‘23 NC WR Nathan Leacock (Tennessee)

[jakez4ut]

All day. Stars are based on overall talent potential but if you put them in the wrong system for their skill set then they are no better than a 3 star. A 3 star that fits your system can be more of a 4/5 star in the right system. You obviously want all the 4/5 stars you can get but don’t take just to take. Take bc they can excel in your system

yup.
-Jalen Hurd, prolly

 

[DaddyChad]

Pls take Burrell out of there. He is slawwwww

Idk. Never seen burnt slaw.

 

[Vols410]

Pls take Burrell out of there. He is slawwwww

Lol, don't think he's great by any stretch, but he's better than Jerrod Means.

 

[miket4god]

Pls take Burrell out of there. He is slawwwww

That's what keeps me from expecting a big jump in year two. Burrell was evidently, according to Willie Martinez anyway, our second best cornerback behind Taylor. Not sure we recruited anyone who is physically ready to take his spot, so he will be out there almost every play again (barring injury). Players can improve, but I'm afraid secondary will still be an obvious weakness this year as well.
Good passing teams will torch our secondary unless the pass rush is a lot better than I think it will be.

 

[sjt18]

Preston Williams was a baller. He just didn't stay here. He was dominant at Colorado St.

Colorado State? Baller?

But I think you get the main point, right? Guys can complain about 3* but UT has gotten more of its share of 4/5* guys who've been overrated.

 

[sjt18]

Pls take Burrell out of there. He is slawwwww

He's weird. He doesn't seem to get out run or out quicked. Lots of time he seems to be in position... and still gives up plays.

 

[bigl3327]

Colorado State? Baller?

But I think you get the main point, right? Guys can complain about 3* but UT has gotten more of its share of 4/5* guys who've been overrated.

I agree that we've either missed on evaluations, mismanaged, underdeveloped, or just plain wasted a lot of highly rated players during the past 15 years.

 

[volbeast33]

In the 2020 and 2021 classes…. We only have 9 of 18 4* left on campus with Baron, Thomas, Mays, And Hyatt being really involved in the rotation. Evaluations is our issue no matter what the stars are…. We can’t continue to miss on players like this.

 

[sjt18]

I agree that we've either missed on evaluations, mismanaged, underdeveloped, or just plain wasted a lot of highly rated players during the past 15 years.

I would submit that the rankings for players pursued by the Sabans of the world are more likely to be accurate than the rankings for players pursued by Butch Jones.

I think somehow people believe that the recruiting sites are out there blazing a trail and elite recruiters come behind and recruit 5* guys. It is virtually the opposite. Even if the recruiting sites had guys who were competent to evaluate talent, they lack the money or numbers to adequately evaluate even the top 10% of HS players.

BOT is fond of saying, "Oh but look all the championship teams have high class rankings". So did Saban, Dabo, and Smart take their cue from 247 and Rivals... or did those sites try to determine which guys were priorities for those programs?

 

[sjt18]

Yeah because of numbers.

~30 five stars each cycle
~ 330 four stars
~ 2200 three stars

Per On3, 62% of five stars get drafted.
22% of four stars get drafted.
5% of three stars get drafted.

So while it’s factually correct more three stars get drafted each year - it’s misleading as hell.

No it isn't. Not at all. If you truly want to compare 3* and 4* draftees then you'd have to look at the SEC or maybe the Big 10 alone. All 3* are not made alike.

But you are either intentionally or accidentally missing the whole point. About 18 5* will be drafted each year. Maybe 70 4*. Well over 100 unrated to 3*. Those players in that last group are out there RIGHT NOW getting ready to make their college choice. They exist apart from whether On3 is accurate with their rankings or not. That talent is out there to be discovered, recruited, and developed.

If you knew you had 25 of those 100+ underrated guys signed... would you worry about "stars"?

Yeah we had a list of busts during the years we had inconsistent to not S&C staff and toxic to incompetent coaching. Not sure what your point is.

A lot of those guys were simply overrated. Someone pointed out that UT had a bunch of 3* that weren't very good.... there are 4/5* over the last several years who were just flat out bad. Was K McKenzie anything close to a 5*? Who was better him or Butler?

