Taliban Taking Over Afghanistan - Does anyone care?

Do you care?

  • No

    Votes: 40 23.1%

  • Hell No

    Votes: 48 27.7%

  • Yes, we should invade and send in Troops

    Votes: 25 14.5%

  • I like Pie

    Votes: 60 34.7%
  • Total voters
    173
#2,626
#2,626
11%....Trump was cracking down on legal immigration and after 4 years of that, only 11% of Republicans supported expanding it. No matter what level of immigration we're at or what the economy is doing or what's happening on the world stage, 84-93% of them don't support expanding it. LOL. "We support legal immigration" is mostly a farce.

This would be like Republicans saying they support welfare while their actions only ever show that they want to clamp down on it. Maybe you don't want to get rid of all welfare, but are you really a supporter? Come on.

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#2,627
#2,627
Weezer said:
Every conflict from WWII has involved nation building. We had success with Japan and, to a degree, South Korea, and have completely failed since.
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The difference is that Japan and Korea were semi-industrialized already. Most of the tribal people in the middle east sand dunes can't even read or write.
 
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#2,628
#2,628
Weezer said:
Every conflict from WWII has involved nation building. We had success with Japan and, to a degree, South Korea, and have completely failed since.
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I wonder what the difference between Japan/South Korea/Germany and Vietnam/Afghanistan/Iraq was. Because you are right it isn't like nations didn't have to be rebuilt after WWII.

Japan and Germany were prosperous nations before falling into the hands of despots, so perhaps that has something to do with it? However South Korea was not, yet eventually became a prosperous nation out of nothing.
 
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#2,630
#2,630
VolStrom said:
The difference is that Japan and Korea were semi-industrialized already. Most of the tribal people in the middle east sand dunes can't even read or write.
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It helped that the Japanese were almost fanatical in rebuilding their nation, and everyone honored the ceasefire to the Korean War. A large part of the success of Japan and South Korea is absolutely the people.
 
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#2,634
#2,634
Weezer said:
It helped that the Japanese were almost fanatical in rebuilding their nation, and everyone honored the ceasefire to the Korean War. A large part of the success of Japan and South Korea is absolutely the people.
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So you think the success of the South Koreans is because their people are better than the North Koreans? It couldn't possibly be that the Americans helped them develop factories and a way of life outside dictators?
 
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#2,635
#2,635
05_never_again said:
I wonder what the difference between Japan/South Korea/Germany and Vietnam/Afghanistan/Iraq was. Because you are right it isn't like nations didn't have to be rebuilt after WWII.

Japan and Germany were prosperous nations before falling into the hands of despots, so perhaps that has something to do with it? However South Korea was not, yet eventually became a prosperous nation out of nothing.
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The Iraqi/Afghan people don't care (or at least not enough)
 
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#2,637
#2,637
615vols said:
Thought I’d pop in and see what’s happening, looks like more trump discussion. Shocker!
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It's not about Trump, actually. It's a discussion about where Republicans really stand on legal immigration. I'll say sorry to all the little baby ears that Trump was brought up, but he is relevant to the discussion.
 
#2,638
#2,638
n_huffhines said:
Holy ****, you're as intellectually dishonest as they come.
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You're as gullible as they come. I suppose you believe that when Trump said there were decent people on both sides in Charlottesville he was talking about the white supremacist too. Your table doesn't addreass causation not mention it 2021 is projected. Trump is not president, hasn't be president for most of 2021. Maybe your beef should be with Biden.


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#2,639
#2,639
Sandman 423 said:
I would think so. I would actually say less that 10% fall into the immigrant hating camp. I would also guess it is that way across all parties.
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Hating? that's a far cry from "supporting". I'm assuming you saw my graph showing that about 85% of Republicans never want to expand legal immigration?
 
#2,640
#2,640
InVOLuntary said:
You're as gullible as they come. I suppose you believe that when Trump said there were decent people on both sides in Charlottesville he was talking about the white supremacist too. Your table doesn't addreass causation not mention it 2021 is projected. Trump is not president, hasn't be president for most of 2021. Maybe your beef should be with Biden.


200.webp
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So did Trump restrict legal immigration or not?
 
#2,641
#2,641
n_huffhines said:
It's not about Trump, actually. It's a discussion about where Republicans really stand on immigration. I'll say sorry to all the little baby ears that Trump was brought up, but he is relevant to the discussion.
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“It’s not about trump, but let’s talk specifically about trump”. Makes sense huff. You gonna get all a** hurt again like you did in the ufc thread after I laughed at the bum you bet on losing?
 
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#2,642
#2,642
VolStrom said:
So you think the success of the South Koreans is because their people are better than the North Koreans? It couldn't possibly be that the Americans helped them develop factories and a way of life outside dictators?
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I think the people of South Korea were dedicated and took what America provided and ran with it.
 
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#2,644
#2,644
05_never_again said:
You mean their objective is to defeat the US's will to stick around after combat to nation-build. There really never was a lack of a will for the military to fight in any of those conflicts (i.e., it wasn't like in either Iraq War we showed up, Saddam's forces let us have it, and our forces retreated).

To @hog88 point, the military and political goals are always intertwined, so if the political goals fail then the whole effort fails and the conversation is kind of moot. However I wouldn't say that the military failed in any of those instances that were mentioned.
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We have the will to go for the quick knockout blow, but we don't have the national will to win a sustained conflict - like an insurgency - where there is no quick solution. And we lack the national will to use the tactics that exterminate the insurgents - we don't want to be bad guys enough to do what's necessary, and most of the country has no desire to be a part of any conflict at all. Cheerleading is OK - as long as nobody is suggesting that more personal support may be necessary. The antiwar protestors of the 60s and 70s were driven more by personal issues than moral issues - "Hell no, We won't go."
 
#2,645
#2,645
615vols said:
“It’s not about trump, but let’s talk specifically about trump”. Makes sense huff. You gonna get all a** hurt again like you did in the ufc thread after I laughed at the bum you bet on losing?
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I don't even care enough to remember that was you. I see your handle come up and I know I know you but I don't tie you to any positions or discussions because I don't care about whatever rivalry you seem to think is going on.
 
#2,646
#2,646
n_huffhines said:
I can't believe this even has to be supported. Should be common knowledge.

View attachment 387667
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Not to be a wet blanket but FY2021 started Oct 2020 and immigration from March 2020 onward came to pretty much a screeching halt and hasn't really rebounded much. So comparing 2015 to now would definitely show a massive drop in immigration. Year on year pre Covid it looks like it's more around a 10% decline or less.
 
#2,649
#2,649
n_huffhines said:
I don't even care enough to remember that was you. I see your handle come up and I know I know you but I don't tie you to any positions or discussions because I don't care about whatever rivalry you seem to think is going on.
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No rivalry, I just know you as the poster who seems to get pissy too easily and seems to try to argue about literally anything.
 
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#2,650
#2,650
So has our brain trust determined that nation-building can work if the nation being rebuilt was previously prosperous/industrialized? But if it has never been prosperous/industrialized (Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iraq) it is hopeless?
 
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