Recruiting Forum Football Talk [RIP 9.3.2019]

[Smokey123]

Pruitt needs at least 3 recruiting classes before we can honestly and rationally expect to be competing for the East - much less the SEC and NCs.

2020 is the earliest I’ve seen anyone say we compete for the east. So I doubt anyone on this board disagrees

 

[Smokeytom]

I didn’t say you did. I didn’t make it the “whole thing” that’s just the only part I responded to, Because it was incorrect. The only part I ever responded to in your comment was mentioning Harbaugh and how he’s an example for keeping stability, dumb.

And no I can’t read, can you teach me?

Maybe it was a bad analogy, but the point of needing stability remains.

How about this. Look at how Texas A&m stuck with Sumlin for 5 years. Cupboards were stocked and ready for Jimbo to come in and have them top 25 year 1.

I think thats a better example that more accurate portrays my point, and maybe we can agree on that one...lol

 

[Smokeytom]

This staff will recruit big time SEC caliber players only. If you can't see why 5 years of that would do us good whether Pruitt proves to be the guy or not - yikes.

 

[HoleInTheRoof]

Is it not obvious by now how poor of talent we have here?

At the beginning of the year I was in the camp that thought we had plenty of untapped talent - nope. The unfortunate reality is we are rebuilding once again.

We have CUSA talent. Pruitt needs at least 3 recruiting classes before we can honestly and rationally expect to be competing for the East - much less the SEC and NCs.

Even then he may fail. I have not ruled that out. I'm just tired of riding the coaching carousel to no avail. We finally have a staff that has lived and breathed SEC football their whole lives and I am willing to let them ride it out for 5 years. I understand if others are not.

Great post. Like you, I was thinking we might be a 8-9 win team this year because I had hoped our staff would help everyone reach their full potential. Didn't realize most of these guys simply had no potential.

Need to give this staff at least 2-3 cycles before they can be accurately judged. And 2018 doesn't count, because honestly I think we took a lot of guys who we really shouldn't have (B. Davis, J. Warren, T. Antonuitteoreoish(?)

 

[Smokeytom]

2020 is the earliest I’ve seen anyone say we compete for the east. So I doubt anyone on this board disagrees

If you agree with this then I don't understand why its so unreasonable to let the man go another 2 years with more of his own players. It would do the program some good.

 

[Smokey123]

Maybe it was a bad analogy, but the point of needing stability remains.

How about this. Look at how Texas A&m stuck with Sumlin for 5 years. Cupboards were stocked and ready for Jimbo to come in and have them top 25 year 1.

I think thats a better example that more accurate portrays my point, and maybe we can agree on that one...lol

And that’s the point I was making, it wasn’t a good example for needing stability.

I mean, I agree with you for the most part about stability. Obviously you need it and it’s important, but I think by year 3/4 at a major program you can tell if he’s “the guy”

Idk if that’s the best example either, since they moved on from Sumlin it was clear he wasn’t gonna improve, but he did bring stability.
But the thing is, I’m not sure if there is any example for UT. You’re basically handed a top 15 class for the first two years of recruiting. At every other major school like that you’re fired if you’re not winning by year 4. What other major program in the last 25 years (not UK, WSU, ect) hired a coach that went around 6-6 for 3 years and they stuck with him and he turned out good or great. I can’t think of one. Spurrier at Scar is the closest thing but Scar wasn’t even a top 25 program

And Ta&m May very well finish at 7-5

 

[Smokey123]

This staff will recruit big time SEC caliber players only. If you can't see why 5 years of that would do us good whether Pruitt proves to be the guy or not - yikes.

If you already know he’s not “the guy” why waste 2 years? If he’s getting big time SEC players and going 6-6 in year 4 why the heck should he be here longer? We kept butch a year too long and you see how that turned out....

Also, if Pruitt is going 6-6 in year 4 those big time SEC recruits will stop coming QUICK

 

[Smokey123]

If you agree with this then I don't understand why its so unreasonable to let the man go another 2 years with more of his own players. It would do the program some good.

If he’s still struggling in year 4 even while recruiting top 10 classes, what good does keeping him here do?

 

[Smokeytom]

If you already know he’s not “the guy” why waste 2 years? If he’s getting big time SEC players and going 6-6 in year 4 why the heck should he be here longer? We kept butch a year too long and you see how that turned out....

