On Hopson's Last Shot

#76
#76
Vol Mania 21 said:
i played the game thru college, our team has been in that situation before. unlike you who plays out that scenario on xbox
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Dude, I don't even have an XBox, Nintendo or whatever video games systems are out there, I have no idea. I do know that I have played ball my whole life, my best friend from college is an Assistant Coach at a university in Wisconsin and played for the winningest coach in Wisconsin history for my high school career.

I'm sure I have no idea what the hell I'm talking about, though.
 
#77
#77
church league doesn't count, and just because your friend is an assistant coach does that automatically mean you know basketball? hell my cousin is a heart surgeon, does that mean i can perform open heart surgery? you keep proving you have no idea what you're talking about
 
#78
#78
Vol Mania 21 said:
church league doesn't count, and just because your friend is an assistant coach does that automatically mean you know basketball? hell my cousin is a heart surgeon, does that mean i can perform open heart surgery? you keep proving you have no idea what you're talking about
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Come on . . . You know exactly what he is saying. When the game is tied, you hold for the last shot. When you're behind, maybe you burn some clock, but you start looking for the shot a lot earlier and score and play defense if you have to.

I could be wrong, but I don't think he's railing against what you are saying as much as some of these goofballs acting as if we should have held the ball and shot it with 3 seconds to go even though we were behind.
 
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#79
#79
GAVol. Down by 1 in a perfect world, would you rather shoot with 6 seconds or 12 seconds left on the clock?
 
#80
#80
you take a shot with 6 or 7 seconds left, which gives you enough time to rebound and put up another shot. why would want to give them the ball back and give them a shot to win it? that's the stupidest thing i've ever heard. how many times have you seen a team go up one or 2 w/ 10 seconds or less, and the other team gets the ball goes down and wins the game.
 
#81
#81
SaintBruce said:
GAVol. Down by 1 in a perfect world, would you rather shoot with 6 seconds or 12 seconds left on the clock?
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The problem is that when you're behind you're in the most imperfect world of all and have to take what you can get. You just can't pass up an open look because you may not get another one.

You can burn off some of the clock, but I doubt many coaches want to run it down under about 15 seconds before they start the offense and look for a decent shot.
 
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#82
#82
Vol Mania 21 said:
church league doesn't count, and just because your friend is an assistant coach does that automatically mean you know basketball? hell my cousin is a heart surgeon, does that mean i can perform open heart surgery? you keep proving you have no idea what you're talking about
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Well, you are trying hard, but it's still pretty clumsy and you're assuming stuff you have no idea regarding. I've never played church league. I have played organized basketball, for one of the best programs in my entire state and in college as well (limited, granted). Hell, I'm 32 and can still dunk. So, yes, I've done a little more than church league.

And, the heart surgery analogy is ridiculous. It isn't complicated to run a scenario by a basketball coach and ask them how they handle it. Something tells me it might be easier to understand their answer than a question about triple bypass surgery.

In any regard, ask a coach. I have. Trust me, I understood his answer very well. Much better than I would understand an answer from my surgeon brother-in-law.
 
#84
#84
GAVol said:
The problem is that when you're behind you're in the most imperfect world of all and have to take what you can get. You just can't pass up an open look because you may not get another one.
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Fair Enough. So a shot with 25 seconds left would have been fine too?
 
#85
#85
Vol Mania 21 said:
you take a shot with 6 or 7 seconds left, which gives you enough time to rebound and put up another shot. why would want to give them the ball back and give them a shot to win it? that's the stupidest thing i've ever heard. how many times have you seen a team go up one or 2 w/ 10 seconds or less, and the other team gets the ball goes down and wins the game.
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Then you need to talk to 95% of coaches in college basketball. You only want the last shot when you are tied. You want to give yourself time for another opportunity if you miss a shot when down one.

Tell me when you have ever seen a coach down one wait to shoot at the end of the game and look for a make or put back? It never happens, trust me. Never. You always leave time, when possible, to give yourself more opportunities to tie or win.
 
#86
#86
SaintBruce said:
Fair Enough. So a shot with 25 seconds left would have been fine too?
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If it went in . . . yeah. I'd rather take a chance on my defense when I'm ahead than taking a chance on my offense when I'm behind.
 
#87
#87
SaintBruce said:
Fair Enough. So a shot with 25 seconds left would have been fine too?
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Yes, it would. You take a good shot when down in the last minute. It's always preferable to be in a position of winning as opposed to having the ball. The percentage of stopping someone is better than the percentage of scoring in the final seconds.
 
#88
#88
Unimane said:
Well, you are trying hard, but it's still pretty clumsy and you're assuming stuff you have no idea regarding. I've never played church league. I have played organized basketball, for one of the best programs in my entire state and in college as well (limited, granted). Hell, I'm 32 and can still dunk. So, yes, I've done a little more than church league.

