Recruiting Forum Football Talk XXXIV

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#9,753
#9,753
jave36 said:
Ya I suck at terminology. The read option is what I should have been saying. Darth correctly pointed out that I was incorrectly using them interchangeably. All of our running plays are from shotgun, and the qb reads the D or acts like he's reading the D to decide if he'll keep it or not. If we continue to do that with a qb who isn't a threat to keep it, our offense will struggle.
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That's ok. I would have confused it, too, until I did some reading on it. The only thing that I will caution you about is that they can look similar in play and formation. But, I believe the blocking scheme actually determines if it is a QB read option or not. It may look like a read option but may just be a straight zone run with an automatic handoff. People with football experience can tell, and I think I understand the difference in blocking now.

We run the zone run scheme out of the shotgun, but NFL teams run it, too. The Colts' stretch play was zone blocking. We also started running the pin and pull when Debord got here. That is a variation of the outside zone run, where a couple of OL pull outside and leave the weakside DE in a position where he really can't make a play.
 
#9,755
#9,755
VolGee4 said:
That's ok. I would have confused it, too, until I did some reading on it. The only thing that I will caution you about is that they can look similar in play and formation. But, I believe the blocking scheme actually determines if it is a QB read option or not. It may look like a read option but may just be a straight zone run with an automatic handoff. People with football experience can tell, and I think I understand the difference in blocking now.

We run the zone run scheme out of the shotgun, but NFL teams run it, too. The Colts' stretch play was zone blocking. We also started running the pin and pull when Debord got here. That is a variation of the outside zone run, where a couple of OL pull outside and leave the weakside DE in a position where he really can't make a play.
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It's the immobility of our running backs that bothers me, not the blocking schemes. I've seen a lot of teams do the shotgun handoff where the idea is to make the defense wonder who has the ball (99% of our running plays), and their offenses are never very effective unless the defense believes the qb will keep it and be fast enough to actually hurt them. Worley and Dobbs were similar passers, but the threat of Dobbs torching the defense by keeping the handoff made our offense so much more effective. Having Peyton manning in the offense we've run since Butch got here wouldn't be effective enough to get us to Atlanta. That's the point I was trying to make.
 
#9,760
#9,760
jave36 said:
It's the immobility of our running backs that bothers me, not the blocking schemes. I've seen a lot of teams do the shotgun handoff where the idea is to make the defense wonder who has the ball (99% of our running plays), and their offenses are never very effective unless the defense believes the qb will keep it and be fast enough to actually hurt them. Worley and Dobbs were similar passers, but the threat of Dobbs torching the defense by keeping the handoff made our offense so much more effective. Having Peyton manning in the offense we've run since Butch got here wouldn't be effective enough to get us to Atlanta. That's the point I was trying to make.
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Yea, and you aren't getting my point. 99% of our running plays are not read option plays. There is a distinction between a read option and an inside zone run. They just look similar. Some are straight handoffs to a RB. The blocking scheme is important because you can tell if it is a read option or not based on the blocking. If an inside zone run is blocked correctly, the QB has no bearing on the play. That's the point I am trying to make.
 
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#9,771
#9,771
VolGee4 said:
Yea, and you aren't getting my point. 99% of our running plays are not read option plays. There is a distinction between a read option and an inside zone run. They just look similar. Some are straight handoffs to a RB. The blocking scheme is important because you can tell if it is a read option or not based on the blocking. If an inside zone run is blocked correctly, the QB has no bearing on the play. That's the point I am trying to make.
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Even on the straight handoffs to RB, the hope is that the defense doesn't know its a designed handoff. That's why you almost always see the qb with both hands on the ball during the handoff instead of the traditional one handed handoff. The hope is that the defense is worried about the qb pulling the ball and keeping it.

Since the running back doesn't get a running start on the handoff, the OL has to hold those blocks longer, which lowers the success rate of the play. Even if it's blocked properly. Unless there is some degree of fear that the QB will keep it.
 
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#9,773
#9,773
jave36 said:
Even on the straight handoffs to RB, the hope is that the defense doesn't know its a designed handoff. That's why you almost always see the qb with both hands on the ball during the handoff instead of the traditional one handed handoff. The hope is that the defense is worried about the qb pulling the ball and keeping it.

Since the running back doesn't get a running start on the handoff, the OL has to hold those blocks longer, which lowers the success rate of the play. Even if it's blocked properly.
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I don't think I agree, but you can believe it or not. The bottom line is there are straight running plays where the QB doesn't read anything. If you read about the zone blocking scheme, a couple of the OL initially doubles the DL. Upon neutralizing the DL, one then gets to the next level to block the LB. That's the whole point of the zone blocking scheme. The OL actually needs an extra second to get to the next level.

Ask and expert, but I am pretty sure that is correct. You are caught up on all of our plays being read options, and they are not. Just google it and you will find a breakdown of the zone runs and schemes.
 
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