Stop with the complaining over 3* recruits

#176
#176
Skill guys normally get the 4 and 5 stars in greater numbers than linemen because lineman are so hard to make projections on. This is a heavy DL/OL class in numbers overall. I understand class standings and championships but if you are more three star heavy in a class, it has a better chance of outperforming star ratings when you have more lineman.
 
#177
#177
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
No.

Recruits only care about getting to the NFL. Early playing time and competing for championship are just a means to an end....getting to the NFL.

Right now we can't offer early playing time anymore and Butch hasn't proven he can compete for championships. However, the most damning critique right now in recruiting is the fact we have had 0 draft picks in 2 years.

I promise you schools like Clemson and Georgia are beating recruits over the head with this fact. They're telling them if you go to Tennessee you won't get to the NFL. Kids are impressionable and really only remember what they see last. And right now what they've seen is Tennessee choke in big games and have no players taken in the draft.

If Butch wants to change the narrative, he needs to win the SEC championship this season and have MULTIPLE players taken in the 1st round of the 2017 draft.

Its probably to late to change the minds of 2017 recruits. But if we won the SEC championship this year and have multiple 1st round picks, we should be able to salvage top recruiting classes in 2018 and 2019.
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Playing time and development matter toward future draft status. Winning championships creates a buzz and makes kids that can accomplish the above mentioned at said school take a harder look. Saying its just one thing is false.
 
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#181
#181
CrunchingTheVolz said:
Not likely. If it happens it sure wouldn't irritate me. We are way behind right now. We need to land 6-7 big time commits just to get back to respectable.
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It would irritate you. Butch is a dirty recruiter, unlike DABO. If Butch is going to preach family he needs to follow through with it...



Hope they all get dropped just for your fury
 
#182
#182
IndianaVolunteer said:
It would irritate you. Butch is a dirty recruiter, unlike DABO. If Butch is going to preach family he needs to follow through with it...



Hope they all get dropped just for your fury
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I know that's part of the process here now. I don't care for it, but fully expect they will continue to do it. I accept it. That's why unlike before I now hope ALL commitments take their visits and leave the door open to other options. You might think you're family, but you're not yet.
 
#184
#184
vols 30 said:
Agree , and it could happen with a great year
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I get the feeling we add maybe 4 more 4* commits and drop 1-2. Probably not near as many changes as most expect. I'm just not seeing the interest from top recruits this cycle. Recuits read the same media sites we do. They know UT is the talk of college football this year. Its not some big surprise if we are in Atlanta this year. Its expected. Why does it look like the top targets don't care? Good question.
 
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#185
#185
CrunchingTheVolz said:
I get the feeling we add maybe 4 more 4* commits and drop 1-2. Probably not near as many changes as most expect. I'm just not seeing the interest from top recruits this cycle. Recuits read the same media sites we do. They know UT is the talk of college football this year. Its not some big surprise if we are in Atlanta this year. Its expected. Why does it look like the top targets don't care? Good question.
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It is a good question. I wonder if the coaching staff could answer that.
 
#186
#186
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
No.

Recruits only care about getting to the NFL. Early playing time and competing for championship are just a means to an end....getting to the NFL.

Right now we can't offer early playing time anymore and Butch hasn't proven he can compete for championships. However, the most damning critique right now in recruiting is the fact we have had 0 draft picks in 2 years.

I promise you schools like Clemson and Georgia are beating recruits over the head with this fact. They're telling them if you go to Tennessee you won't get to the NFL. Kids are impressionable and really only remember what they see last. And right now what they've seen is Tennessee choke in big games and have no players taken in the draft.

If Butch wants to change the narrative, he needs to win the SEC championship this season and have MULTIPLE players taken in the 1st round of the 2017 draft.

Its probably to late to change the minds of 2017 recruits. But if we won the SEC championship this year and have multiple 1st round picks, we should be able to salvage top recruiting classes in 2018 and 2019.
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Is draft after signing day?
 
#190
#190
jasonvol18 said:
Juniors still have to declare in January. Last year was Jan 18th I believe.
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Yeah, I know. I think the coaches should be able to sell draft projections now to recruits. Especially with some being no doubt picks. Some feel recruits won't care till they actually see them drafted.
 
#193
#193
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
Compared to 2014 and 2015 this is a tailspin.

Top 5 classes are what lead to championships. Not classes made up of 3 stars.
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Your first sentence is complete rubbish. Its not NSD and this class is not finished. It is completely irrelevant what the class looks like right now. But you like some others on here just cannot grasp that concept.

Players get bumps in recuiting every year. So you, along with everyone else, have no idea which one of the guys we have recruited will get bumps. Also, serious question. Say half of the 3* guys we have committed get bumped up to 4*s, which is possible. Now does that fact, and that fact alone, all of a sudden turn those players into really good players?

Also, you have been the main one making the claims that we are going to win the NC this year and go undefeated. Do you honestly believe that if that happens, we will still have the exact same group of recruits we have now?
 
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#194
#194
BigOrangeTrain said:
Your forst sentence is complete rubbish. Its not NSD and this class is not finished. It is completely irrelevant what the class looks like right now. But you like some others on here just cannot grasp that concept.

