Official Watch Party Thread (NCAAT seeding edition)

#578
#578
Voltime123 said:
It’s no secret that the NCAAT is played on a neutral court the argument however was based on the fact that other teams didn’t have a great record in away games neutral court excluded (because they are not hostile environments) how are you guys missing this?
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As @wtmvol said, I get what you're driving at, now, but I don't understand why you're trying to pound that point home because it isn't relevant to the event (the NCAAT) that you're trying to use it as a qualifier for.

The NCAAT is played on a neutral floor, so why do true road games matter towards advancing your point that Tennessee has an impressive résumé, but neutral floor games don't matter? That just makes no sense. It just seems like qualifying for the sake of qualifying. There's no substance or reasoning. No one is even arguing that Tennessee doesn't have an impressive résumé.

It just seems like you're trying to drill down to such fine detail between us and the teams that we are competing with for seeding so that no discernable difference can be found.
 
#579
#579
bleedingTNorange said:
I’m sure you’ll say “well those aren’t impressive” but they’re much better than what Tennessee has on its resume, so spin that however you want.
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cncchris33 said:
As @wtmvol said, I get what you're driving at, now, but I don't understand why you're trying to pound that point home because it isn't relevant to the event (the NCAAT) that you're trying to use it as a qualifier for.

The NCAAT is played on a neutral floor, so why do true road games matter towards advancing your point that Tennessee has an impressive résumé, but neutral floor games don't matter? That just makes no sense. It just seems like qualifying for the sake of qualifying. There's no substance or reasoning. No one is even arguing that Tennessee doesn't have an impressive résumé.

It just seems like you're trying to drill down to such fine detail between us and the teams that we are competing with for seeding so that no discernable difference can be found.
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It’s all opinion is my point I think you could both agree that Kentucky’s win at Kansas is more impressive than Duke’s neutral court win against Gonzaga…regardless is most (4 out of 10) of the top ten do not have a winning record on the road so it’s not like we are alone on a mountain here
 
#580
#580
Voltime123 said:
It’s all opinion is my point I think you could both agree that Kentucky’s win at Kansas is more impressive than Duke’s neutral court win against Gonzaga…regardless is most (4 out of 10) of the top ten do not have a winning record on the road so it’s not like we are alone on a mountain here
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But now you’re moving your point/opinion to winning record, when before it was simply multiple wins away from home, so which is it? You can manipulate the stats however you want to fit them, sure not many have a winning record, but almost all of more true road wins than Tennessee, which was the original point.
 
#582
#582
bleedingTNorange said:
But now you’re moving your point/opinion to winning record, when before it was simply multiple wins away from home, so which is it? You can manipulate the stats however you want to fit them, sure not many have a winning record, but almost all of more true road wins than Tennessee, which was the original point.
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No the original point was that the top ten teams wins away from home against Quad 1 are not that great and I put in a outlier with not using neutral games as true road games…sure you can put those teams over Tennessee but to act like they are more impressive based on that is subjective. Prior to all of this ppl were talking about how our away record would hamstring us with seeding…And all I said was that the top ten teams away records were not that impressive either and it wasn’t till then that you went into comparison mode over it.

Do the teams in front of us have a better away record than UT? Yes…Are those records impressive? No, not in my opinion especially when you consider that of the top ten teams ranked only 4 of them have a winning record away from home against quad 1 teams, that’s with counting neutral court games which imo is not a true road game…
 
#583
#583
Voltime123 said:
No the original point was that the top ten teams wins away from home against Quad 1 are not that great and I put in a outlier with not using neutral games as true road games…sure you can put those teams over Tennessee but to act like they are more impressive based on that is subjective. Prior to all of this ppl were talking about how our away record would hamstring us with seeding…And all I said was that the top ten teams away records were not that impressive either and it wasn’t till then that you went into comparison mode over it.

Do the teams in front of us have a better away record than UT? Yes…Are those records impressive? No, not in my opinion especially when you consider that of the top ten teams ranked only 4 of them have a winning record away from home against quad 1 teams, that’s with counting neutral court games which imo is not a true road game…
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Not counting neutral site games...which is beyond dumb, but whatever...Tennessee is 2-5 against Q1 teams on the road. And those two teams (Mississippi State and Vanderbilt) aren't NCAAT teams.

