Martin wants an extension and am sure a raise (rumor)

#326
#326
BigZiti09 said:
Nobody is talking about raising his pay significantly. The scenario I was using was bump his pay slightly to help negotiate down the buyout.

It would be a smart move for UT financially. If he has to be fired, it costs less. If he works out, you've shown faith in him and he will remember that when and if schools come calling. Also, it helps recruiting.

Cuonzo hasn't shown he's the long term answer here. But he hasn't shown he's a bust either. So in my opinion, since you still aren't sure what you're getting, the best move is to give him the support he needs (add a year) to add a great class in 2014, and protect UT (lower the buyout).

My initial reaction to all this was "heck no, he hasn't earned it." But now I think it's an issue with deeper layers.

UT has a chance to be proactive rather than reactive here. Negotiate now and UT has the edge at the table. Something hammy never had. He was always there just sitting down with a coach who just won and he was pulling out the checkbook. If you negotiate now, you can add the year, give a minimal raise if it comes to that, negotiate down the buyout hopefully and you wouldn't be renegotiating a deal next year which is favorable to UT again. If he wins big next year, you're gonna have to pay him if you don't do a new deal this offseason. If he flops, it's just as easy to fire him had you not redone his contract this offseason and you can say you gave him all the support needed and that will help when you go to hire a new coach.
Click to expand...

No agent will allow his buyout to be negotiated down.....give him a raise, extension and keep the buy out the same
 
#327
#327
patrick said:
I have read the posts in this thread as well as many coaching search threads. What aggravates me to no end is the talk of UT (or whatever school) needing to "show faith in my coach" by giving him a freaking raise. I am so tired of hearing about that load of bs. How about a coach showing the university his "faith" by adhering to the terms of his contract and actually making to a meaningful post season tourney before he seeks a raise and extension!

Its very similar to when Fulmer was given raises and extensions for average performance because people said oh no maybe he will leave for another job... someone tell me what other job Fulmer had offered to him.

And someone tell me who is chasing CCM, a coach who has yet to make it to the big dance??? Some on this board talk about CCM making the sweet 16 next year so he should be paid now because schools will knock down the door to hire him. Let him get in the tourney first!

I seriously doubt that CCM is on any major D-1 programs short list at this point in his coaching career!!!!
Click to expand...

I am not sure you have much of a clue. While I understand your point, merely extending Martin a year, if done correctly, won't have a huge financial impact in the grand scheme of things. Hamilton was the one calling the shots with Fulmer and Dooley, and some mistakes were made. But what some are suggesting in this thread is not the same as the mistakes that Hamilton made. There is a big difference. Unfortunately in today's world, 4 years is a key number. You can argue it all day long, but it simply is.
 
#328
#328
BigZiti09 said:
Nobody is talking about raising his pay significantly. The scenario I was using was bump his pay slightly to help negotiate down the buyout.

It would be a smart move for UT financially. If he has to be fired, it costs less. If he works out, you've shown faith in him and he will remember that when and if schools come calling. Also, it helps recruiting.

Cuonzo hasn't shown he's the long term answer here. But he hasn't shown he's a bust either. So in my opinion, since you still aren't sure what you're getting, the best move is to give him the support he needs (add a year) to add a great class in 2014, and protect UT (lower the buyout).

My initial reaction to all this was "heck no, he hasn't earned it." But now I think it's an issue with deeper layers.

UT has a chance to be proactive rather than reactive here. Negotiate now and UT has the edge at the table. Something hammy never had. He was always there just sitting down with a coach who just won and he was pulling out the checkbook. If you negotiate now, you can add the year, give a minimal raise if it comes to that, negotiate down the buyout hopefully and you wouldn't be renegotiating a deal next year which is favorable to UT again. If he wins big next year, you're gonna have to pay him if you don't do a new deal this offseason. If he flops, it's just as easy to fire him had you not redone his contract this offseason and you can say you gave him all the support needed and that will help when you go to hire a new coach.
Click to expand...

