QB drive & unit comparisons

[Catbone]

So in summary, our 2nd team on both sides of the ball really blows. Despite the new talent, we desperately need a few more good recruiting classes to have quality depth.

This. We need 2 more years with the same level of talent we recruited this year to be competitive in the SEC.

 

[lexkyvol]

Youre going to think im biased for saying this, but im not. Im saying this based on what other have said,

From what several people have said, the sacks were caused from the oline not protecting well. Several people have also said it looked like the coaches ran more blitzes against him. In the video were he fumbles, you can see the oline didnt block anybody and he tried to extend the play. The INT was probably all on him though.

Its only 1 day. People have good and bad days. Dobbs was getting sacked a ton and lost a bunch of fumbles throughout the spring. Peterman was getting sacked a lot too because he was holding the ball to long. And that all happened in scrimmage like situations.

why would the reports be tailored? every single source was saying the same thing and even described the plays.

not gonna polarize u or anything, but that's what the media does. they will tell u what u want to hear for ratings if u don't have access. do u honestly think, with all those folk who were screamin fergy, that it would've been either smart or good for ratings for them to come back and say anything negative about him or positive about dobbs, peterman, or half the time even worley? worley has CLEARLY improved, yet we never heard about it. this wasn't just some gimmick. it was real. the stage was set. it was time to perform. riley was at what u just said about dobbs, yet all we heard was otherwise. then came the excuses from the very same media. that's one thing about the media. to maintain, they will throw anyone under the bus and lie or tell parts of the story. if you or anyone lese believes the media tells you the 100% accurate truth all the time, please wake up.

where are the weapons of mass destruction?

 

[KBVol]

i think those reports were tailored towards majority favorite instead of actual. i mean how can one's performance drop off so bad as to be below nathan peterman? and he kept the ball because he was missing the reads, not by choice, which further insinuates that this is not the type of system for him. folks were right with him being a ginslinger. riley is a passer....pocket passer. can he scramble, yes. but read-option is not his game and he's not comfortable in it. this is why he looked lost imo. and after a summer and almost a schoolyear on campus, along with winter workouts and personal training, that 40 time could either be wrong by espn as u suggested, or dobbs not only got bigger and stronger.....but faster.

Welp, found another former player for you to call a liar LexKy... Jayson Swain just said "Dobbs had a bounce back day on Saturday, he had begun to bury himself in the depth chart and that Worley and Ferguson had begun to separate themselves" in the QB race this spring before Saturday's scrimmage.

Fire away at yet another great former Vol. You could even call into his show and let him know how he's either dishonest or he's a CBJ pawn doing a great injustice to the fan base. Sure he'd love to hear from you.

 

[sjt18]

I didn't hear it that way at all. No question that Ainge really likes Ferguson but it's because of what EVERYBODY who has watched the QBs practice/play.... he has the biggest, most talented arm. Ainge has said repeatedly that Ferguson has great upside but that he can't start until he cleans up his mistakes, stops taking unnecessary chances, stops turning the ball over.

He was accurate in saying that Riley was splitting first team reps with Worley. He has also said without hesitation that Worley would start if the season started today and will almost certainly be the starter in the fall.

He criticized Riley for not studying enough and not remotely understanding pass protection. He said he thought it was possible that the coaches were trying to teach him a lesson, get a point across to him by running blitzes and stunts when he was in. The fact that he took 3 of the 4 sacks given up all day would perhaps support this. I know the sack that he fumbled on was by a safety, Swafford iirc. Certainly seems plausible to me.

And before a couple of Ferguson haters jump all over this (not including you here Sjt), I'm more than comfortable with Worley or Dobbs. As I'm sure you know, I've been one of the few that have joined you in defending both from last years play.

The only thing there I found suspect was the idea that only Ferguson saw blitzes and such. Maybe that's true... but it seems off.

Yeah. I'd agree we've been pretty much together on "whoever starts" and "Worley/Dobbs don't suck".... :hi:

 

[PassedOutAwake]

not gonna polarize u or anything, but that's what the media does. they will tell u what u want to hear for ratings if u don't have access. do u honestly think, with all those folk who were screamin fergy, that it would've been either smart or good for ratings for them to come back and say anything negative about him or positive about dobbs, peterman, or half the time even worley? worley has CLEARLY improved, yet we never heard about it. this wasn't just some gimmick. it was real. the stage was set. it was time to perform. riley was at what u just said about dobbs, yet all we heard was otherwise. then came the excuses from the very same media. that's one thing about the media. to maintain, they will throw anyone under the bus and lie or tell parts of the story. if you or anyone lese believes the media tells you the 100% accurate truth all the time, please wake up.

where are the weapons of mass destruction?

not the same type of media. were talking about former players, bloggers, TSR guys and guys from VQ,247 and scout. everything they said was spot on. and when they all say the same thing, and describe the plays, its not a conspiracy

Theyve been saying Worley was consistent and didnt lose the ball. Thats exactly what happened.

