I would think any doctor prescribing anything would look at it as risk vs. reward. That all sounds great. But in the situation of dealing with something like COVID-19, any mistake in judgment (which all people will make) will be magnified and become part of a statistic to put into the grist mill. Hopefully, it won't be ground up as an ingredient in aquarium cleaner, I guess.

Around here in East TN, if I go to urgent care with an upper respiratory deal, I sometimes get a shot of Omnicef and a week or ten days' worth of say Cephalex. It's pretty common, and it works on that type of bacterial infection. Give that medication to my wife and daughter for a week and it could very well kill them. We were lucky there, because they showed symptoms of extreme allergies within the first day, and we could stop. What about someone who is intubated?

There are just so many variables here, I think, and I'm not a medical person at all.

Sorry for the long post.
Click to expand...

I was mostly being a smart ass, but thanks for the reply. I will ponder these questions and maybe run them by my medical family members.
 
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#45,042
#45,042
BowlBrother85 said:
NY is the US... You can't separate our largest city from the rest of the country because it is convenient to your narrative.
Click to expand...

Good Lord - what narrative.

I'm asking you what's the projection and pointing out that NY has been harder hit. That's not a narrative - I can't even imagine what secret narrative I had in mind here. Can you let me know what my narrative was so I'll know too?
 
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#45,043
#45,043
GordonC said:
My reply is not concerned with "inflated" numbers or whatever.

I haven't seen exactly how many deaths can be attributed directly to the medication. Did the patients go into anaphylaxis, and did the doctors anticipate that reaction and prep them with something (as NurseGoodVol indicated) to prepare for a potential allergic reaction? Did they even know about the patient's allergies? Did the patient know about his or her own allergies? (Not everybody does.) Did the hydrochloroquine react with another medication on the patient's regimen? (And I posted up a link here to a site a few days back that talked about the risks of quinolones and how each drug in the class had differences, many of the results were fatal, and how each patient on many of the drugs in that spectrum of antibiotics had to be treated on a case-by-case basis.)

Quinolones can be weird in general, and I say that just based on my limited personal experiences (which the smart folks have now come to call "anectodal," glad folks have a new word now). My mother went into respiratory arrest (on a ventilator) several years ago after taking Cipro and we almost lost her, but she can take Levaquin. This was after the Anthrax scare, with Cipro being touted as the way to get rid of that. I had an allergic reaction to Tequin (my thighs swelled and I had to cut my gym shorts off with garden shears), but I can take Cipro.

All medication has risks. I would think any doctor prescribing anything would look at it as risk vs. reward. That all sounds great. But in the situation of dealing with something like COVID-19, any mistake in judgment (which all people will make) will be magnified and become part of a statistic to put into the grist mill. Hopefully, it won't be ground up as an ingredient in aquarium cleaner, I guess.

Around here in East TN, if I go to urgent care with an upper respiratory deal, I sometimes get a shot of Omnicef and a week or ten days' worth of say Cephalex. It's pretty common, and it works on that type of bacterial infection. Give that medication to my wife and daughter for a week and it could very well kill them. We were lucky there, because they showed symptoms of extreme allergies within the first day, and we could stop. What about someone who is intubated?

There are just so many variables here, I think, and I'm not a medical person at all.

Sorry for the long post.
Click to expand...

I’m pretty certain he was celebrating bad news on a treatment because somehow it reflects poorly on Trump. You probably wasted your time.
 
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#45,045
#45,045
volinbham said:
Good Lord - what narrative.

I'm asking you what's the projection and pointing out that NY has been harder hit. That's not a narrative - I can't even imagine what secret narrative I had in mind here. Can you let me know what my narrative was so I'll know too?
Click to expand...

The COVID thing has sent some posters off the rails.
 
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#45,049
#45,049
DC_Vol said:
I’m pretty certain he was celebrating bad news on a treatment because somehow it reflects poorly on Trump. You probably wasted your time.
Click to expand...

You poor fragile man... does your acting out have something to do with bad choices in stock investments, or did someone close to you die from taking hydroxychloroquine?

ohh... you were joking, nm
 
#45,050
#45,050
volinbham said:
Good Lord - what narrative.

I'm asking you what's the projection and pointing out that NY has been harder hit. That's not a narrative - I can't even imagine what secret narrative I had in mind here. Can you let me know what my narrative was so I'll know too?
Click to expand...
That is always the case. NY is hit harder during the seasonal flu. In Brooklyn alone, you have 2.5 million people living within 70 square miles of each other. Of course they are going to be exceptionally vulnerable to the spread of viruses.
 
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