He has done nothing to deserve either a raise or extension. Personally I think he should give back some of the money he has received.
 
#329
#329
volbeast33 said:
No agent will allow his buyout to be negotiated down.....give him a raise, extension and keep the buy out the same
Click to expand...

I don't think he would either. Maybe, though, if you gave him a small salary bump.

Martin didn't have an agent when he first got here if I remember correctly. But apparently he does now.

I couldn't go for raise and extension if I was at UTAD. I'd want something in return.

Martin needs the year added. UT needs Martin to succeed. I don't see any way he doesn't get that year added. Has to happen IMO.
 
#332
#332
bleedingTNorange said:
Finish 2nd & 5th in the SEC, get paid the 11th most...but give money back.

Yea that makes sense, please keep posting.
Click to expand...

And you keep worshiping, it doesn't make him a better coach. You tried to pray him into the tournament two years in a row and it didn't work. The man doesn't have the basketball IQ to succeed.
 
#334
#334
knowthevols said:
That's where you are wrong. With some people there is still a little thing called honor.
Click to expand...

You're telling me you've never watched games on your computer at work, or posted on here when supposed to be working, etc? That could be considered stealing from your company. You should give back the money you were paid while doing those things.
 
#335
#335
knowthevols said:
And you keep worshiping, it doesn't make him a better coach. You tried to pray him into the tournament two years in a row and it didn't work. The man doesn't have the basketball IQ to succeed.
Click to expand...

He obviously has more basketball IQ than you have actual IQ, your recent posts make that evident.

When you posted that you dislike Cuonzo because certain posters who no longer exist wanted pearl fired you solidified yourself as a joke.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#336
#336
whobethis16 said:
You're telling me you've never watched games on your computer at work, or posted on here when supposed to be working, etc? That could be considered stealing from your company. You should give back the money you were paid while doing those things.
Click to expand...

Then I would only be paying the money back to me.
 
#338
#338
knowthevols said:
You know I've watched you lick Counzo's feet so long now I think I see where you are coming from, but, then I saw where you were coming from under you're old screen name.
Click to expand...

What's funny is this is the only screename I've ever had, ask a mod...or just continue to look dumber and dumber, your inability to even be able to spell the coaches name is kinda sad though.
 
Last edited:
#339
#339
bleedingTNorange said:
What's funny is this is the only screename I've ever had, ask a mod...or just continue to look dumber and dumber, your inability to even be able to spell the coaches name is kinda sad though.
Click to expand...

I really could care less how he spells his name. I just wish he could win enough to get in the tourny and not the NIT.
 
#341
#341
VolGee4 said:
I am not sure you have much of a clue. While I understand your point, merely extending Martin a year, if done correctly, won't have a huge financial impact in the grand scheme of things. Hamilton was the one calling the shots with Fulmer and Dooley, and some mistakes were made. But what some are suggesting in this thread is not the same as the mistakes that Hamilton made. There is a big difference. Unfortunately in today's world, 4 years is a key number. You can argue it all day long, but it simply is.
Click to expand...

Exactly who is it a significant number to? Five star players will be looking to go pro after 1 year. The need for a perpetual 4 year contract is a myth created by coaches and their agents which results in ridiculous buyouts for nonperformance. Cuonzo does not deserve a raise or extension.
 
#342
#342
cpavol said:
Exactly who is it a significant number to? Five star players will be looking to go pro after 1 year. The need for a perpetual 4 year contract is a myth created by coaches and their agents which results in ridiculous buyouts for nonperformance. Cuonzo does not deserve a raise or extension.
Click to expand...

Yes because we clearly recruit like KY

Look at, oh let's say the last 10 classes Tennessee basketball has brought in...I'm guessing there's been 4 year players in each and every class.
 
Last edited:
#343
#343
cpavol said:
Exactly who is it a significant number to? Five star players will be looking to go pro after 1 year. The need for a perpetual 4 year contract is a myth created by coaches and their agents which results in ridiculous buyouts for nonperformance. Cuonzo does not deserve a raise or extension.
Click to expand...