Theyve been saying Fergy had an incredible arm but suffered from turnovers and some bad decisions. Thats exactly what happened.

The only thing that was a different was Dobbs performance. But thats kind of what happens when they tell you that hes been inconsistent. (Good one day and not so great the next)

 

[sjt18]

Maybe next year hell be the starter. I personally think its Worley. He lead the offense to 3 scoring drives (out of 4) against the first team D. A FG, threw a TD and had the long run that ended on the 1 yard line that set up the TD by Hurd.

Scoring on 75% of his drives vs the 1s would win us several games.

My statement probably didn't read exactly like I intended. I meant that I thought that Dobbs would be a starter in his UT career if he keeps improving his arm strength even if he never has quite as much as Ferguson.

The power he ran with Saturday was pretty impressive and he made some really nice throws too.

 

[PassedOutAwake]

My statement probably didn't read exactly like I intended. I meant that I thought that Dobbs would be a starter in his UT career if he keeps improving his arm strength even if he never has quite as much as Ferguson.

The power he ran with Saturday was pretty impressive and he made some really nice throws too.

Thats the thing with these QBs, you never know what could happen. Ferguson could have the turnaround year that Dobbs just had. Then next year we will have another QB race between Fergy, Dobbs, Jennings, whoever the other QB is that we sign, and Peterman (if hes still around)

 

[KBVol]

The only thing there I found suspect was the idea that only Ferguson saw blitzes and such. Maybe that's true... but it seems off.

Yeah. I'd agree we've been pretty much together on "whoever starts" and "Worley/Dobbs don't suck".... :hi:

The fact that Swafford, a safety, was the one who blitzed and sacked Ferguson kinda validates the theory IMO. Ferguson was splitting first team reps with Worley towards the end of Spring for a reason.... he was playing well. I found it curious that he took 3 sacks, which was 3 more than Worley and Dobbs combined, and that he seemed to be under more quick pressure than the others. I heard Kesling say that he barely had time to fake a handoff to his RB before getting hit immediately on one sack. Of course some will say these are excuses. Don't care. Seems plausible to me that if learning/calling protections is a major weakness, that Butch could've decided to teach the kid a pretty severe lesson and/or see how he would react in as close to live game action as he's seen at the collegiate level. After all, he's the only QB on the roster who hadn't played in a real game.

 

[lexkyvol]

not the same type of media. were talking about former players, bloggers, TSR guys and guys from VQ,247 and scout. everything they said was spot on. and when they all say the same thing, and describe the plays, its not a conspiracy

Theyve been saying Worley was consistent and didnt lose the ball. Thats exactly what happened.

Theyve been saying Fergy had an incredible arm but suffered from turnovers and some bad decisions. Thats exactly what happened.

The only thing that was a different was Dobbs performance. But thats kind of what happens when they tell you that hes been inconsistent. (Good one day and not so great the next)

they didn't say this, butch did. when thee was any negative posted about riley, it was coach's speak.

btw, coaches never said dobbs had bad days

 

[lexkyvol]

Welp, found another former player for you to call a liar LexKy... Jayson Swain just said "Dobbs had a bounce back day on Saturday, he had begun to bury himself in the depth chart and that Worley and Ferguson had begun to separate themselves" in the QB race this spring before Saturday's scrimmage.

Fire away at yet another great former Vol. You could even call into his show and let him know how he's either dishonest or he's a CBJ pawn doing a great injustice to the fan base. Sure he'd love to hear from you.

am i supposed to be afraid or something? get off his balls. u sound like a groupie. he has his thoughts and i have mine. just because he's a former great doesn't make him more right or wrong and media is media, not players. he doesn't play football anymore. he has to do whats best to put food on his table.

 

[lexkyvol]

Thats the thing with these QBs, you never know what could happen. Ferguson could have the turnaround year that Dobbs just had. Then next year we will have another QB race between Fergy, Dobbs, Jennings, whoever the other QB is that we sign, and Peterman (if hes still around)

this is true

 

[GOATeric14berry]

If Dobbs isn't the starter then he should be red shirted no doubt

 

[lexkyvol]

The fact that Swafford, a safety, was the one who blitzed and sacked Ferguson kinda validates the theory IMO. Ferguson was splitting first team reps with Worley towards the end of Spring for a reason.... he was playing well. I found it curious that he took 3 sacks, which was 3 more than Worley and Dobbs combined, and that he seemed to be under more quick pressure than the others. I heard Kesling say that he barely had time to fake a handoff to his RB before getting hit immediately on one sack. Of course some will say these are excuses. Don't care. Seems plausible to me that if learning/calling protections is a major weakness, that Butch could've decided to teach the kid a pretty severe lesson and/or see how he would react in as close to live game action as he's seen at the collegiate level. After all, he's the only QB on the roster who hadn't played in a real game.

