Recruiting Forum Off Topic Thread III

[Bassmaster_Vol]

There is one path to God. Christ offered it to those in the Middle East because they were desperately in need of it. Those in India had already found the way centuries before. Their writings say basically the same thing as the Bible. In fact it would be hard to tell a difference between the two a lot of the time if you just read different quotes without a reference to what source it came from.

If you’re following the one true path it doesn’t matter what you label yourself. You’ll find god. The different “isms” are the true wolves in sheep’s clothes. They’re used to further divide you from your brothers and sisters around the world. That is what leads to atrocities. Not the words of the religions but those that twist the words to turn us against one another.

Maybe try reading other scriptures and broadening your horizons. It’s helped me appreciate Christ even more

Thank you for engaging the conversation in a civilized way. This is enjoyable for me to have these dialogues. Clearly others don't experience the same joy that I do talking about these things. I actually haven't read any Hindu scriptures so I can't speak to them specifically. But here is what I do know, Hindus are polytheistic, right? Okay, the Bible says that there is one God. Right away they are mutually exclusive. If there is one path to God, which God? Because in Hindu, if they are polytheistic, which God are we going to?

Further, the Bible says that the only way to God is through faith in the person and work of Jesus Christ. I've already quoted a few passages, I can quote more if you like. But that is the teaching of the New Testament. So, if the New Testament teaches that there is one path to God, through faith in the life, death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ, then how is it that Hindu can teach the same path? Because Hindus do not teach that the way to God is through faith in the person and work of Christ. That is mutually exclusive. So while Hinduism may have some teaching about how we treat one another, that isn't the way to God according to the New Testament. That's law for how we are to live, but not the path to salvation. So, how can these mutually exclusive teachings be the same path?

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

Not at all. Most people don’t agree with me on the topic. What gets under my skin is the whole “oh he doesn’t believe what I believe so I’ll pray for his soul” condescension that’s so widespread.

And you keep using the word truth but the reality is no one knows the truth. Faith and beliefs are cool and all but that’s all they are. They’re not proven truths and they never will be.

Is that the truth?

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

they're not disagreeing wtih you, just the words you posted. lol.

lol

 

[Ron Swanson]

Is that the truth?

Now you understand.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

Now you understand.

LOL

 

[titansvolsfaninga]

I know this sounds good in modern culture, but it just isn't true. Jesus said, "I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life, no one comes to the Father except through Me" John 14:6. He also said, "Whoever believes in Him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because He has not believed in the name of the only Son of God" John 3:18. Jesus denies that there are multiple paths. He says time and time again, that there is one way. There are so many other verses I can quote that say the same thing. You may not believe that, and that's your preogative, but if you are right and there are multiple ways to God, then Jesus was a liar. If He is a liar, then He's not the Savior. That then, at the least, eliminates Christianity from even being a path to God. It really is that simple. If Jesus is not the only way, then He wasn't a good teacher, He was a liar, and thus He is not the Messiah and we should be looking for another.

So I reject that there is no right answer, and I stand with Christ who claimed Himself to be the only way and proved it by His resurrection from the dead. It is so tempting to go along with our culture and just say just be spiritual or just seek the Lord, but Christ didn't say that, and thus neither can I. And since these are the words of Christ that I quoted, He absolutely would condemn false teaching that says there are other ways. In fact, He did it Himself: "Beware of false prophets who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves" Matthew 7:15. So, it is a twisting of Scripture to say that we are not to judge those who worship false Gods. Paul went to the Areopagus and proclaimed the gospel to the Athenian philosophers. He called the heretics in Colossae heretics and warned the church from listening to them. He said that the heretics bringing a different religion to the Galatians were cursed, condemned to hell, because of their false teaching. So it just isn't true to say God doesn't want us to expose false religion. That is anti-biblical and anti-Christ.

so.....someone born in an area that is not exposed to Christianity is doomed?
no offense to your religion, but historically those that practiced Christianity did not really set good examples. They raped and murdered because they "felt" that their bible gave them authority to do so.