And, the heart surgery analogy is ridiculous. It isn't complicated to run a scenario by a basketball coach and ask them how they handle it. Something tells me it might be easier to understand their answer than a question about triple bypass surgery.

In any regard, ask a coach. I have. Trust me, I understood his answer very well. Much better than I would understand an answer from my surgeon brother-in-law.
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sweet
 
#89
#89
Unimane said:
Well, you are trying hard, but it's still pretty clumsy and you're assuming stuff you have no idea regarding. I've never played church league. I have played organized basketball, for one of the best programs in my entire state and in college as well (limited, granted). Hell, I'm 32 and can still dunk. So, yes, I've done a little more than church league.

And, the heart surgery analogy is ridiculous. It isn't complicated to run a scenario by a basketball coach and ask them how they handle it. Something tells me it might be easier to understand their answer than a question about triple bypass surgery.

In any regard, ask a coach. I have. Trust me, I understood his answer very well. Much better than I would understand an answer from my surgeon brother-in-law.
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:eek:lol:
 
#90
#90
GAVol said:
Come on . . . You know exactly what he is saying. When the game is tied, you hold for the last shot. When you're behind, maybe you burn some clock, but you start looking for the shot a lot earlier and score and play defense if you have to.

I could be wrong, but I don't think he's railing against what you are saying as much as some of these goofballs acting as if we should have held the ball and shot it with 3 seconds to go even though we were behind.
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I didn't see anyone advocating that position. I certainly wasn't. I, like everyone that participated in the discussion, advocated taking the shot with 5-9 seconds on the clock. No one advocated taking a buzzer beater. That's a complete mischaracterization of the argument on here. The only example that you and Unimane could conjure up is the 1987 Indiana final where they did exactly what I and the numerous other posters said we should have done.
 
#91
#91
LawVol13 said:
I dididn't see anyone advocating that position. I certainly wasn't. I, like everyone that participated in the discussion, advocated taking the shot with 5-9 seconds on the clock. No one advocated taking a buzzer beater. That's a complete mischaracterization of the argument on here. The only example that you and Unimane could conjure up is the 1987 Indiana final where they did exactly what I and the numerous other posters said we should have done.
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I'm not talking about this thread in particular. There were people in other threads advocating holding the ball for the last shot as if the game was tied . . . and as far as "conjuring up" something, I just posted a video that I saw somebody talking about. :dunno:

I don't get what all the drama in this thread is about.
 
#92
#92
i just like stirring it up, i didnt agree w/ the OP position on the topic but i just wanted to spice it up
 
#93
#93
LawVol13 said:
I didn't see anyone advocating that position. I certainly wasn't. I, like everyone that participated in the discussion, advocated taking the shot with 5-9 seconds on the clock. No one advocated taking a buzzer beater. That's a complete mischaracterization of the argument on here. The only example that you and Unimane could conjure up is the 1987 Indiana final where they did exactly what I and the numerous other posters said we should have done.
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Not really, I referenced a number of games, the Michigan St.-Maryland, OSU-UT games among them.

However, the discussion began with the statement that you wait until the end (when down) of the game in order to have time only for a shot and a put back and not allow the other team time to have a shot. Now, it's 5-9 seconds, which would allow the other team an opportunity. Plus, the difference between 12 and 9 seconds is negligible.

Like I said above, the lead is far more valuable than possession in that situation. Ideally, in Tennessee's situation against Michigan St., you score on a good look to take a lead whenever that is, whether 25 or 10 seconds. You then call timeout and set up your defense. Playing defense is optimal because, not only is it easier to change defenses, trap, confuse, etc., but officials also tend to let more physical play occur in order to "let the players decide", making it even easier to get a stop.

Look at the the garbage looks Ohio State got against us on Friday night. It's simply much easier to play defense in the final seconds than offense,especially when the coach is able to set it up.
 
#96
#96
Unimane said:
However, the discussion began with the statement that you wait until the end (when down) of the game in order to have time only for a shot and a put back and not allow the other team time to have a shot. Now, it's 5-9 seconds,
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Actually it hasn't changed at all. When lawvol first mentioned this a couple days ago he said 5-8 seconds.
 
#97
#97
VOLinthaATL said:
What out this guy is a man! He is 32! AND HE CAN DUNK!
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Yes, and hit the three. Dual threat.

I don't know if you've been 32 or not, but that ability won't last much longer. I gotta be proud of it as long as I've got it.
 
#99
#99
come on man, everyone knows you want to shoot and give the other team plenty of time to call a timeout and set up a play
 
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