Okay cool. Never said that wasn’t important. Simply made the point that in virtually every three star thread of a Tennessee commit, there are those claiming the kid is a diamond in the rough and will be bumped to a four star. That is all.

That happens a lot. I'm sure it happens on other sites as well. And considering that ONLY about 25% of 4/5* players will end up being drafted with a lot of 3* being drafted... they're sometimes right.

 

[bigl3327]

I would submit that the rankings for players pursued by the Sabans of the world are more likely to be accurate than the rankings for players pursued by Butch Jones.

I think somehow people believe that the recruiting sites are out there blazing a trail and elite recruiters come behind and recruit 5* guys. It is virtually the opposite. Even if the recruiting sites had guys who were competent to evaluate talent, they lack the money or numbers to adequately evaluate even the top 10% of HS players.

BOT is fond of saying, "Oh but look all the championship teams have high class rankings". So did Saban, Dabo, and Smart take their cue from 247 and Rivals... or did those sites try to determine which guys were priorities for those programs?

I don't put much stock into the recruiting site rankings. Saban wins because he's Nick Saban. Bama has had a ton of 5* busts, but no one remembers those guys because they still win. We've had a lot of inept coaches, so every misstep has been glaring.

 

[Lloyd_Christmas]

He's weird. He doesn't seem to get out run or out quicked. Lots of time he seems to be in position... and still gives up plays.

He's got to get more physical and be more aggressive. He knows where he's supposed to be and is fast and athletic enough to be in position to make plays. He's just a bit too passive out there.

 

[sjt18]

I don't put much stock into the recruiting site rankings. Saban wins because he's Nick Saban. Bama has had a ton of 5* busts, but no one remembers those guys because they still win. We've had a lot of inept coaches, so every misstep has been glaring.

Agreed.

I think the recruiting ratings are accurate for the guys they slap 4/5* on. That's pretty undeniable. But we have some here that can't get past thinking that's the gold standard... that there aren't a LOT of great players out there that for whatever reason just have "3*". Some of them need development. Some are just overlooked or underrated.

Cam Sutton makes a good example. Kind of a mid-level 3* as a recruit. A Georgia kid not offered by UGA or Bama. Walked in as a Fr and either started or made a major contribution right away. Became one of UT's better CB's of the last 20 years. He was in reality a 4/5* player right out of HS. For whatever reason, he didn't impress the recruiting sites.

 

[sjt18]

He's got to get more physical and be more aggressive. He knows where he's supposed to be and is fast and athletic enough to be in position to make plays. He's just a bit too passive out there.

Maybe that's it. Just seems weird though how many times the guy he's guarding makes a circus catch.

 

[volbeast33]

We certainly need 4 and 5 star players at a comparabe rate to our main competition.

We need to build and grow…. At that time we will start competing regular on the field and with recruits. You don’t go from being as poorly run as we have been to recruiting the same as Alabama and Georgia overnight… if we hired the right coach then we will get there.

 

[jakez4ut]

I would submit that the rankings for players pursued by the Sabans of the world are more likely to be accurate than the rankings for players pursued by Butch Jones.

I think somehow people believe that the recruiting sites are out there blazing a trail and elite recruiters come behind and recruit 5* guys. It is virtually the opposite. Even if the recruiting sites had guys who were competent to evaluate talent, they lack the money or numbers to adequately evaluate even the top 10% of HS players.

BOT is fond of saying, "Oh but look all the championship teams have high class rankings". So did Saban, Dabo, and Smart take their cue from 247 and Rivals... or did those sites try to determine which guys were priorities for those programs?

 

[SweetasSoda]

We need to build and grow…. At that time we will start competing regular on the field and with recruits. You don’t go from being as poorly run as we have been to recruiting the same as Alabama and Georgia overnight… if we hired the right coach then we will get there.

Yes. And the right coach is still going to have to be given time to build up the team.

 

[jakez4ut]

Agreed.

I think the recruiting ratings are accurate for the guys they slap 4/5* on. That's pretty undeniable. But we have some here that can't get past thinking that's the gold standard... that there aren't a LOT of great players out there that for whatever reason just have "3*". Some of them need development. Some are just overlooked or underrated.