 

[InstrumentalVol]

Thank you for engaging the conversation in a civilized way. This is enjoyable for me to have these dialogues. Clearly others don't experience the same joy that I do talking about these things. I actually haven't read any Hindu scriptures so I can't speak to them specifically. But here is what I do know, Hindus are polytheistic, right? Okay, the Bible says that there is one God. Right away they are mutually exclusive. If there is one path to God, which God? Because in Hindu, if they are polytheistic, which God are we going to?

Further, the Bible says that the only way to God is through faith in the person and work of Jesus Christ. I've already quoted a few passages, I can quote more if you like. But that is the teaching of the New Testament. So, if the New Testament teaches that there is one path to God, through faith in the life, death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ, then how is it that Hindu can teach the same path? Because Hindus do not teach that the way to God is through faith in the person and work of Christ. That is mutually exclusive. So while Hinduism may have some teaching about how we treat one another, that isn't the way to God according to the New Testament. That's law for how we are to live, but not the path to salvation. So, how can these mutually exclusive teachings be the same path?

Bass, trying to piggyback off the discussion elsewhere but just as a general question, how do you know the things in the Bible are true as opposed to say the Quran or another religious book? And do you take the Bible's words as sacred and from God himself? Just wondering how you grapple with some of the stuff in the Bible versus your own morality.

EDIT: No worries if you dont answer youre getting bombarded with replies lol

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Sorry bro

I steer clear of this in a public forum. Love to talk face to face in the context of relationship where discussions and objections are generally more productive. I’d love to have a cup of tea with anyone here to discuss these things, but on here, I try to stay in my lane unless sharing a personal thing

If you have noticed, I feel the same way.

 

[jakez4ut]

Thank you for engaging the conversation in a civilized way. This is enjoyable for me to have these dialogues. Clearly others don't experience the same joy that I do talking about these things. I actually haven't read any Hindu scriptures so I can't speak to them specifically. But here is what I do know, Hindus are polytheistic, right? Okay, the Bible says that there is one God. Right away they are mutually exclusive. If there is one path to God, which God? Because in Hindu, if they are polytheistic, which God are we going to?

Further, the Bible says that the only way to God is through faith in the person and work of Jesus Christ. I've already quoted a few passages, I can quote more if you like. But that is the teaching of the New Testament. So, if the New Testament teaches that there is one path to God, through faith in the life, death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ, then how is it that Hindu can teach the same path? Because Hindus do not teach that the way to God is through faith in the person and work of Christ. That is mutually exclusive. So while Hinduism may have some teaching about how we treat one another, that isn't the way to God according to the New Testament. That's law for how we are to live, but not the path to salvation. So, how can these mutually exclusive teachings be the same path?

and devout muslims have "their way" that they believe is the truth. Hindus have thiers. Jews have theirs. and Christians (and each of their denominations) have theirs.

the belief that one is the truth is all that is needed. you have yours, others have theirs, and i'm sure the hardlineers in each faith will go on condemning the others for their beliefs and the world will keep turning, and nothing will change on this religion front. lol.....

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

so.....someone born in an area that is not exposed to Christianity is doomed?
no offense to your religion, but historically those that practiced Christianity did not really set good examples. They raped and murdered because they "felt" that their bible gave them authority to do so.

First of all, no, but then we'd have to talk about another topic that would take us further down the rabbit hole. Let me just say, God is sovereign and has the power to spread His gospel to reach His people. But that's another topic that I'd rather not get into.

Second, that's fine to talk about bad examples of people in "my religion," whatever that means. Just because people call themselves Christians do not mean that they are. Besides, men are sinners, we don't follow them, we follow Christ, whom no one can condemn of committing any sin. We could also talk about all the good done in the name of Christianity if you would like, but I don't think that's what you were going for with that statement.

 

[chargervol]

The irony in all this. When Gandhi said that he would probably be a Christian if it weren't for Christians, he meant it literally.

He was stopped at the door of the local Christian church for not meeting their criteria. All after being enamored by the words of Jesus and wanting to learn more.