This. Coaches are fired or leave programs for better jobs on a daily basis even if they're under an extended contract so the 4yr arguement is basically pointless unless you want to milk the system. Most of the recruits care about playing for championships and the NBA, not the number of years are left on the coach contract.
 
Last edited:
#344
#344
Kusotate said:
This. Coaches are fired or leave programs for better jobs on a daily basis even if they're under an extended contract so the 4yr arguement is basically pointless unless you want to milk the system. Most of the recruits care about playing for championships and the NBA, not the number of years are left on the coach's contract.
Click to expand...

Exactly. But if the number of years left on the coach's contract is two, and the pieces are being brought in to win a championship in 3 years, there's a bit of a problem, isn't there?
 
#345
#345
Kusotate said:
This. Coaches are fired or leave programs for better jobs on a daily basis even if they're under an extended contract so the 4yr arguement is basically pointless unless you want to milk the system. Most of the recruits care about playing for championships and the NBA, not the number of years are left on the coach contract.
Click to expand...

Actually you just made the point for the 4 year contract. It really is not a big deal because all coaches leave or are fired before the end of the contract. So you may as well do it. I just don't like the 10 year extensions that some coaches are getting. If you don't think our biggest rivals wouldn't try to use the fact that our coach has less than 4 years left on his contract in recruiting, then I can't help you much. It is used in negative recruiting because EVERYTHING that can be, will be used to recruit against you.
 
#347
#347
VolGee4 said:
Actually you just made the point for the 4 year contract. It really is not a big deal because all coaches leave or are fired before the end of the contract. So you may as well do it. I just don't like the 10 year extensions that some coaches are getting. If you don't think our biggest rivals wouldn't try to use the fact that our coach has less than 4 years left on his contract in recruiting, then I can't help you much. It is used in negative recruiting because EVERYTHING that can be, will be used to recruit against you.
Click to expand...

You're right in that opposing coaches use every negative they can, but I'm in the camp the four year deal is a lever created by agents. Think about it, with that mechanism, they create the situation that a school has to (a) keep rolling the guy with raises and extensions almost every year (b) give the guy an obscenely long contract (10 years) or (c) fire him with a huge buyout. On the flip side, if the coach wants out to take another job, very few contracts are drawn in a way that would keep him from doing it. If Cuonzo Martin gets an offer next year from a school and he wants to take it, he'll go whether Tennessee gives him an extra year on his contract and a bump in salary this year or not.

The biggest obstacles to Martins' recruiting are and will be (a) not putting a team in the tournament and (b) putting kids in the pros. He has a chance to do both next year. If he does, he'll get an extension and a raise and all of the issues will be taken off the table.
 
#348
#348
germanicus said:
You're right in that opposing coaches use every negative they can, but I'm in the camp the four year deal is a lever created by agents. Think about it, with that mechanism, they create the situation that a school has to (a) keep rolling the guy with raises and extensions almost every year (b) give the guy an obscenely long contract (10 years) or (c) fire him with a huge buyout. On the flip side, if the coach wants out to take another job, very few contracts are drawn in a way that would keep him from doing it. If Cuonzo Martin gets an offer next year from a school and he wants to take it, he'll go whether Tennessee gives him an extra year on his contract and a bump in salary this year or not.

The biggest obstacles to Martins' recruiting are and will be (a) not putting a team in the tournament and (b) putting kids in the pros. He has a chance to do both next year. If he does, he'll get an extension and a raise and all of the issues will be taken off the table.
Click to expand...

That is why I am in favor of an extension and not a raise and not changing the buyout a whole lot. The buyout clause is the key for protection, not the extension of the 4th year. The extension is just semantics as long as the buyout still protects you. Martin really doesn't have the leverage right now, and the school does. Is he going to leave for a similar paying job? No.

So, you extend him to 4 and protect yourself with the buyout. JMO.
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top