everyone got blitzed. as butch alluded too, riley doesn't study enough. this is why he got sacked. he's a slinger. his weaknesses are understanding the system, the entire system. his reads are off, pass protections calls are off, and he takes too many risks. that's why butch clearly said that his type of qb play is not what is appropriate at the university of tennessee.

but hey, hope is good i guess

 

[lexkyvol]

If Dobbs isn't the starter then he should be red shirted no doubt

i agree, but i think this should be based on worley staying healthy all season. if worley gets injured, i think u gotta go with dobbs again

 

[wolfej]

Wasn't Ainge leading the band for Ferguson just a few days ago? Not sure Ainge is a whole lot better than Hyams at this point.

Someone else here just posted that Worley's long run was on a blitz that he read well.

He could be right about Jones "picking on" Ferguson... but that sounds more like him trying to save face.

How is that him trying to save face? That to me is calling it like you see it and disregarding opinions that he had earlier. When someone is given new information (the Orange and White game) and they give a new opinion, that is NOT being a hypocrite, that is basing a new opinion off of previously non-existent information.

 

[KBVol]

everyone got blitzed. as butch alluded too, riley doesn't study enough. this is why he got sacked. he's a slinger. his weaknesses are understanding the system, the entire system. his reads are off, pass protections calls are off, and he takes too many risks. that's why butch clearly said that his type of qb play is not what is appropriate at the university of tennessee.

but hey, hope is good i guess

You been at practice to know all this? You attended all the scrimmages? We know you don't listen to or read anything from those who have been there. Are you on the staff? On the team? Work maintenance within the AD? Are you a trainer? Ball boy? Are you Sara Mitchell?

How do you possibly know all these details about Riley? Do you have access to practice tape? He's thrown exactly 12 passes now for the public to see, 7 of which he completed, 1 of which was for a td to a 3rd string WR. You've evaluated those 12 passes and come up with the BS you just wrote? Tell us how you do it.

 

[perico]

there were several reports that Riley was right behind Dobbs (talent wise) running the ball. several reports that he was running the ball well during spring practice. Riley and Dobbs both fit Butch's system. the biggest knock that I heard about Riley running the ball was that he kept it too many times on the read option, instead of giving it to the RB.

I know its ESPN, but if you look at both of their recruiting profiles, Riley has the faster 40 time

I'd want to compare shuttle times. Dobbs' speed isn't straight line. Most all agree (even Ainge and crew) that he's our most mobile QB. Dobbs is agile and will make tacklers miss.

 

[CarbonVol]

I think someone with thread making ability a should start a QB starter prediction poll. Put me down for predicting Worrrrleeeeeyyy. He may not be the best but I just have a feeling.

 

[perico]

everyone got blitzed. as butch alluded too, riley doesn't study enough. this is why he got sacked. he's a slinger. his weaknesses are understanding the system, the entire system. his reads are off, pass protections calls are off, and he takes too many risks. that's why butch clearly said that his type of qb play is not what is appropriate at the university of tennessee.

but hey, hope is good i guess

Ainge was going on and on about it this morning. Saying basically that Riley hasn't really shown any grasp of protection schemes, but wowed people with his arm. I'm in the Worley camp, but at this point think Dobbs is a safer option to be the 2 and future starter (which doesn't mean I am writing off Ferguson already). Riley is like a Brandon Stewart. Great tools, but not sure he's got the mental aspect down yet.

Dobbs has his faults, but I don't worry about him not having mental understanding of anything... literally.

 

[PassedOutAwake]

Ainge was going on and on about it this morning. Saying basically that Riley hasn't really shown any grasp of protection schemes, but wowed people with his arm. I'm in the Worley camp, but at this point think Dobbs is a safer option to be the 2 and future starter (which doesn't mean I am writing off Ferguson already). Riley is like a Brandon Stewart. Great tools, but not sure he's got the mental aspect down yet.

Dobbs has his faults, but I don't worry about him not having mental understanding of anything... literally.

Pretty fair assumption. I pretty much agree with this. The one thing where I differ from a lot of people is my concern with Dobbs. Im wondering if it was because of the dropoff in talent between the 1st team O and the first team D. Mainly because our 2nd team D compares to last years Kentucky D. His performance against the 2nd team D was similar to what he did against Kentucky last season. But that was really the only game he produced in. Im not doubting him, just a little cautious that the talent of the defense could have been a large factor in why he performed so well. If he wouldve done that against the 1s, I would feel a ton better. And I know people will say its not his fault that he always went against the 2s, but it kind of is. If he wouldve had a better spring, he probably wouldve in Fergy's spot.