What about that do you find so impressive?
 
#584
#584
Voltime123 said:
No the original point was that the top ten teams wins away from home against Quad 1 are not that great and I put in a outlier with not using neutral games as true road games
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Except that wasn’t your original point, here’s your post…

Voltime123 said:
The narrative that we can’t win away is highly exaggerated. Name me other teams in the top ten that have top 25 wins away from home aside from the Kentucky vs Kansas game…the point is there are few and far between to choose from because those teams don’t have the strength of schedule like other teams do, neutrals courts don’t count…
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That’s false, every single Top 10 team except for Duke & Tennessee have at least 1 true road Top 25 win.
 
#585
#585
bleedingTNorange said:
Except that wasn’t your original point, here’s your post…



That’s false, every single Top 10 team except for Duke & Tennessee have at least 1 true road Top 25 win.
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I feel like we are going back and forth here…those teams records as whole for away games are not that impressive to me. You can disagree with me all you want
 
#586
#586
Voltime123 said:
I feel like we are going back and forth here…those teams records as whole for away games are not that impressive to me. You can disagree with me all you want
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But again, that isn’t what you originally said…it started with nobody has Top 25 road wins, that gets proven wrong and so then you change it to overall records. That’s shows you you’re wrong and you say neutral doesn’t count. True road games are shown and you say overall SOS should outweigh that. You just keep moving things around, not really sure why, but whatever I suppose. Tennessee’s lack of road success is the biggest thing keeping them from currently being a seed, their road success or lack thereof is probably the worst of anyone in the Top 10, simple as that.
 
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#587
#587
cncchris33 said:
Not counting neutral site games...which is beyond dumb, but whatever...Tennessee is 2-5 against Q1 teams on the road. And those two teams (Mississippi State and Vanderbilt) aren't NCAAT teams.

What about that do you find so impressive?
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Find where I said it was impressive?…I said our counterparts records away from home is not that impressive either. I wasn’t comparing our team with theirs because we both know our record is also unimpressive if not worse but im also not acting like that is going to be the only selling point the committee will use to determine seeding
 
#588
#588
bleedingTNorange said:
But again, that isn’t what you originally said…it started with nobody has Top 25 road wins, that gets proven wrong and so then you change it to overall records. That’s shows you you’re wrong and you say neutral doesn’t count. True road games are shown and you say overall SOS should outweigh that. You just keep moving things around, not really sure why, but whatever I suppose. Tennessee’s lack of road success is the biggest thing keeping them from currently being a seed, their road success or lack thereof is probably the worst of anyone in the Top 10, simple as that.
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I never said nobody though, I said few and far between have impressive wins away from home. Again this is all subjective and opinion when making that determination
 
#591
#591
Voltime123 said:
Find where I said it was impressive?…I said our counterparts records away from home is not that impressive either. I wasn’t comparing our team with theirs because we both know our record is also unimpressive if not worse but im also not acting like that is going to be the only selling point the committee will use to determine seeding
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I'm not saying that you said it was impressive. I was asking the question because you've decried everyone else's record in those games but our own. So now you've openly admitted that our record in those games is less than impressive and worse than the majority of the teams we are competing with for seeding.

Literally, no one else is saying that is the sole determining factor in NCAAT seeding, but not acknowledging that at the top of the bracket that every inch of your résumé is under a microscope is foolish. That single factor isn't the end all, be all, but it will be a factor and could be the difference in us getting a 2 or a 3 if the decision is between Tennessee and another team with a similar résumé, but a better record away from home in Q1 games.
 
#592
#592
cncchris33 said:
I'm not saying that you said it was impressive. I was asking the question because you've decried everyone else's record in those games but our own. So now you've openly admitted that our record in those games is less than impressive and worse than the majority of the teams we are competing with for seeding.