Players get bumps in recuiting every year. So you, along with everyone else, have no idea which one of the guys we have recruited will get bumps. Also, serious question. Say half of the 3* guys we have committed get bumped up to 4*s, which is possible. Now does that fact, and that fact alone, all of a sudden turn those players into really good players?

Also, you have been the main one making the claims that we are going to win the NC this year and go undefeated. Do you honestly believe that if that happens, we will still have the exact same group of recruits we have now?
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I don't think we had any recruit last year bumped up a star on the composite. Maybe a few % points, but not enough to take them from a 3* to a 4*.

Half the class this year? Come on man.
 
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#195
#195
BigOrangeTrain said:
Your forst sentence is complete rubbish. Its not NSD and this class is not finished. It is completely irrelevant what the class looks like right now. But you like some others on here just cannot grasp that concept.

Players get bumps in recuiting every year. So you, along with everyone else, have no idea which one of the guys we have recruited will get bumps. Also, serious question. Say half of the 3* guys we have committed get bumped up to 4*s, which is possible. Now does that fact, and that fact alone, all of a sudden turn those players into really good players?

Also, you have been the main one making the claims that we are going to win the NC this year and go undefeated. Do you honestly believe that if that happens, we will still have the exact same group of recruits we have now?
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You make some nice points but the reality is we have signed a ton of 3* recruits. Butch wants to sign 25 scholarship players for 2017. We're at 23 players right now. That's 2 spots left.

People are saying let Butch allow 10+ commits to sign elsewhere. Really? How would that make Butch look & the media would have a field day in him doing this.

Now, if he allows a couple to go elsewhere to sign a 5* & a 4* player then that would seem fine in my eyes. I'd say at most 3-5 players would be fair to let go. No, not 10+ players. That's just not going to happen folks!

If he wants to let a few go in order to sign a couple better players then so be it. I just can't believe Butch has decided to allow 23 to commit this far away from NSD. He knows what he's doing though. He's the coach & we're the fans!
 
#196
#196
CrunchingTheVolz said:
I don't think we had any recruit last year bumped up a star on the composite. Maybe a few % points, but not enough to take them from a 3* to a 4*.

Half the class this year? Come on man.
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Were we hyped up and predicted to finish as strong last year as we are this year? No we were not. The logical line of thinking is that recruits are on a wait and see approach with us.

I know that you can say with 100% certainty that half the class couldnt get bumps. Again, you dont know what you're talking about. Its possible. To say anything else is foolish.

So a serious question for you. Is there that much of a difference between a 3* and 4*? I would probably agree that there is a difference between a 3* and a 5*. But when it comes to comparing 3* to 4* and 4* to 5* its not some huge disparity. Its not like if the guys we have committed get bumps, they will all of a sudden become good. Another question, do you think this class will be the same if we perform up to expectations this year?
 
#197
#197
BigOrangeTrain said:
Were we hyped up and predicted to finish as strong last year as we are this year? No we were not. The logical line of thinking is that recruits are on a wait and see approach with us.

I know that you can say with 100% certainty that half the class couldnt get bumps. Again, you dont know what you're talking about. Its possible. To say anything else is foolish.

So a serious question for you. Is there that much of a difference between a 3* and 4*? I would probably agree that there is a difference between a 3* and a 5*. But when it comes to comparing 3* to 4* and 4* to 5* its not some huge disparity. Its not like if the guys we have committed get bumps, they will all of a sudden become good. Another question, do you think this class will be the same if we perform up to expectations this year?
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If there were quite a few examples of classes loaded with mostly 3* talent winning SEC titles, you may have a solid argument. Unfortunately it's just not the case. At minimum you need 60-65% 4-5*'s. Even last years class with 10 4* and 13 3* probably won't get it done. History says being ranked 14th isn't where Ya wanna be.
 
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#198
#198
CrunchingTheVolz said:
If there were quite a few examples of classes loaded with mostly 3* talent winning SEC titles, you may have a solid argument. Unfortunately it's just not the case. At minimum you need 60-65% 4-5*'s. Even last years class with 10 4* and 13 3* probably won't get it done. History says being ranked 14th isn't where Ya wanna be.
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You failed to address my questions. You just dodged as usual. Again, you cannot get past the fact that its not NSD.
 
#199
#199
BigOrangeTrain said:
You failed to address my questions. You just dodged as usual. Again, you cannot get past the fact that its not NSD.
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And anybody who has a problem with last years signing class is just trolling imo. Vols signed some ballers in that class! Best QB in the country, best secondary class, 3 great OL prospects with high ceilings, great wide receivers, number 1 athlete in the country in Byrd, and King Kongbo. If you don't think we can win with that class I don't know what to tell you. If they would have gotten Brown there would be no questions, but still the class was outstanding and Butch is fixing the lack of DLs in that class in the 2017 guys
 
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#200
#200
BigOrangeTrain said:
You failed to address my questions. You just dodged as usual. Again, you cannot get past the fact that its not NSD.
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Actually I did address your question. Is there a real difference in a 3* and a 4*? Yes. As I said, history shows stocking classes loaded with 3* talent will not regularly be a title contender in the SEC. You have to get a good ratio of 3* to 4-5* talent. 6-8 4* and 15 or so 3* will not get it done. 15 4* and 10 3* IMO is where we need to be minimum. Mix in a 5* now and then. Why was 2014 so good? 16 4*'s. Yes, it matters.
 
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