I guess heres my thoughts on each QB

Worley - Happy with consistency
Ferguson - Needs experience and learn more reads, but I think we still havent seen everything hes got yet
Peterman - still unsure if UF was a fluke (was his 1st game). but he hasnt reall shown much hope
Dobbs - cautious because of the talent differential

 

[KBVol]

Ainge was going on and on about it this morning. Saying basically that Riley hasn't really shown any grasp of protection schemes, but wowed people with his arm. I'm in the Worley camp, but at this point think Dobbs is a safer option to be the 2 and future starter (which doesn't mean I am writing off Ferguson already). Riley is like a Brandon Stewart. Great tools, but not sure he's got the mental aspect down yet.

Dobbs has his faults, but I don't worry about him not having mental understanding of anything... literally.

Dobbs is my favorite QB. Would love to see him out there, saw a lot of potential in him last year under very difficult circumstances. He looked good 2nd half vs Bama, was by far our best player on the road vs Mizzou and had zero help in his first start. Struggled vs Auburn like everybody else, was half of an anemic passing game vs Vandy yet still scored what should've been the winning td, and played very well vs Ky.

That being said, Worley looks like he's much improved, very confident running the offense.... I'm more than comfortable with him running the show if they name him the starter over Dobbs.

 

[perico]

Pretty fair assumption. I pretty much agree with this. The one thing where I differ from a lot of people is my concern with Dobbs. Im wondering if it was because of the dropoff in talent between the 1st team O and the first team D. Mainly because our 2nd team D compares to last years Kentucky D. His performance against the 2nd team D was similar to what he did against Kentucky last season. But that was really the only game he produced in. Im not doubting him, just a little cautious that the talent of the defense could have been a large factor in why he performed so well. If he wouldve done that against the 1s, I would feel a ton better. And I know people will say its not his fault that he always went against the 2s, but it kind of is. If he wouldve had a better spring, he probably wouldve in Fergy's spot.

I guess heres my thoughts on each QB

Worley - Happy with consistency
Ferguson - Needs experience and learn more reads, but I think we still havent seen everything hes got yet
Peterman - still unsure if UF was a fluke (was his 1st game). but he hasnt reall shown much hope
Dobbs - cautious because of the talent differential

One thing that gives me some confidence regarding Dobbs' ability against SEC defense is that he was all state in one of the toughest high school divisions in the southeast. Riley played 4aa in NC, whereas Dobbs played at Alpharetta, the largest classification in Georgia. 23 kids signed football scholarships out of Dobbs region alone last year. There is a pretty substantial talent difference between the two. Riley was a big fish in a smaller pond, and may have been able to get by on his talent without having to master making the right adjustments etc. It may take him some time to catch up.

 

[VOLINVONORE]

So the biggest knock on dobbs coming out of the o&w game is he didn't face the 1st team d.
1. How is that his fault? CBJ didn't get him in against the ones so he took what he got and showed out.
2. Everyones argument is that the 2nd team d is a huge step down from the ones. If thats the case how did the come up with two turnovers against Riley?
I like the break down op thanks!
With this breakdown and from what I saw its clear that Worley did what he needed to solidify himself as the starter.

The second team offensive line was the worst unit on the field. On Ferguson's' two turn overs, he was hit lost as soon as he took the snap. Considering that, all four QBs had better days than at anytime last year.

 

[sjt18]

Thats the thing with these QBs, you never know what could happen. Ferguson could have the turnaround year that Dobbs just had. Then next year we will have another QB race between Fergy, Dobbs, Jennings, whoever the other QB is that we sign, and Peterman (if hes still around)

Agree. I don't personally think Peterman will stay. It looks like he's trailing the other three and will be recruited over next fall. I like him. I think he has talent. I just don't think he'll ever start at UT barring injury based on what we now know.

Agree that things can change. But I like Dobbs' game and advantages. He's extremely smart and seems to be very coachable. I know someone cited some "40 time" that says Ferguson is faster but we both know that reported times for recruits are notoriously inaccurate unless laser timed. By the eyeball, Dobbs is faster.

Just based on the very little we know, I think Dobbs has the better upside... but hard work often covers those kinds of gaps and more.

 

[GrowVol]

Prolly already been said..hopefully, but regardless of 1st/2nd defense....its always vanilla on a spring game. Why get injured?
Was listening to EA show this mourning(1st mistake)......it finally dawned on me... If someone does not like a player, then it doesn't matter how much they improve. And if the player they like doesn't do well....then there is a million excuses for him.
As irrelevant as we are, we need to just be excited about ANY of our QB's that show improvement. Go Vols....not Go One particular player. We need to start winning...Elmer Fud can be our QB or Coach or DE......so long as we start winning