There's some kind of twisted irony in reading the posts about him today...still not meeting the standards

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Not at all. Most people don’t agree with me on the topic. What gets under my skin is the whole “oh he doesn’t believe what I believe so I’ll pray for his soul” condescension that’s so widespread.

And you keep using the word truth but the reality is no one knows the truth. Faith and beliefs are cool and all but that’s all they are. They’re not proven truths and they never will be.

Oh...they will be.

 

[scvolfan7]

Thank you for engaging the conversation in a civilized way. This is enjoyable for me to have these dialogues. Clearly others don't experience the same joy that I do talking about these things. I actually haven't read any Hindu scriptures so I can't speak to them specifically. But here is what I do know, Hindus are polytheistic, right? Okay, the Bible says that there is one God. Right away they are mutually exclusive. If there is one path to God, which God? Because in Hindu, if they are polytheistic, which God are we going to?

Further, the Bible says that the only way to God is through faith in the person and work of Jesus Christ. I've already quoted a few passages, I can quote more if you like. But that is the teaching of the New Testament. So, if the New Testament teaches that there is one path to God, through faith in the life, death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ, then how is it that Hindu can teach the same path? Because Hindus do not teach that the way to God is through faith in the person and work of Christ. That is mutually exclusive. So while Hinduism may have some teaching about how we treat one another, that isn't the way to God according to the New Testament. That's law for how we are to live, but not the path to salvation. So, how can these mutually exclusive teachings be the same path?

“Who is the one God?” The sage replies, “Breath. He is called Brahman…” (taken from Upanisads: A new translation by Patrick Olivelle)

Ultimately there is one God in Hinduism. Which I think is the same God Christ refers to. It’s similar to Christianity in that Christ was god come to earth. The Hindus just have many more versions or representations of that.

 

[InstrumentalVol]

“Who is the one God?” The sage replies, “Breath. He is called Brahman…” (taken from Upanisads: A new translation by Patrick Olivelle)

Ultimately there is one God in Hinduism. Which I think is the same God Christ refers to. It’s similar to Christianity in that Christ was god come to earth. The Hindus just have many more versions or representations of that.

Christianity and Hinduism are very similar.

Both believe their saviors came from a virgin mother, are part of a holy trinity, performed miracles & rose from the dead. Theyre monotheistic are its essence I believe.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

Bass, trying to piggyback off the discussion elsewhere but just as a general question, how do you know the things in the Bible are true as opposed to say the Quran or another religious book? And do you take the Bible's words as sacred and from God himself? Just wondering how you grapple with some of the stuff in the Bible versus your own morality.

Yes I do take them to be the very words of God. I do because I believe that Jesus died and rose from the dead. If Jesus didn't rise from the dead, then I would reject the Bible completely and walk away. But since the resurrection of Jesus is so certain, then what He said was true and to deny it is to be condemned. We have to understand, when we look at the Bible we are looking at the most unique book in all of history. There is a lot I could say here, but I've had the discussion on here before about the veracity of the New Testament text, it's reliability, and I'm not sure I want to have all of that discussion again. I think what people forget is that Christian writings didn't stop with the book of Revelation. We have writings from Polycarp, for example, who was a student of the apostle John, Clement of Rome writing in the 1st century as well. These men knew the men who walked with Christ. There is so much that could be said here.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

The irony in all this. When Gandhi said that he would probably be a Christian if it weren't for Christians, he meant it literally.

He was stopped at the door of the local Christian church for not meeting their criteria. All after being enamored by the words of Jesus and wanting to learn more.

There's some kind of twisted irony in reading the posts about him today...still not meeting the standards

I'd like to know that story, actually. The only requirement for knowing Christ is turning from sin and believing in Him.

 

[Aesius]

Yes I do take them to be the very words of God. I do because I believe that Jesus died and rose from the dead. If Jesus didn't rise from the dead, then I would reject the Bible completely and walk away. But since the resurrection of Jesus is so certain, then what He said was true and to deny it is to be condemned. We have to understand, when we look at the Bible we are looking at the most unique book in all of history. There is a lot I could say here, but I've had the discussion on here before about the veracity of the New Testament text, it's reliability, and I'm not sure I want to have all of that discussion again. I think what people forget is that Christian writings didn't stop with the book of Revelation. We have writings from Polycarp, for example, who was a student of the apostle John, Clement of Rome writing in the 1st century as well. These men knew the men who walked with Christ. There is so much that could be said here.

