Recruiting Forum Football Talk VI

[Orange.]

These are pay walled. Anybody got access?

Look at this: Vols Fall Practice #2

 

[WesTnVol]

It doesn't work that way in a lot of instances anyway. Your work place can tell you what to do regardless of whether or not the state says you can do it.

30+ years in a union. Company rules/contract rules can not supersede state laws.
Example- reporting off for bad roads is not acceptable under “rules” state closes roads for bad weather employee can’t be disciplined.
I‘m not saying it’s this simple but we always negotiated with this in mine. Most arbitrators defaulted to this.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

So organizations control what people do outside of the organization? They control people getting other jobs on the side? Give me for instances.

I was against the NIL because I didn’t want college football to be all about money. Everyone knew they were getting paid, but we didn’t have to hear about it all the time. But I like how Tennessee is doing it. And, no, I don’t think any organization should tell people they can’t make money off their name or image. If the NCAA cared enough to stop the AL, GA and OSUs with their gaudy excesses of cheating, everyone might want them to control the lives of others also.

Bingo

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

The NCAA is extremely crooked, and exactly what everyone is upset about is that their favorites "should have to abide by the same rules everyone else abides by," but they never have and never will. Everyone sees through them. There is no moral obligation. All the "should" talk is moral obligation.



The whole Sabey/Kirby propaganda, noised abroad by the sychophant and click-hungry media, about needing regulation is just an attempt to restore that ancien regime. No thanks. Doing nothing at all is better than crooked enforcement. If the NCAA investigates Sabey and requires him to forfeit all games and titles since his first recruiting class, I'm up for a second look.

How Prof can not acknowledge this basic simple inarguable truth is beyond me...how can anyone support this corrupt organization remainingin charge of enforcement?

Burn them to the f'n ground.

 

[Devo182]

You can't have "rules" that break state law. Maybe it's the NCAA who should adjust their rules to not be in direct conflict with states. Being they're so benign and voluntary and all.

We went over this last month and this position is completely backwards.

Your state can say marijuana is legal. Doesn't mean your workplace, the NFL, your church, or the NCAA has to allow it within their boundaries.

Might as well have Tennessee lawmakers say "every game played within Tennessee borders will give the University of Tennessee a beginning lead of 50-0"... Might as well make voluntary associations completely meaningless.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

I disagree with your take. The current makeup is untenable where we live in the 'Wild West' with no rules or guidelines.. There does need to be a Governing body that establishes rules to address inequities. But yes, those rules must be followed by all (no special treatment). I'd like it to be a system where the Big Programs don't simply outspend the other 95% of schools (sure, some of this is already happening). I'd like it to be a system where craven State Law Makers trying to define new rules that favor their home institutions are sidelined. Mistrust any governing body? Sure, it's healthy to keep an eye on the regulator. But zero regulations is only asking for all kinds of abuse.

Zero regs is better than what AA has done in letting obvious rampant cheating by their cronies go.

I want a real governing body that has real fair rules that are actually enforced fairly on everyone...the AA is NOT it...they ARE the problem.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Letting UNC get away with cheating is a prime example of the NCAA playing favorites and why they can never again be trusted. They were handing out class credits to basketball players who didn't even attend zooms or do work. It was flagrant. Yet UNC is a cheat-with-impunity school in basketball, so the NCAA said, well if at least one one-basketball players was given fake credits too, then there is nothing we can do about known massive cheating at UNC basketball!

That is total BS. They could have hammered UNC.

And what you mention about academic credentialing is another case in point. Credentialing should have hammered UNC when UNC avoided the (wishing-to-be-avoided) NCAA -- by means of saying that since UNC has fake classes open to all students, it is not a basketball issue. They could tell the difference between a fake class and real class. It wasn't some bit about independent study. It involved free As with no work or even showing for class. The credentialing people shirked their responsibility. The academic accreditation bureaucrats wanted to dodge a hot potato and to suck up to UNC. The whole thing was disgusting, and a clear reason to end the NCAA. And I think academic creditialicng was shown to be a farce, into the bargain.

I think, for good measure, if heads didn't roll at academic accreditation (I mean whole firings and bans on the member schools they represent), then that is an equal problem. If UNC had been some little school that was ok or even fashionable to look down upon, the academics would have pounced. I would bet the people holding the fake classes are still at UNC. All UNC's academic talk is fake imo until they settle this mess satisfactorily. The academics at UNC basically announced to the world that UNC is just a "sports school" and their academics are as shoddy as their basketball team and the complicit NCAA wants them to be.

On the subject of basketball, you do realize the Kansas should have been on probation and forfeited their recent basketbal title, don't you? But they are a big money maker for the NCAA and the basketball tournament is the NCAA's biggest pork pie, so the NCAA just refused to apply their rules.

The NCAA is a criminal organization. They make their money off of the events that they rig by means of enforcement favorites, to best of their ability.

Burn them to the ground

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

No, the real issue is the NCAA is crooked.

And, no, your boi Sabey was leading the charge. Because we wants a new version of the ancien regime and a bunch of fake moralizing talk for the gullible to help him accomplish his con job.

And the greater issue you are dodging, if you want to think about it comprehensively, is that there is no possible body that could be trusted to enforce rules equitably. None. It's fairy land you're playing when you dream up new rules and orders. By a mental slight of hand, you proceed as if the rules applied themselves equitably all by themselves.

Bingo

 

[Devo182]

Zero regs is better than what AA has done in letting obvious rampant cheating by their cronies go.

I want a real governing body that has real fair rules that are actually enforced fairly on everyone...the AA is NOT it...they ARE the problem.