Cam Sutton makes a good example. Kind of a mid-level 3* as a recruit. A Georgia kid not offered by UGA or Bama. Walked in as a Fr and either started or made a major contribution right away. Became one of UT's better CB's of the last 20 years. He was in reality a 4/5* player right out of HS. For whatever reason, he didn't impress the recruiting sites.

can be a lot of things. could be the division/class they play in is not very good or well thought of, competition levels are considered less than higher classes/divisions, especially in bigger metro areas where you may have 6 or 7+ different HS class divisions. could be that they didn't/haven't gone to a bunch of prospect camps throughout their HS career, so scouts simply haven't seen them. could be that he's used all over the field because of the athleticism/talent level, but never stands out at any one position so doesn't get noticed with other prospects excelling at a single position...

anyway, you get the idea and i agree with your premise. we see and hear about the Top247, ESPN300, Rivals250....out of hundreds of thousands of HS football players every year, so there's always guys out there that are excellent football players that never get noticed until some program's scouting department finds them, offers them, and then you start to get the buzz. but it's so late sometimes, the kid never gets the opportunity to "improve" his rankings.

so while i will always say "give me all the 4 and 5*'s'....i don't scoff too much when a staff offers a kid that you've never heard of, never been ranked....especially when they offer that kid at a camp, or just coming off a camp, at that school. and it's not like some of those kids just show up at those camps, many times it's the program's scouting departments that invite them to the camps at the school.

anyway, long story short....agreed.

 

[bigl3327]

can be a lot of things. could be the division/class they play in is not very good or well thought of, competition levels are considered less than higher classes/divisions, especially in bigger metro areas where you may have 6 or 7+ different HS class divisions. could be that they didn't/haven't gone to a bunch of prospect camps throughout their HS career, so scouts simply haven't seen them. could be that he's used all over the field because of the athleticism/talent level, but never stands out at any one position so doesn't get noticed with other prospects excelling at a single position...

anyway, you get the idea and i agree with your premise. we see and hear about the Top247, ESPN300, Rivals250....out of hundreds of thousands of HS football players every year, so there's always guys out there that are excellent football players that never get noticed until some program's scouting department finds them, offers them, and then you start to get the buzz. but it's so late sometimes, the kid never gets the opportunity to "improve" his rankings.

so while i will always say "give me all the 4 and 5*'s'....i don't scoff too much when a staff offers a kid that you've never heard of, never been ranked....especially when they offer that kid at a camp, or just coming off a camp, at that school. and it's not like some of those kids just show up at those camps, many times it's the program's scouting departments that invite them to the camps at the school.

anyway, long story short....agreed.

Recruiting isn't an exact science and they don't account for the intangibles like drive, work ethic, coachability, mental fortitude, etc..... So much goes into being a successful college football player that you can't measure on film or at a camp by some desk jockey. There's a reason that there are so many people involved in vetting and evaluating potential recruits.

 

[VflPT22]

That's what keeps me from expecting a big jump in year two. Burrell was evidently, according to Willie Martinez anyway, our second best cornerback behind Taylor. Not sure we recruited anyone who is physically ready to take his spot, so he will be out there almost every play again (barring injury). Players can improve, but I'm afraid secondary will still be an obvious weakness this year as well.
Good passing teams will torch our secondary unless the pass rush is a lot better than I think it will be.

I guess players can’t develop and improve from year to year

 

[NotoriousRPP]

Maybe that's it. Just seems weird though how many times the guy he's guarding makes a circus catch.

I think him being forced into early action as a freshman and then getting yanked out just as quickly shook his confidence. He does a good job of being where hes supposed to be but at the last minute over thinks it.

 

[volbeast33]

Yes. And the right coach is still going to have to be given time to build up the team.

As long as we stay competitive and fun while we build depth…. I’m fine and happy.

 

[UTvol1fn]

As long as we stay competitive and fun while we build depth…. I’m fine and happy.

Exactly. Last year was fun regardless of the records. Let's keep some continuity in the program.

 

[allvolrecruiting]

Every three star that commits to us is under rated and will be bumped to a four star.

Them are Volnation Forum Rules.

Until they go elsewhere and the lowest rating is right

 

[volbeast33]

Until they go elsewhere and the lowest rating is right

no….. usually some are pissed we got that player and then pissed that we lose that same player.