MTG Calls for Red State Secession

#401
#401
McDad said:
I just considered something. Uncle Sam has a history of allowing voluntary joining but denies voluntary dissolution.

You can volunteer for armed service but you cannot leave voluntarily.

Hog, what are your thoughts? Should a person be allowed to leave?
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Hasn't the federal government had to approve the admission of new states as well? If the Fed has to approve entry, could they approve exit?
 
#405
#405
Maybe some people tired of making some else's Sammy but Daddy brings home the bacon

Clark is correct. Better sign off
 
#406
#406
clarksvol00 said:
Hasn't the federal government had to approve the admission of new states as well? If the Fed has to approve entry, could they approve exit?
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That's a good question. I think the colonial states were courted by the CC to give the assurance in joining.
Later, like with Utah (maybe?) the territory was given ultimatums in order to join.

The other side of your question is worth considering, too. If a state which met admission criteria reverted back to pre admission, shouldn't the Union kick them out?
 
#407
#407
McDad said:
That's a good question. I think the colonial states were courted by the CC to give the assurance in joining.
Later, like with Utah (maybe?) the territory was given ultimatums in order to join.

The other side of your question is worth considering, too. If a state which met admission criteria reverted back to pre admission, shouldn't the Union kick them out?
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They already are..in some back way
 
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#410
#410
clarksvol00 said:
You're probably familiar with the union army's actions as they took control of the confederate states.
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So the federal government will implement a scorched earth policy? That's a good start to winning their hearts and minds.
 
#411
#411
McDad said:
That's a good question. I think the colonial states were courted by the CC to give the assurance in joining.
Later, like with Utah (maybe?) the territory was given ultimatums in order to join.

The other side of your question is worth considering, too. If a state which met admission criteria reverted back to pre admission, shouldn't the Union kick them out?
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Its been awhile since history class, but I think the original 13 agreed to form a union and the states thereafter agreed to admit the successor states. Some of those state were part of other states (part of TN waspart of NC), some were originally federal land/territories that became states.

Edit: either way, I'm pretty sure all states after the original thirteen were approved and accepted by the predecessor states. Don't know, but I'd think there should be some kind of mechanism for the parties that entered a contract to mutually agree for dissolution, and if not, go to the Supreme Court or fight it out.
 
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#414
#414
clarksvol00 said:
Its been awhile since history class, but I think the original 13 agreed to form a union and the states thereafter agreed to admit the successor states. Some of those state were part of other states (part of TN waspart of NC), some were originally federal land/territories that became states.
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I agree, somewhat. I remember several of the original 13 were apprehensive about joining a "big government". Much of the debate focused on giving them all kinds of assurances those concerned states wouldn't lose their autonomy.

Other territories pursued the Union and clamored to join. The dynamic was completely different.
 
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#416
#416
McDad said:
Explain.
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Oh I was agreeing
They are keeping us in a Union by backdoor that subvert the premise of the USC.

It is now a Living Document made for political interpretations without following the Amendment process.

You dont have to follow the laws as a Fed..you can just ignore them.
 
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#418
#418
McDad said:
I agree, somewhat. I remember several of the original 13 were apprehensive about joining a "big government". Much of the debate focused on giving them all kinds of assurances those concerned states wouldn't lose their autonomy.

Other territories pursued the Union and clamored to join. The dynamic was completely different.
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See my edit.
 
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#419
#419
ETV said:
Considering most of those atrocities would be recorded or broadcast in real time, I disagree with any chance at reunification.
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Regardless of whether you support or oppose the secessionist philosophy, that's the reality you'll have to face if a state tries to secede.
 
#420
#420
clarksvol00 said:
See my edit.
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I think most of us circle jerking secessionists are basically aligned with your edit.

Joining and separating should be outlined. If not (as is currently) the Constitution defers to the states (I believe).

Like others, I don't believe secession to be a smart move for either party.
 
#423
#423
McDad said:
I think most of us circle jerking secessionists are basically aligned with your edit.

Joining and separating should be outlined. If not (as is currently) the Constitution defers to the states (I believe).

Like others, I don't believe secession to be a smart move for either party.
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Yeah, I don't believe self-immolation to be a smart move, but I don't argue it's merits everytime it comes up.
 
#424
#424
clarksvol00 said:
Regardless of whether you support or oppose the secessionist philosophy, that's the reality you'll have to face if a state tries to secede.
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I believe if any state chooses to secede, the federal government will use every method available to them, without resorting to armed conflict. Should the feds decide to level up to defcon 1 and go all in to prevent it, then the feds will be portrayed as such. Then the domino effect will begin with other states that may have been on the fence about a proposed secession.
 
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#425
#425
clarksvol00 said:
Yeah, I don't believe self-immolation to be a smart move, but I don't argue it's merits everytime it comes up.
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I think a lot of the discussions here are about broad principles / oughts and the details / what ifs. Keeps the fun in our dysfunction.
 
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