Also, if Pruitt is going 6-6 in year 4 those big time SEC recruits will stop coming QUICK

If Butch had recruited SEC guys then we'd be looking like A&m right now probably.

This whole argument is getting too "If-y" for me. I don't think Pruitt's tenure will resemble Butch's in the slightest. I don't think Pruitt will have trouble bringing in guys unless we somehow miss a bowl game in year 3. But I also think that we are as untalented as we have ever been...so a full 4 years seems reasonable to me. Its tough to win in this league. Not winning the East in year 3 is okay especially with how FL and UGA are going to likely look. We have a long way to go talent wise. I do think by year 3 we will have a good idea of Pruitt, but if Pruitt decides that the Offense is the problem and wants to make a change going into year 4 - if year 4 doesn't show immediate improvement do we fire him? Coordinators often need more than 1 year. Somehow Saban continues to defy those odds with his OCs.

 

[Smokeytom]

Were getting into too many "what ifs" though and I'd rather not try and predict the future. For example, IF we don't do too hot in year 3 we'll be hoping one of the QBs on the bench are ready to step in and show out in year 4 - what if we have QB problems in year 4? Are we done with Pruitt? Ehhhhhh. We'd probably look like LSU or FL does right now.

With that said, as of watching this team throughout the year and today, I am a strong advocate of giving the man 5 years to get 4 full year-long-recruited classes of his own players before considering cutting ties with him. I hope he overachieves of course.

 

[SugarCC]

Is it not obvious by now how poor of talent we have here?

At the beginning of the year I was in the camp that thought we had plenty of untapped talent - nope. The unfortunate reality is we are rebuilding once again.

We have CUSA talent. Pruitt needs at least 3 recruiting classes before we can honestly and rationally expect to be competing for the East - much less the SEC and NCs.

Even then he may fail. I have not ruled that out. I'm just tired of riding the coaching carousel to no avail. We finally have a staff that has lived and breathed SEC football their whole lives and I am willing to let them ride it out for 5 years. I understand if others are not.

This.

 

[Smokey123]

If Butch had recruited SEC guys then we'd be looking like A&m right now probably.

This whole argument is getting too "If-y" for me. I don't think Pruitt's tenure will resemble Butch's in the slightest. I don't think Pruitt will have trouble bringing in guys unless we somehow miss a bowl game in year 3. But I also think that we are as untalented as we have ever been...so a full 4 years seems reasonable to me. Its tough to win in this league. Not winning the East in year 3 is okay especially with how FL and UGA are going to likely look. We have a long way to go talent wise. I do think by year 3 we will have a good idea of Pruitt, but if Pruitt decides that the Offense is the problem and wants to make a change going into year 4 - if year 4 doesn't show immediate improvement do we fire him? Coordinators often need more than 1 year. Somehow Saban continues to defy those odds with his OCs.

But he didn’t, he left the roster in very bad shape, just as Dooley did to him.

Agree, 4 years is fine, if you’re actually improving. But if you’re struggling in year 3 that’s an awful sign. Look at it this way. Let’s say 10 guys from the last class we signed he actually liked, then he gets 25 of his own guys this year. That’s 35 guys on our roster in 2019 that Pruitt recruited and wanted. We’ll add just 15 for 2020 because of transfers and what not. So that’s 50 of his own players in year 3, over half of which will be in his system for their 2nd or 3rd season. Chances are 99% of the starters will be guys he wanted and recruited. There’s zero excuses for having a roster stocked of your players and a top 5 staff (based on salary) and struggle in year 3. If the offense is a problem he still gets blame because he’s the HC, will he likely get another year? Yes. Should he? Idk, we gave Butch another and look what happened.


Regardless, I think next year we see major improvements and go around 7-5(maybe 8-4 depending on Trey Smith). Will he be “the guy”, idk. But I definitely think he’ll be a guy who recruits well and fields a great defense and can consistently get 7 to 9 wins but do we really want Will muschamp?

 

[Smokeytom]

But he didn’t, he left the roster in very bad shape, just as Dooley did to him.

Agree, 4 years is fine, if you’re actually improving. But if you’re struggling in year 3 that’s an awful sign. Look at it this way. Let’s say 10 guys from the last class we signed he actually liked, then he gets 25 of his own guys this year. That’s 35 guys on our roster in 2019 that Pruitt recruited and wanted. We’ll add just 15 for 2020 because of transfers and what not. So that’s 50 of his own players in year 3, over half of which will be in his system for their 2nd or 3rd season. Chances are 99% of the starters will be guys he wanted and recruited. There’s zero excuses for having a roster stocked of your players and a top 5 staff (based on salary) and struggle in year 3. If the offense is a problem he still gets blame because he’s the HC, will he likely get another year? Yes. Should he? Idk, we gave Butch another and look what happened.


