Recruiting Forum Football Talk XXIX

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#8,028
#8,028
Darth_Shiveman said:
The point you're missing here is that Debord doesn't really have a history of being hands on with QBs. Other than OC jobs, he's been an OL/TE coach, not a QB guy.

We need a new OC AND we need him to be a guy with a background of being hands on with QBs. That's all anybody is saying. I don't see why you have to convolute it so much.
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I can buy that for sure although I thought Debord had coached QBs before.


To say we need a QB coach means restructuring the way the staff is made up. I disagree with that because many other successful teams with great QBs have the same structure Tenn has now.


To say we need a new OC that coaches QBs better is fair to say for sure.
 
#8,029
#8,029
Here's LWS's thoughts on the QB. Maybe we don't need a qb coach, we just need a better passer at QB.

LWSVOL said:
Our QB has improved very little over the 4 years with his passing mechanics or I should say passing results. He doesn't do horrible but misses a lot of easy throws and even many that are caught credit the WR.

IMO, Josh is about as good as he could get and no one would solve that. My reasoning is:

There have been at least 4 staff members work with him (Bajakian, Sheridan, DeBord and Jones)

He has been to California and worked with guru Whitfield

He has been to the Manning camp

Peyton has spent time with him every summer since he has been a Vol.

That is a lot of work with people that have worked with QBs. Not a lot of improvement though. I think he is just what he is.
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People always want to fire somebody but sometimes you just need better players. Dobbs has been the best available qb since he's been in campus but that doesn't mean he is great. He's a 3 year starting qb in the SEC that has zero shot at getting drafted.
 
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#8,030
#8,030
BigZiti09 said:
Here's LWS's thoughts on the QB. Maybe we don't need a qb coach, we just need a better passer at QB.



People always want to fire somebody but sometimes you just need better players. Dobbs has been the best available qb since he's been in campus but that doesn't mean he is great. He's a 3 year starting qb in the SEC that has zero shot at getting drafted.
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This is what I've been saying for a couple of weeks. Sometimes the player isn't as good as we want/expect them to be.
 
#8,032
#8,032
BigZiti09 said:
Here's LWS's thoughts on the QB. Maybe we don't need a qb coach, we just need a better passer at QB.



People always want to fire somebody but sometimes you just need better players. Dobbs has been the best available qb since he's been in campus but that doesn't mean he is great. He's a 3 year starting qb in the SEC that has zero shot at getting drafted.
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Makes it even more frustrating that we try to make him sit in a pocket to throw the ball. Let him freelance at QB...1st read, maybe 2nd read, and if neither are there, take off and make something happen. Why can't coaches making millions or hundreds of thousands of $$$$ not see this is how Dobbs plays his best football. I just don't get it.
 
#8,033
#8,033
Gameday telling everyone what we are already thinking-- We are better off without Hurd, we struggled and didn't look prepared for any game even before the injuries, there is clearly a chemistry issue, they questioned whether the staff was getting enough out of the players, and Butch is gonna have to make some major changes at the end of the season.
 
#8,034
#8,034
jave36 said:
List our starters side by side with theirs, ours are better overall.
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If this year just like lasts doesn't show you that the top 22 of each team doesn't matter over a long season then nothing will. ROSTER DEPTH has to go way deeper than first game starters.
 
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#8,035
#8,035
OGbabyaviVol said:
Makes it even more frustrating that we try to make him sit in a pocket to throw the ball. Let him freelance at QB...1st read, maybe 2nd read, and if neither are there, take off and make something happen. Why can't coaches making millions or hundreds of thousands of $$$$ not see this is how Dobbs plays his best football. I just don't get it.
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Best game plan of the year was FL. We moved the pocket and got him outside early. This actually started opening up the pocket passing game. D had to worry about running QB, zone read, moving pocket with potential to run, and WR lined up in backfield. I knew the first series of Bama we were doomed because we had him standing like a statue in the pocket. Moving the pocket also masks some of the OLine deficiency.

Jones speaks of coaching to QB strengths yet we have been trying to make Josh something he is not for 2 years.
 
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#8,036
#8,036
volinbama256 said:
Gameday telling everyone what we are already thinking-- We are better off without Hurd, we struggled and didn't look prepared for any game even before the injuries, there is clearly a chemistry issue, they questioned whether the staff was getting enough out of the players, and Butch is gonna have to make some major changes at the end of the season.
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At least the narrative is somewhat favorable. This could have gone super negative on us.
 
#8,037
#8,037
BruinVol said:
Lol.

So the issues isn't needing a QB coach it's needing a new OC.

Not sure why we keep talking about a QB coach.
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I think it's obvious we need a change at the top of the offense and at OL. I also think both changes are imminent no matter how we finish. So everyone needs to just relax on lashing out on firing coaches and know those changes will come.

