Recruiting Forum Football Talk XLI

[Smokey123]

You're corect. They weren't similar situations. There was a much stronger case to keep Mac around than Butch.

Mac didn't do what he was brought into do.... Butch showed signs of improvement and actually improved the team. Mac's offense was worse than Champs

 

[HankHill]

That is a huuuge assumption. We don't need just players, we need stars to really compete. Dino could probably do ok on the Offensive side selling his success to WRs and QBs, but what about RBs and OL? What about on the defensive side? Like I said, he would have to go big on D assistant staff to really hold his own.

Everyone always talks about how a school needs a “sec guy” or someone with ties here and there but Franklin, Meyer, Mullen, Les. They all went against that and recruited great.

 

[Smokey123]

UF's AD said themselves it went way deeper than W/L's. Foley started regretting the hire after year 1. Florida did not like him, he didn't like Florida

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

You don't always have to recruit elite to win championships, or even compete for them

I will agree with that to a degree, but we have to compete with rosters stuffed full of elite players to accomplish anything of real value. I don't want a caretaker, I want a giantkiller.

 

[Smokey123]

I will agree with that to a degree, but we have to compete with rosters stuffed full of elite players to accomplish anything of real value. I don't want a caretaker, I want a giantkiller.

Agree

 

[Jimmy Football]

Mac didn't do what he was brought into do.... Butch showed signs of improvement and actually improved the team. Mac's offense was worse than Champs

My problem is that around mid-season, it became apparent that both Butch and Mac weren't going to be retained. Florida made their move and got on with things. We didn't (and still haven't).

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Everyone always talks about how a school needs a “sec guy” or someone with ties here and there but Franklin, Meyer, Mullen, Les. They all went against that and recruited great.

I don't buy that SEC guy stuff either, but you still have to be an ace recruiter. Mullen ain't beating no big boys.
Edit; I should say great recruiter, in the sense of getting the right players at the right positions, and then developing them, and using them appropriately.

 

[Smokey123]

My problem is that around mid-season, it became apparent that both Butch and Mac weren't going to be retained. Florida made their move and got on with things. We didn't (and still haven't).

And that's fine, both AD's have a different way of going about things. As shown before Currie keeps everything close, who knows what his plans are. Firing a coach mid season doesn't make you more invested in championships than a team who waits though. And to compare the two situations is wrong

 

[HankHill]

I don't buy that SEC guy stuff either, but you still have to be an ace recruiter. Mullen ain't beating no big boys.

Being at a program like TN and using all we have to offer is more important than any sales pitch someone has came up with at a prior stop.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Being at a program like TN and using all we have to offer is more important than any sales pitch someone has came up with at a prior stop.

Let's hope, thanks for talking me off the ledge. I just have this bad feeling that this hire is a crossroads, the most important one ever for the future of the UT program. Get it wrong and we are screwed for good, and I have no faith in Currie or his masters at all.

 

[Jimmy Football]

And that's fine, both AD's have a different way of going about things. As shown before Currie keeps everything close, who knows what his plans are. Firing a coach mid season doesn't make you more invested in championships than a team who waits though. And to compare the two situations is wrong

I'm not sure what you mean by "wrong." Immoral?

Our situation and Florida's are about as analagous as you're going to get. Same conference, same division, roughly the same caliber of program, similar records this season, similar issues leading to lack of success. How identical of a situation do I need before I can make a fair comparison?

 

[JacketVol]

The master plan is stadium renovations. If we build it, apparently everybody will come. #RenovateNeyland

We have been coming despite crappy football. Build a great venue and win 5-8 games per year, I will watch from home and go to Tech games. A lot cheaper.

 

[LA Vol]

I’m going to try not to poison this place with my negative forecasting. Posting a bit less moving forward.

:hi:

I always enjoy your posts, but I see your point. Think I'm going to follow your lead. Go Vols.

 

[butchna]

He and big Jim squared off a spot in the middle of the room to settle this thing once and for all. Rumor is Charles connected on a right hook and Jim went down.

Big Jim is 86 and Ergen is 64. I know this is in good humor but the visual.

And the comeback.

 

[Smokey123]

I'm not sure what you mean by "wrong." Immoral?

Our situation and Florida's are about as analagous as you're going to get. Same conference, same division, roughly the same caliber of program, similar records this season, similar issues leading to lack of success. How identical of a situation do I need before I can make a fair comparison?

Wrong as in they aren't the same.