Regardless, I think next year we see major improvements and go around 7-5(maybe 8-4 depending on Trey Smith). Will he be “the guy”, idk. But I definitely think he’ll be a guy who recruits well and fields a great defense and can consistently get 7 to 9 wins but do we really want Will muschamp?

His guys would only be JRs and I'd like to give a coach a full 85 with his SRs for a change. Especially this go around. When the coach we have will be recruiting the type of talent we need to compete in this league. This roster blows.

I'm going to advocate patience for all after seeing what I've seen this year. I don't think that position will change much throughout next year either. I don't know what I'll be thinking going into year 3, but I will definitely expect to compete for the East and I want the back end of our schedule to be the sweep that it used to be. If that doesn't happen, well, i don't want to even think of that possibility yet.

 

[Smokey123]

His guys would only be JRs and I'd like to give a coach a full 85 with his SRs for a change. Especially this go around. When the coach we have will be recruiting the type of talent we need to compete in this league. This roster blows.

I'm going to advocate patience for all after seeing what I've seen this year. I don't think that position will change much throughout next year either. I don't know what I'll be thinking going into year 3, but I will definitely expect to compete for the East and I want the back end of our schedule to be the sweep that it used to be. If that doesn't happen, well, i don't want to even think of that possibility yet.

Butch got 5 seasons and you see how that turned out. We kept him too long and we paid the price. It was clear before year 5 he wasn’t “the guy”, imagine if we gave him one more season.

We have 5 games next year that should all be most likely W’s. GSU, BYU, UAB, Chatt and Vandy. We competed with Scar (probably shoulda won) and UK loses ALOT and will return back to 6/7 wins. Pruitt should easily be able to manage getting 6 wins. If he doesn’t red flags will begin to raise, year 3 will be due or die because big time recruits will stop coming if there isn’t major improvement. What legitimate reason is there to give him 2-3 more years if he ends up going say 6-6 in year 3? Just so he can have Rs seniors that’s he recruited? That’s it? If he’s recruiting great but shows no signs of real improvements then hopefully he can be our Ron Zook and the next HC will be our Urban Meyer

 

[Smokeytom]

Butch got 5 seasons and you see how that turned out. We kept him too long and we paid the price. It was clear before year 5 he wasn’t “the guy”, imagine if we gave him one more season.

We have 5 games next year that should all be most likely W’s. GSU, BYU, UAB, Chatt and Vandy. We competed with Scar (probably shoulda won) and UK loses ALOT and will return back to 6/7 wins. Pruitt should easily be able to manage getting 6 wins. If he doesn’t red flags will begin to raise, year 3 will be due or die because big time recruits will stop coming if there isn’t major improvement. What legitimate reason is there to give him 2-3 more years if he ends up going say 6-6 in year 3? Just so he can have Rs seniors that’s he recruited? That’s it? If he’s recruiting great but shows no signs of real improvements then hopefully he can be our Ron Zook and the next HC will be our Urban Meyer

We can continue to entertain an endless number of potential possibilities, or we can just accept that all these things are TBD and the appropriate analysis will be required when the time comes...I think Pruitt has a ton of potential. I think he will have us playing elite defense and he seems willing to hand the offense over to a coach who knows more than him. I like those qualities in a HC.

So, let's hope we land some of these big fish that are hanging around the Tennessee River, and see where we go...

 

[JCP201]

The rest of college football can probably beat a really good team on a given day with some tweaking here and there (we need an offensive line) but it takes a miracle to beat Bama. (and not even that this year.) I'll be glad when Saban retires and we won't know who wins the National championship every year. When he does, just hope all the rules haven't made the sport into flag football.

 

[JCP201]

 

[vol2002]

Let’s say in 2020 Pruitt has brought in top 15ish classes but goes 7-5 because of some critical injuries and close losses. Do we turn on him and throw him in the Tennessee river?

Bring in a new coach (likely the 5th or 6th best guy per any of our lists) and it might be another 2-3 years for them because they have to establish culture, get in their guys, blah blah (I’m honestly getting bored of watching rebuilds). Then there’s no guarantees injuries and close losses won’t hold him back in year 3.

