Recruiting Forum Off-Topic Thread II

[Ulysees E. McGill]

That's a fair point

I understand your point about presenting the Gospel, but the Lord did tell us "Cast not your pearls before swine"..and he wasn't talking about pigs, and Paul said "To be carnally minded is enmity against God"...I don't argue faith with people anymore. If somebody's heart is convicted, the spirit will draw them to seek the truth.."I am the way, the truth and the life. No man cometh unto the Father, but by me. And no man cometh unto me, except the Father who hath sent me draw him".

 

[bignewt]

Kinda the "God has a plan for each of us" philosophy. If you are meant to follow Jesus and his teachings then you will. That opens up the whole "free will" philosophical debate.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

I understand your point about presenting the Gospel, but the Lord did tell us "Cast not your pearls before swine"..and he wasn't talking about pigs, and Paul said "To be carnally minded is enmity against God"...I don't argue faith with people anymore. If somebody's heart is convicted, the spirit will draw them to seek the truth.."I am the way, the truth and the life. No man cometh unto the Father, but by me. And no man cometh unto me, except the Father who hath sent me draw him".

I was never intending to argue, simply to correct some very false statements said on this board, more so for the other readers. I'm not going to get in useless debates, but anytime I have the opportunity to present the gospel clearly to who knows how many readers are on here, in going to take it, especially because I believe John 6:44 that you just quoted.

I have stopped debating the historical revisionism on this board, but would be glad to try and answer any serious questions some may have. My only desire today is that everyone truly understand the state we are all in. One life, then eternity.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

So how does the Jewish faith reconcile that with Jesus as they don't really believe in him?

They are still waiting on their Messiah. I would personally love to speak with someone in the Jewish faith about this subject and have them explain to me their understanding of Isaiah 53 and many other Messianic passages so clearly fulfilled in Jesus. Sad really, but Romans 10-11 and Revelation teaches that eventually there will be a massive movement of Israel to faith in Christ

 

[bignewt]

It better or according to the New Testament all Jews will go to hell(as all have I would guess according to the bible even the millions killed in the Holocaust), even thought they are the chosen people.

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

That is a fair point. At some point, Matthew 7:6 comes into play though.

His motive in having this discussion with you is to belittle Christianity. Not the first time I've seen this convo.

I've debated the merits of Chriatianity on here plenty. I've only ever once mocked someone for their beliefs on here, and that was when Tony claimed that God told him to vote for Hillary (because, come on man, seriously?).

Other than that the closest I've probably come was back during the election with some of the Cthulhu stuff, but that was all more about taking the piss out of the whole "moral decay" line of argument that has existed and been used in every great nation/country/state at one point or another regardless of religion. It kind of evolved into me claiming to worship Cthulhu for the lulz once I realized a bunch of people on here had never heard of that and were halfway inclined to buy it.

The former, yeah I ragged Tony pretty hard for that. The latter, well people took the wrong way because religious folk are largely inclined to take anything questioning religion the wrong way.


Anyway I just wanted to say that (other than when Tony said God told him to vote Hillary), I've never mocked someone for their religion or insulted the religion itself. I enjoy debating the merits of it, but I'm not about belittling someone for their beliefs.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

It better or according to the New Testament all Jews will go to hell(as all have I would guess according to the bible even the millions killed in the Holocaust), even thought they are the chosen people.

That's what Paul explains in Romans 9.

 

[bignewt]

That's what Paul explains in Romans 9.

So by that passage they are hosed.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

So by that passage they are hosed.

Not at all. Think you missed the point of that passage, which leads into chapter 10, of God's purpose of election. God always preserves a remnant. That's a whole nother can of worms, but again, in the end as 10-11 teaches, there will be a massive movement of Israel to Christ. He Old Testament prophesied this in Zechariah 12:10 and that's just one example.

 

[Glitch]

So by that passage they are hosed.

The problem comes in because the Jewish people have repeatedly rebelled against God thinking that they can obtain salvation through their own will and not God's. God gave them the Law and the Prophets to tell them exactly what was coming. However, if you feel that your good works can redeem your sins then you are missing the boat. Sin is above our ability to redeem. That is why God came in the form of Jesus and died on the cross. God wanted to redeem the people of the earth and the only way to redeem sin was to pay for it Himself. Those who live by faith in Jesus will do good works but doing good works alone will not redeem a person, no matter what your genealogy.

 

[bignewt]

Not at all. Think you missed the point of that passage, which leads into chapter 10, of God's purpose of election. God always preserves a remnant. That's a whole nother can of worms, but again, in the end as 10-11 teaches, there will be a massive movement of Israel to Christ. He Old Testament prophesied this in Zechariah 12:10 and that's just one example.

No they are hosed. That massive movement of Israel to Christ only helps those who are there to make it.