The key will be who CBJ hires and if he allows them more leeway to run the O how they want.

But IMO we habe more of an execution and lack of high level talent at QB and OL problem along with average play calling and not as much a system problem.
 
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#8,038
#8,038
volinbama256 said:
Gameday telling everyone what we are already thinking-- We are better off without Hurd, we struggled and didn't look prepared for any game even before the injuries, there is clearly a chemistry issue, they questioned whether the staff was getting enough out of the players, and Butch is gonna have to make some major changes at the end of the season.
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No one ever mentions that romp in Neyland over the Gators or VT. They only reference UGA and App St miracles. Irks me.
 
#8,039
#8,039
nashvol1 said:
Jones speaks of coaching to QB strengths yet we have been trying to make Josh something he is not for 2 years.
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And when he had Worley He absolutely did not play to his strengths...

So what's Larry's excuse for why Worley was so bad too?

O I know, the O Line...

And with that O line and a statuesque QB, we still sent 4/5 receivers out on every psss play. BRILLIANT
 
#8,040
#8,040
I4Jay said:
And when he had Worley He absolutely did not play to his strengths...

So what's Larry's excuse for why Worley was so bad too?

O I know, the O Line...

And with that O line and a statuesque QB, we still sent 4/5 receivers out on every psss play. BRILLIANT
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Maybe we should coach to the Oline's ability? Should have been at least one TE chipping and an RB or 2 for support.
 
#8,041
#8,041
I4Jay said:
And when he had Worley He absolutely did not play to his strengths...

So what's Larry's excuse for why Worley was so bad too?

O I know, the O Line...

And with that O line and a statuesque QB, we still sent 4/5 receivers out on every psss play. BRILLIANT
Click to expand...

Why wasn't Worley any good?

Genetics?
 
#8,042
#8,042
I4Jay said:
And when he had Worley He absolutely did not play to his strengths...

So what's Larry's excuse for why Worley was so bad too?

O I know, the O Line...

And with that O line and a statuesque QB, we still sent 4/5 receivers out on every psss play. BRILLIANT
Click to expand...

I thought JW was dang good just before he got hurt. That offense was starting to find themselves.
 
#8,043
#8,043
I4Jay said:
And when he had Worley He absolutely did not play to his strengths...

So what's Larry's excuse for why Worley was so bad too?

O I know, the O Line...

And with that O line and a statuesque QB, we still sent 4/5 receivers out on every psss play. BRILLIANT
Click to expand...

They blame players and not these dumbazz schemes. Dummies have an elite running QB but won't run him. Ran a read option LOOK with Worley like it would fool a defense. John Kelly averaging 6.7 yards a carry but you go 5 wide. All around D-U-M-B....
 
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#8,044
#8,044
looks like the hogs are going with some sort of gray alt helmets. maybe gators have smokey gray flashbacks. whatever it takes, hope it works.
 
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#8,045
#8,045
The Breakerboy said:
They blame players and not these dumbazz schemes. Dummies have an elite running QB but won't run him. Ran a read option LOOK with Worley like it would fool a defense. John Kelly averaging 6.7 yards a carry but you go 5 wide. All around D-U-M-B....
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I'm not disagreeing with that.
 
#8,047
#8,047
BruinVol said:
I can buy that for sure although I thought Debord had coached QBs before.


To say we need a QB coach means restructuring the way the staff is made up. I disagree with that because many other successful teams with great QBs have the same structure Tenn has now.


To say we need a new OC that coaches QBs better is fair to say for sure.
Click to expand...

Before coming to UT, Debord's only experience as a QB coach was the 1985-1986 season as an OC/WR/QB coach....at Fort Hayes State (a DII school). Other than that and his years as an OC or HC, he's only ever coached OL, TEs, or STs.

Getting rid of Bajakian (who probably wasn't a better OC, but was decent with QBs) and hiring a guy who had such little experience coaching up QBs was setting up Dobbs for failure.
 
#8,049
#8,049
BigZiti09 said:
Here's LWS's thoughts on the QB. Maybe we don't need a qb coach, we just need a better passer at QB.



People always want to fire somebody but sometimes you just need better players. Dobbs has been the best available qb since he's been in campus but that doesn't mean he is great. He's a 3 year starting qb in the SEC that has zero shot at getting drafted.
Click to expand...

Until UT has a real QB coach it's completely impossible to Blame Dobbs, he has talent but it's obvious watching him that he hasn't been coached properly. I wonder what David Cutcliff would do with Dobbs. I suspect after 4 years of his coaching Dobbs would be much more proficient passer than he is now.
 
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