In that scenario why not just hang on to Pruitt? Probably a crap shoot on whether he or the new guy is best long term, and Pruitt will have his players and culture. In my view Pruitt might break through quicker.

Anyway i think a scenario like that is where we will be.

But I think it’s going to take this fanbase two or three more coaching hires to realize our white knight who wins all ballgames year one is never coming.

 

[nicksjuzunk]

Some people are too optimistic and imagine everything working out perfectly for a nice linear ruse to the top of the East. I said after WV we were looking at year 4 until we have the POTENTIAL to be what we hope to be.

This is generally how I see this going, and no one is going to like it

2018 5 wins
2019 6-7 wins
2020 7-9 wins
2021 depending on 1,900 things we cannot possibly foresee, regression, maintenance, or the next step

Of course everyone thinks their point of view is most realistic, and I guess this is mine

Butch had similar progression but in year 3, things began to deteriorate and collapsed in year 4. I suspect that we will know by year 4 whether the foundation of the program is strong or crumbling

 

[rekinhavoc]

I don't like the doom and gloom LWS brings. Pruitt is going to weed out the hangers on and Fitz is going to right the ship in S&C. I also believe if anyone on this staff is not up to snuff they will be encouraged to find other employment this offseason. Don't tell me a program can't get turned around. The players will adopt Pruitt's uncompromising attitude and be a team no one wants to play next season. This season is on Butch and think Pruitt and company are doing all they can. GBO!

 

[volinexile17]

I don't like the doom and gloom LWS brings. Pruitt is going to weed out the hangers on and Fitz is going to right the ship in S&C. I also believe if anyone on this staff is not up to snuff they will be encouraged to find other employment this offseason. Don't tell me a program can't get turned around. The players will adopt Pruitt's uncompromising attitude and be a team no one wants to play next season. This season is on Butch and think Pruitt and company are doing all they can. GBO!

What’d LWS say? I was like 50 pages behind.

 

[BigOrange15]

What’d LWS say? I was like 50 pages behind.

That this rebuild is going to take a while because of how far the program has fallen and we should give Pruitt time. Truly next level stuff.

 

[Outofmyvolcanmind]

Seriously, how many guys on our team could start for these teams?

I’m guessing 2-3, and one has clots in his lungs.

For Bama? None

For LSU? A few. QB, 2 of 3 WR positions. Kyle Phillips and perhaps Tuttle.

 

[Outofmyvolcanmind]

That’s a really stupid comment but in his defense... Florida is having a really good year all things considered and that was a really week crowd for a conference game.

It’s typical for that fair weather fan base.

 

[JCP201]

Let’s say in 2020 Pruitt has brought in top 15ish classes but goes 7-5 because of some critical injuries and close losses. Do we turn on him and throw him in the Tennessee river?

Bring in a new coach (likely the 5th or 6th best guy per any of our lists) and it might be another 2-3 years for them because they have to establish culture, get in their guys, blah blah (I’m honestly getting bored of watching rebuilds). Then there’s no guarantees injuries and close losses won’t hold him back in year 3.

In that scenario why not just hang on to Pruitt? Probably a crap shoot on whether he or the new guy is best long term, and Pruitt will have his players and culture. In my view Pruitt might break through quicker.

Anyway i think a scenario like that is where we will be.

But I think it’s going to take this fanbase two or three more coaching hires to realize our white knight who wins all ballgames year one is never coming.

I have always stood behind our coach (maybe not Kiffin because I was angry about Fulmer). I liked the fact that Dooley was from our neck of the woods, and he could win a press conference (not many games) The offense was always fun but defense was a nightmare. I thought in 2013-15 Butch was going to get it done, but I admit his personality often made me cringe and it made us a laughing stock. Behind the scenes was troubling during 2016 when Hurd quit and we started hearing the rumors.

It is early but it feels different with Pruitt. He has some of the best traits of our other coaches. His mentality is similar to Fulmer's-- load up with good Big Uglies and then the rest will fall into place. Pruitt doesn't want attention or make a spectacle of himself, but still a character in spite of that. Truthfully blunt and just wants to be a good football coach-- the media loves it. He has an incredible resume as a coordinator. Very good recruiter, plus recruits can see he gets complete respect even though we don't have the best record. Will go after great coaches to win.

I think he could be the guy-- I hope he is..