Then who is the answer? The government?

Because I sure as hell don't believe the universities will ever give up their current power. If your solution is to privatize the governing body, then the universities (aka the current NCAA...call it NCAA 2.0 if they re-brand) give up all power voluntarily lol. They would never. They've kept it this long, why would they?

Obviously I'm not for the universities/ncaa, but also realize it is literally their playing field. Unless someone is going to rip it away from them, I'm not sure what people are really wanting to happen here. I've never heard of a solution, just anger.

 

[Skullbone]

We went over this last month and this position is completely backwards.

Might as well have Tennessee lawmakers say "every game played within Tennessee borders will give the University of Tennessee a beginning lead of 50-0"...

Might as well make voluntary associations completely meaningless.

They could always do that. NIL didn't create that ability. I went over this just now and its completely straight.

 

[UTProf]

Then who is the answer? The government?

Because I sure as hell don't believe the universities will ever give up their current power. If your solution is to privatize the governing body, then the universities (aka the NCAA) give up all power voluntarily lol. They would never. They've kept it this long, why would they?

Why should they? Privatizing it wouldn't do a thing to help. In fact, it would probably make it worse because there'd be even fewer ways to get transparency.

The NCAA's spending their lobbying money in the wrong place tho. Instead of lobbying congress, they need to be spending money on simple explainers. Show the cases, the timelines, the different eras, the different bodies that decided those cases.

Also why do so many people think criminal activities - rape, assault, fraud, racing etc. fall under the NCAA? They don't. The only way they fall under the NCAA is if/when they pertain to certain things - events, recruiting, etc. For example, all the street racing in the world by UGA does not follow under the NCAA's purview. Street racing that happens during a recruiting event using vehicles procured for the purpose of recruitment *might.* Same with anything else. In order for the NCAA to have any authority at all, it has to be something to do with the NCAA. It can't just be team or university X being crappy or even engaging in illegal behavior.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Is that why they call them kids and make excuses for them? Because they did stupid things at that age?

I believe it has a lot to do with it

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Kirby bragged about it didn’t he?

Yes...he literally did

 

[Ten_Titans]

View attachment 567583

That's quite a few jobs in his long career. Did he quit because he's a quitter or because he found better opportunities? Who gets to say? He's obviously not wrong in every instance, but damn. You get 4-5 years to have the college career you want and that's it. I think we have a happy medium in terms of player freedom and competitive balance right now. Hanging the quitter label on the kids is just an eye roller for me. I've met plenty of quitters... Not a label I would apply to the guys we've gotten from the portal in particular.

 

[UTProf]

How Prof can not acknowledge this basic simple inarguable truth is beyond me...how can anyone support this corrupt organization remainingin charge of enforcement?

Burn them to the f'n ground.

What are you talking about? I'm not going to burn a straw man for the sake of burning one. I don't think anyone believes in a perfect regulatory body. That's laughable.

 

[knoxvol52]

View attachment 567594

That's quite a few jobs in his long career. Did he quit because he's a quitter or because he found better opportunities? Who gets to say? He's obviously not wrong in every instance, but damn. You get 4-5 years to have the college career you want and that's it. I think we have a happy medium in terms of player freedom and competitive balance right now. Hanging the quitter label on the kids is just an eye roller for me. I've met plenty of quitters... Not a label I would apply to the guys we've gotten from the portal in particular.

Well he got fired from 4 of those jobs !!!

 

[scienceteaching_vol]

I know it's preseason NFL, but football comes on tonight.

My six year old daughter just looked up and said, "Football? Is football on now?!" Best day of my life!"

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Then who is the answer? The government?

Because I sure as hell don't believe the universities will ever give up their current power. If your solution is to privatize the governing body, then the universities (aka the current NCAA...call it NCAA 2.0 if they re-brand) give up all power voluntarily lol. They would never. They've kept it this long, why would they?

Obviously I'm not for the universities/ncaa, but also realize it is literally their playing field. Unless someone is going to rip it away from them, I'm not sure what people are really wanting to happen here. I've never heard of a solution, just anger.

There has to be some rules governing competition..but the NCAA has proven to be nothing but garbage filth, so I want them burnt to the ground.

Create a new body that will force everyone to abide by the rules, and not let a chosen few cheat with impunity.

Burn the AA to the ground and start over and do it right.

 

[tnhunter 10]

My six year old daughter just looked up and said, "Football? Is football on now?!" Best day of my life!"View attachment 567601

John Kelly with the first catch.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

What are you talking about? I'm not going to burn a straw man for the sake of burning one. I don't think anyone believes in a perfect regulatory body. That's laughable.

There you go with your stupid straw man ...I was plain...the AA has to go, and something fair has to replace it.

The AA is pond scum

 

[Orange.]

I think that's a change that can benefit us because we run plays faster while hurting those who are slower. If left in place it will probably speed up the game but the real change they need is fewer commercials. Overall though, I don't like that change at all. Didn't they do it once before? I like the chess match of time. It adds to the excitement of the game.

Right, and they did not reduce the commercials. So they increased the percentage of game time interrupted by commercials. And this they claimed to do because the fans wanted it. Situation normal, all f-cked up. Saban thinks it's going to help him as he transitions to ball control, copying Kirby. But Heup will master it.

 

[knoxvol52]

DeShau Watson on sideline thinking where is nearest massage parlor!!!!

 

[GoBigOrange86]

It makes me sad that all of my favorite Vol football calls of the last 20 years are from network commentators and not the actual guy on the Vol radio network.

 

[tnhunter 10]

Tillman with a catch

 

[GoVolsGo54]

CED!