Literally, no one else is saying that is the sole determining factor in NCAAT seeding, but not acknowledging that at the top of the bracket that every inch of your résumé is under a microscope is foolish. That single factor isn't the end all, be all, but it will be a factor and could be the difference in us getting a 2 or a 3 if the decision is between Tennessee and another team with a similar résumé, but a better record away from home in Q1 games.
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The bolded was literally my argument lol i like how we are circling back to the main point that started all of this to begin with. The talking point was about our lackluster record being a factor away from home against Quad 1…which you said prevents prevents us from being considered a 2 seed right now if we win out the regular season…I pointed out how our counterparts records are not all that impressive either away from home although admittedly better than ours…Im not discounting that fact as a non factor for the selection committee im simply disagreeing it will be considered a determining factor based on our strength of schedule and overall resume putting their away records into context… we are a low 2 seed if we win out the regular season in my mind but again this is all opinion
cncchris33 said:
Good grief...I already mentioned that we beat UNC. I even stepped in and called it our best win away from home.

And I didn't say that winning at Colorado wasn't a good win. But by your own barometer (top-25 wins away from home), it doesn't qualify.

You just seem to be crafting this discussion to tailor-fit your agenda. I love our résumé. We've played a lot of really good teams, and we've beaten a lot of them, too. We just haven't beaten many of them away from home given the number of chances we've had. We are 1-7 in those games. That's a fair criticism.
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I think it’s hardly fair criticism when you are discounting our resume as good enough for a 2 seed if we win out during the regular season. Neutral court wins are great but they are not true road wins and from your list only a few top ten teams have that going for them which is my point.
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#594
#594
Voltime123 said:
The bolded was literally my argument lol i like how we are circling back to the main point that started all of this to begin with. The talking point was about our lackluster record being a factor away from home against Quad 1…which you said prevents prevents us from being considered a 2 seed right now if we win out the regular season…I pointed out how our counterparts records are not all that impressive either away from home although admittedly better than ours…Im not discounting that fact as a non factor for the selection committee im simply disagreeing it will be considered a determining factor based on our strength of schedule and overall resume putting their away records into context… we are a low 2 seed if we win out the regular season in my mind but again this is all opinion
I think it’s hardly fair criticism when you are discounting our resume as good enough for a 2 seed if we win out during the regular season. Neutral court wins are great but they are not true road wins and from your list only a few top ten teams have that going for them which is my point.
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Sure, in a vacuum, our résumé is good enough for a 2 seed if we win out in the regular season. But the NCAAT field isn't built solely around your regular season record. The conference tournaments play a role, particularly if you play exceptionally well, or exceptionally poorly.

Additionally, you aren't accounting for the other teams already ahead of us for the four spots on the 2-seed line. If Purdue wins the Big 10, Villanova wins the Big East, Duke wins the ACC, and Texas Tech wins the Big 12, you are honestly going to tell me that a Tennessee team that doesn't win the SEC, and is already competing with or behind them in most bracket projections, deserves to jump any of those 4 teams? Really?

You are also making the assumption that we don't bomb out against a middle of the road SEC team in the quarterfinals. It's doubtful, and on paper, it shouldn't happen, but if it did, I'd bet my house we aren't a 2 seed.
 
#595
#595
cncchris33 said:
Sure, in a vacuum, our résumé is good enough for a 2 seed if we win out in the regular season. But the NCAAT field isn't built solely around your regular season record. The conference tournaments play a role, particularly if you play exceptionally well, or exceptionally poorly.

Additionally, you aren't accounting for the other teams already ahead of us for the four spots on the 2-seed line. If Purdue wins the Big 10, Villanova wins the Big East, Duke wins the ACC, and Texas Tech wins the Big 12, you are honestly going to tell me that a Tennessee team that doesn't win the SEC, and is already competing with or behind them in most bracket projections, deserves to jump any of those 4 teams? Really?

You are also making the assumption that we don't bomb out against a middle of the road SEC team in the quarterfinals. It's doubtful, and on paper, it shouldn't happen, but if it did, I'd bet my house we aren't a 2 seed.
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Fair enough
 
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