Mac was fired because of frustration because he was hired to improve a specific thing (offense) and their offense regressed from extremely bad to historically bad. Not due to wins and losses, not due to lack of championships. They were unhappy with him for more than just this year, Foley quickly regretting hiring him. That wasn't the case with Butch and Tennessee, he improved a lot of things and until that loss to Bama last year looked like things were going to continue to improve.

And again, Firing a coach mid season doesn't make you more committed. Was Michigan not committed when they waited until after the season to fire hoke?

 

[JacketVol]

There’s other exhibition matches and different events that are played. There’s nothing wrong with making Neyland nicer. It’s a dump on the inside lol. Just because gate 21 has bricks on the outside doesn’t make the stadium nice.

I like peeing in the trough. Reminds me of when men were men and the Vols kicked tail instead of having to take it in the tail from the AD. I DONT MIND PAYING JUST WIN SOME FREAKING GAMES YOU DUMB RENOVATING LOSERS.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

I like peeing in the trough. Reminds me of when men were men and the Vols kicked tail instead of having to take it in the tail from the AD. I DONT MIND PAYING JUST WIN SOME FREAKING GAMES YOU DUMB RENOVATING LOSERS.

I'm with ya Jacket.

 

[Jimmy Football]

Wrong as in they aren't the same.

Mac was fired because of frustration because he was hired to improve a specific thing (offense) and their offense regressed from extremely bad to historically bad. Not due to wins and losses, not due to lack of championships. They were unhappy with him for more than just this year, Foley quickly regretting hiring him. That wasn't the case with Butch and Tennessee, he improved a lot of things and until that loss to Bama last year looked like things were going to continue to improve.

And again, Firing a coach mid season doesn't make you more committed. Was Michigan not committed when they waited until after the season to fire hoke?

I agree that they're not identical situations, but if Florida's coaching transition can't be used as a benchmark to evaluate ours, then none can. You mentioned Hoke, but that coaching transition was also different than ours in some significant ways. If I can't use Florida for comparison, why can you use Hoke?

I didn't mean to start an argument, btw. We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. I think Currie has several higher professional priorities than winning football at Tennessee, and I think he's doing an awful job stabilizing our program through a difficult time. I hope beyond hope that I'm proven wrong on him. Time will tell.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

On a side note, what is up with all these hipster cool guy douchebags using the word "optics" as the next big cliche all of a sudden? Where in the heck did that come from? It is already getting on my nerves 🤔

 

[JacketVol]

The War Room said Brooks is the RT this weekend and he hasn’t played a game since he was a sophomore TE in HS. Lol

And his OL coach sucks and plays concussed kids. Screw Wells. He's an idiot.

 

[nicksjuzunk]

I always enjoy your posts, but I see your point. Think I'm going to follow your lead. Go Vols.

I’ve made my point, now I’m just whining.

Time to wait and see

 

[JacketVol]

I always enjoy your posts, but I see your point. Think I'm going to follow your lead. Go Vols.

You and nick need to keep posting. Don't worry about the butt bangers.

 

[ChattaTNVol]

I didn't say that Currie said the goal was no longer winning championships; I just said that it seemed like he had softened his stance. He took an aggressive stance back in the summer, saying that UT football wasn't winning enough and we expect to always win championships at UT. Today, he said that we need to look at it a game at a time and think about championships at the end of the season. He also talked about winning championships in the future like we have in the past. His take felt different to me, so I posted it.

No need to spin it to be something darker or more dire than what it was.

I still think there's some loose lips sinks ships going on right now. I don't think Currie wants to do or say anything that will tip his hand. In the presentation to the athletic committee almost every slide had a graphic reminding the committee members that we suck at just about everything and we've been going downhill for a couple of decades. I have no idea how all of this is going to turn out but I've done presentations like that before and this one had a clear repetitive message. We suck!

So if he is trying to hammer this message home, I've got to at least suspect he wants everybody to own the status quo and start demanding some change. jmo.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

I’ve made my point, now I’m just whining.

Time to wait and see

Man I wish the Lord would help me get tempered more like you, you're a great guy and an inspiration. By his grace I have laid so much of my old self down, but my worst fault is still my temper. It's not as bad as it once was, but I haven't been able to totally overcome it either.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

I still think there's some loose lips sinks ships going on right now. I don't think Currie wants to do or say anything that will tip his hand. In the presentation to the athletic committee almost every slide had a graphic reminding the committee members that we suck at just about everything and we've been going downhill for a couple of decades. I have no idea how all of this is going to turn out but I've done presentations like that before and this one had a clear repetitive message. We suck!

So if he is trying to hammer this message home, I've got to at least suspect he wants everybody to own the status quo and start demanding some change. jmo.

Were you there?