What about Muhammad? He came along much later than Jesus and there's significantly more known about his life than Jesus's, whose biography is extremely limited and even inconsistent among the Gospels.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

and devout muslims have "their way" that they believe is the truth. Hindus have thiers. Jews have theirs. and Christians (and each of their denominations) have theirs.

the belief that one is the truth is all that is needed. you have yours, others have theirs, and i'm sure the hardlineers in each faith will go on condemning the others for their beliefs and the world will keep turning, and nothing will change on this religion front. lol.....

It should not surprise us that there are different and false religions. People are sinners. There have always been false religions going back to Baal worship of the Old Testament. Just because there are other faiths does not disprove the truth just like those who believe the earth is flat doesn't disprove the reality of the spherical earth.

But ultimately, and I've said this before, when you look at other religions and their teaching of their "path to God" they all have a common theme in how they teach one makes it to their god and it has something to do with human effort. With Christianity, it is unique. Christ doesn't say keep the law or be good enough or love your neighbor in order to earn salvation. Christ says "you can't earn salvation because you're a sinner, but I will earn it for you," which is why He came to die. We couldn't fulfill the law, so He did. He kept the Law of God perfectly. We couldn't atone for our sin, because we are sinners, so He did. He, the sinless Son of God, died to pay the penalty for our sin that we could never pay. So that when we turn and believe in Him through faith, we don't have to merit anything, He gives it to us. He makes us righteous by crediting His own righteousness to our account. So that we can stand before God not on the basis of our own merits, which are pitiful, but on the basis of His. That is unique and there is nothing like that taught in any other religion.

 

[bluegrasser]

Here is the last thing I will add to this discussion. My grandfather was a Baptist preacher in Louisiana, my mom was an Episcopal priest in Tennessee. I was a religion major in college. I have spent my short 43 years on this earth studying the Bible and other world religions.

I believed that God created us - and the entire universe. I believe that science supports the interconnectedness of all things (including how certain important elements and chemicals made it to the earth from various points far out in the cosmos). I can not understand our presence on this earth without God’s existence to make it all happen.

If you also agree that God created everything, then you would have to agree that nothing existed before that. Therefore, EVERYTHING that exists is made up of the stuff of God. The Bible supports this, Christ’s teachings support this.

I believe that God is love and he loves his creation and yearns for us to love him back. We are all pretty bad at that though, and most will wait until after death to experience that perfect reuniting with the Creator.

But I think over the millennia there have been a few amazing people who have realized that perfect union with God WHILE STILL HERE ON EARTH. And have tried to teach others how to do it.

I believe that Jesus of Nazareth was one such - who taught others that he was both man and God, and tried to describe to his fellow human beings how to strive to find that same path. Unlike Buddha, or Muhammad, he did not simply teach ideas on into his old age and die. He allowed himself to be crucified in a terrible, horrible death - a painful awful death that he could have easily avoided or stopped. To me, one of the most powerful things about the crucifixion is that it shows that Jesus was a flesh and blood human being - just like you and me. Not some make believe supernatural superhero that we could worship but have no chance of identifying with or trying to copy and imitate.

At any rate, if you believe God created this world and loves his creation - especially people - does your view of religions automatically disqualify and condemn SEVERAL BILLION moms, dads, sisters, brothers, daughters and sons that exist on the planet today that don’t happen to follow your doctrines? Do you think a loving God would set up a scenario where nearly 1/2- 2/3 of his entire creation is existentially screwed, mainly because of what area or country they were born in? That’s a pretty mean God who would do that.

Ok, I’m gonna get fired if I don’t put the phone down and do some work...

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

“Who is the one God?” The sage replies, “Breath. He is called Brahman…” (taken from Upanisads: A new translation by Patrick Olivelle)

Ultimately there is one God in Hinduism. Which I think is the same God Christ refers to. It’s similar to Christianity in that Christ was god come to earth. The Hindus just have many more versions or representations of that.