 

[bignewt]

The problem comes in because the Jewish people have repeatedly rebelled against God thinking that they can obtain salvation through their own will and not God's. God gave them the Law and the Prophets to tell them exactly what was coming. However, if you feel that your good works can redeem your sins then you are missing the boat. Sin is above our ability to redeem. That is why God came in the form of Jesus and died on the cross. God wanted to redeem the people of the earth and the only way to redeem sin was to pay for it Himself. Those who live by faith in Jesus will do good works but doing good works alone will not redeem a person, no matter what your genealogy.

basically there is only one way to be redeemed, either get with it or tough tacos.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

basically there is only one way to be redeemed, either get with it or tough tacos.

Aside from the funny language, you are right. There is one way, and it is Christ alone.

 

[bignewt]

I have a lot of philosophical issues with that but I respect those who believe in it wholeheartedly as it gives peace and that is a very good thing.

 

[Glitch]

No they are hosed. That massive movement of Israel to Christ only helps those who are there to make it.

Considering that the prophets spoke of the coming of Jesus for centuries, Jesus fulfilled every single Messianic prophesy, and every single Jewish person has had the ability to believe or not believe in Jesus since his resurrection, I would say there has been reasonable opportunity afforded. I don't know what God has planned and couldn't comprehend it anyway. Our lives are just a blip on the screen. God's plan is greater and more complex than our brains could ever imagine.

 

[Glitch]

I have a lot of philosophical issues with that but I respect those who believe in it wholeheartedly as it gives peace and that is a very good thing.

There are probably very few answers that you can find to those answers. See my last post.

 

[bignewt]

There are probably very few answers that you can find to those answers. See my last post.

Hence my agnosticism I cannot fathom as a mortal man what a higher power's plan is or how I fit into it. I just try to do my best, be happy and love those close to me.

 

[Rishvol]

It's going to be hard to unbrainwash my kids of segregation is a good thing

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

I have a lot of philosophical issues with that but I respect those who believe in it wholeheartedly as it gives peace and that is a very good thing.

I understand that. The problem is with the way the Bible presents God and man. God is holy and just. He has given us the law. We have broken that law. We are sinners. Therefore, something has to be done about that sin because a holy God cannot overlook it. Christ has died to take away sin and lived to give us righteousness. He is the only one who has done what is necessary. That's why He is the only way. If you believe that we can be good and go to heaven, problem is, we still have sin, God cannot overlook that sin and still be holy. We cannot be good and eliminate our sin or earn favor with a holy God. Our salvation is dependent upon the perfect righteousness of Christ and His atonement on the cross, and His resurrection. If there is another way, His life and death were unnecessary. In fact, if there is another way, we eliminate Jesus altogether, for Christ claimed that He is the only way in John 14:6. If he's not, then He is a liar, and therefore is just a sinner like us, and His death would have meant nothing anyway. So either Christ is the only way, or He isn't even a way.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

Hence my agnosticism I cannot fathom as a mortal man what a higher power's plan is or how I fit into it. I just try to do my best, be happy and love those close to me.

We are dependent on Him to reveal it, aren't we? And obviously we believe that He has in the Bible. Not with blind faith, but with faith and reason. It is all dependent upon Christ.

 

[drvenner]

On the different denominations topic.... someone once explained it best to me like this...

He said something like... "In the end, what matters is what you believe about Jesus. Jesus is like the edge of a knife. You can't straddle it. You have to pick a side. Either you believe He is who He says He is (and what He has done for us) or you believe He was not."

It really is not that simple. That determines whether you are a Christian or not. It does not determine if you get into heaven, IMO.

 

[Tennessee Golfer]

It really is not that simple. That determines whether you are a Christian or not. It does not determine if you get into heaven, IMO.

Except the Bible says it really is that simple.

"No man comes to the Father except through me."
-red font

 

[InVOLuntary]

I was raised Southern Baptist. I switched because my wife and I thought one denomination would be easier for raising children...

I am now Catholic. I will no longer go to hell for drinking alcoholic beverages or for dancing. I will definitely go to purgatory, but there is an option for Heaven afterwards. :hi:

There is a verse in Romans that states that you should let your brother worship in his own manner.

This post isn't exactly aimed at you Bass, but more at those that think one denomination is better than another. Each and every one has its good and bad points. Not one is superior to another. Those that believe that their version have started wars and killed others for minor variations in doctrine. Not so sure that is what God or Jesus intended.

Please don't go all LBJ/NBA on this too :no:
Darth has lept off that cliff long ago.

And here I thought you were only book smart.

 

[Catbone]

The bible is incredibly confusing with all the metaphors

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

I was never intending to argue, simply to correct some very false statements said on this board, more so for the other readers. I'm not going to get in useless debates, but anytime I have the opportunity to present the gospel clearly to who knows how many readers are on here, in going to take it, especially because I believe John 6:44 that you just quoted.

I have stopped debating the historical revisionism on this board, but would be glad to try and answer any serious questions some may have. My only desire today is that everyone truly understand the state we are all in. One life, then eternity.

I hope you understand what I meant. You are very good apologist, and you presented the case well.