Mattis Leaving in February

#253
#253
lawgator1 said:
As I understand it the concern is that completely leaving creates an opportunity for Russia and Iran to gain such a strong foothold/presence that it ensures they control the outcome.
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Iran already happens to have a nation there...

Now, with Russia you may have a point, but Syria has been in the Soviet/Russian sphere of influence since the 50s. It's not a great leap of the imagination to think that's who they would turn to in a moment of crisis.

Now, what really needed to be done in regards to the ISIS threat would have sent you libs to the moon. Trump should have coordinated and brokered an understand with Russia and Syria to defeat the ISIS threat then have the nation vote under international supervision for their new leaders. Syria likely wouldn't have bought off on it but I'd dare say Russia might have with the right incentives and in turn, they help sway Syria to the proposal. Of course, again, the mouthbreathers in your party would have screeched and screamed to the highest levels about Russia, so it's probably a good thing it didn't get done.
 
#256
#256
Grand Vol said:
I'll wait for this proof of the Erdogan-Trump conspiracy to come out...

Maybe you should start a thread. Trerdogan-gate?
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When Erdogan, ISIS, Putin and Assad are cheering our military decisions, it may be time to re-evaluate the decision.
 
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#257
#257
Grand Vol said:
Iran already happens to have a nation there...

Now, with Russia you may have a point, but Syria has been in the Soviet/Russian sphere of influence since the 50s. It's not a great leap of the imagination to think that's who they would turn to in a moment of crisis.

Now, what really needed to be done in regards to the ISIS threat would have sent you libs to the moon. Trump should have coordinated and brokered an understand with Russia and Syria to defeat the ISIS threat then have the nation vote under international supervision for their new leaders. Syria likely wouldn't have bought off on it but I'd dare say Russia might have with the right incentives and in turn, they help sway Syria to the proposal. Of course, again, the mouthbreathers in your party would have screeched and screamed to the highest levels about Russia, so it's probably a good thing it didn't get done.
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The concern about Russian influence over Trump is real. It has manifested itself many times with this administration. Even if you put aside the Mueller investigation, the fact is that Trump's favoring of policy decisions beneficial to Russia has been way high and off the charts since Day 1. Even before Day 1, actually.

So don't try to lay off on the Dems the completely legitimate worry that Trump is beholden to them for something. The objective evidence of it is compelling.
 
#258
#258
golfballs said:
ISIS is not an ideology. It’s a militant group and they currently don’t control any territory. What you’re describing is radical Islam. And yes it is an ideology. If it can’t be killed by occupying Syria then we should leave.
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FFS.

A distinction without difference, the militant group is militant because of an ideology.

The last part flies in the face of every argument and aneurysm the right has had on leaving the middle east since 9/11.

What's different now, because it's trump?
 
#259
#259
Septic said:
FFS.

A distinction without difference, the militant group is militant because of an ideology.

The last part flies in the face of every argument and aneurysm the neo-cons have had on leaving the middle east since 9/11.

What's different now, because it's trump?
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.
 
#262
#262
lawgator1 said:
The concern about Russian influence over Trump is real. It has manifested itself many times with this administration. Even if you put aside the Mueller investigation, the fact is that Trump's favoring of policy decisions beneficial to Russia has been way high and off the charts since Day 1. Even before Day 1, actually.

So don't try to lay off on the Dems the completely legitimate worry that Trump is beholden to them for something. The objective evidence of it is compelling.
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lol

It's like a dog whistle.
 
#265
#265
Orangeslice13 said:
I doubt almost everything that passes as news these days
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It's funny. If the same "news" came in with unnamed "sources" during the Obama years, the left would have scoffed and come up with the term "fake news" a long time ago.

But since Trump is involved, it HAS to be TRUE!
 
#266
#266
Orangeslice13 said:
I doubt almost everything that passes as news these days
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I do too. But let’s say it is true, what should Trump do in this situation? Edrogan wants to fulfil a prophecy and usher in the end of the world. He’s already tried to provoke a fight between Russia and the US, and he’s been proven to provide support to ISIS.
 
#267
#267
davethevol said:
I do too. But let’s say it is true, what should Trump do in this situation? Edrogan wants to fulfil a prophecy and usher in the end of the world. He’s already tried to provoke a fight between Russia and the US, and he’s been proven to provide support to ISIS.
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I have no idea.
I’m positive we don’t have all the facts and we don’t have any real idea about what goes on behind the scenes.
 
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#270
#270
Velo Vol said:
Mattis (and others?) leaving is a lot of smoke billowing out of the building, methinks.
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Here's the question though, take Ergodan out of the equation. If Mattis truly does suport another unending conflict in the Middle East and doesn't support a drawdown in Afghanistan, would that change your opinion?

Never mind, I know the answer to that. "But TRUMP!" means you'll pick the opposite
 
#271
#271
Grand Vol said:
Here's the question though, take Ergodan out of the equation. If Mattis truly does suport another unending conflict in the Middle East and doesn't support a drawdown in Afghanistan, would that change your opinion?
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As I said before, I think this is the straw that broke the camel's back, rather than the reason he quit.

No way to know for sure unless he says more, of course.
 
#273
#273
Personally, I can't think of a good reason for one more dead American in Syria, Africa, or any of the "Stan's" we're currently involved in. Get 'em all out; bring 'em all home. Enough is enough.

The Arabs have been infighting since Moses was in diapers, and it's never going to change. Never. So let them infight, inbreed, and implode. We'll negotiate, or deal with, the eventual winner. If that ever happens.

Same with those "small market actions" that most of you don't know are taking place on the African continent. If you really knew how involved we were down there, you'd be shocked. Get out. Let the warring tribes thin one another out. Not much chance of Zimbabwe nuking us.

Russia is always going to be Russia. Most paranoid people on the face of the earth. Let them expand their influence as far as they want. And then the economy will collapse (again), and we'll be right back where we started from. Putin is a chess player, and an old-schooler from the Stasi / KGB days. No matter what he builds, it will eventually rust and collapse, just like the USSR did. Come to think of it, maybe we could buy their wall and save a few bucks on this end.....

North Korea / China. Both concern me, but even Kim Jong Un and Jinping are not stupid enough to start a shooting war with us, again. It's all saber-rattling, which the U.S. defense industry dearly loves, since it sells F35's and Tomahawks to the military. Our war with China is real, but it's an economic war. And we're losing. KJU doesn't fart without Jinping's approval, so we need to focus on China here.

If I sound like an isolationist, I don't think I am. But we have been at war, whether declared or not, with at least one other nation since December 7th, 1941. I think that's enough for now. Let's let the hundreds of thousands of family trees that have branches missing heal up for a while, huh?

Enough is enough.
 
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#274
#274
Grand Vol said:
It's funny. If the same "news" came in with unnamed "sources" during the Obama years, the left would have scoffed and come up with the term "fake news" a long time ago.

But since Trump is involved, it HAS to be TRUE!
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Obama was the one who started talking about Fake News.
 
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