I don't know much about Hinduism, I admit. But a quick google search reveals them to be polytheistic. But you still didn't respond to my second statement which is that they deny the tenants of the gospel and the exclusivity of Christ. They don't teach the same way that the NT does no matter how we spin it. They are mutually exclusive.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

What about Muhammad? He came along much later than Jesus and there's significantly more known about his life than Jesus's, whose biography is extremely limited and even inconsistent among the Gospels.

Did Muhammad die and rise from the dead?

And I reject the second statement there that the gospels are inconsistent and His biography is limited. There are 27 books of the New Testament that teach us about Christ. It's only limited if you reject the New Testament.

 

[InstrumentalVol]

Yes I do take them to be the very words of God. I do because I believe that Jesus died and rose from the dead. If Jesus didn't rise from the dead, then I would reject the Bible completely and walk away. But since the resurrection of Jesus is so certain, then what He said was true and to deny it is to be condemned. We have to understand, when we look at the Bible we are looking at the most unique book in all of history. There is a lot I could say here, but I've had the discussion on here before about the veracity of the New Testament text, it's reliability, and I'm not sure I want to have all of that discussion again. I think what people forget is that Christian writings didn't stop with the book of Revelation. We have writings from Polycarp, for example, who was a student of the apostle John, Clement of Rome writing in the 1st century as well. These men knew the men who walked with Christ. There is so much that could be said here.

Thats interesting, thanks for the reply. I will absolutely have to read more into the early writings to educate myself on this.

I, and many others, seem to have a moral qualm with the Bible and God in particular. Namely, if it is to be believed as the absolute, undeniable word of a perfect, omnipotent God. Because in theory if God is infallible then his morality is objective right? I just wonder how Christians & others balance the fact that if the Bible is God's word how do they both accept that his morality is superior but in the same book there are things like Psalm 137, 1 Peter 2:18, wiping out the entire planet for upsetting God (flood) and more. Its like he has human attributes which you wouldnt expect out of this supreme creator. Anyway, just rambling - thanks for the reply

 

[jakez4ut]

I'd like to know that story, actually. The only requirement for knowing Christ is turning from sin and believing in Him.

https://www.kansascity.com/living/religion/article18756585.html

 

[scvolfan7]

I don't know much about Hinduism, I admit. But a quick google search reveals them to be polytheistic. But you still didn't respond to my second statement which is that they deny the tenants of the gospel and the exclusivity of Christ. They don't teach the same way that the NT does no matter how we spin it. They are mutually exclusive.

I just quoted their scripture though. The Upanishads are central in Hinduism. They’re monotheistic.

Hinduism formed before Christ so yeah of course they don’t talk about following Christ. The pre date him by centuries.

 

[jakez4ut]

It should not surprise us that there are different and false religions. People are sinners. There have always been false religions going back to Baal worship of the Old Testament. Just because there are other faiths does not disprove the truth just like those who believe the earth is flat doesn't disprove the reality of the spherical earth.

But ultimately, and I've said this before, when you look at other religions and their teaching of their "path to God" they all have a common theme in how they teach one makes it to their god and it has something to do with human effort. With Christianity, it is unique. Christ doesn't say keep the law or be good enough or love your neighbor in order to earn salvation. Christ says "you can't earn salvation because you're a sinner, but I will earn it for you," which is why He came to die. We couldn't fulfill the law, so He did. He kept the Law of God perfectly. We couldn't atone for our sin, because we are sinners, so He did. He, the sinless Son of God, died to pay the penalty for our sin that we could never pay. So that when we turn and believe in Him through faith, we don't have to merit anything, He gives it to us. He makes us righteous by crediting His own righteousness to our account. So that we can stand before God not on the basis of our own merits, which are pitiful, but on the basis of His. That is unique and there is nothing like that taught in any other religion.

That's the thing. The devout of the other religions you call false, say yours is false for the same basic reason you do.

So either everyone is right... Everyone is wrong lol