That's racist!

#21,754
#21,754
BigOrangeMojo said:
She's not better than CC now. There are better players than CC who got left over but Taurasi had no business on an Olympic team in 2024....
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She's putting up similar numbers on a far better team with CC turning the ball over more than 3x as much. Agree that players like Ogunbowale are more qualified than Taurasi
 
#21,755
#21,755
NashVol11 said:
She's putting up similar numbers on a far better team with CC turning the ball over more than 3x as much. Agree that players like Ogunbowale are more qualified than Taurasi
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CC has a far worse supporting cast yet is better defensive player, more steals, more assists, more rebounds, slightly higher FG %...

No complaints if Og had been chosen...

This is the same thing that happened last year when past prime player got spot over better (younger) players...
 
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#21,756
#21,756
BigOrangeMojo said:
CC has a far worse supporting cast yet is better defensive player, more steals, more assists, more rebounds, slightly higher FG %...

No complaints if Og had been chosen...

This is the same thing that happened last year when past prime player got spot over better (younger) players...
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The far worse supporting cast is why she gets to score as much as she does, and has the ball all the time despite probably leading the league in turnovers. I think she's a better passer but not a better defender at this point, and rebounds (4.9-4.8) and FG% (37.3-37.1) are basically the same.

The international game is also more physical and DT has shown she can handle it, whereas handling physicality is one of the things CC needs to improve most. I don't think DT is one of the best 12 (and I like CC way more) but I don't think CC is "far" better, and not sure she's better at all from a winning basketball perspective until she gets her game maybe 5% more under control
 
#21,757
#21,757
NashVol11 said:
Nah, this ain’t it. Leaves off percentages and turnovers and it’s much easier to run up points on a crap team than a contender. All of those players are straight up better than her and it’s not a narrow margin (yet)
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Nah, it was specifically called out -

KB5252 said:
She isn't one of the best 12 her averages and game at this point are pretty clear.
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Those averages were the ones ESPN displayed on the player pages. Caitlin’s percentages aren’t demonstrably worse than a couple of those other girls.

Turnovers sure. But really grasping there. Turnover rate from the #12 spot isn’t impacting this team’s performance in Paris.
 
#21,758
#21,758
NashVol11 said:
The international game is also more physical and DT has shown she can handle it, whereas handling physicality is one of the things CC needs to improve most. I don't think DT is one of the best 12 (and I like CC way more) but I don't think CC is "far" better, and not sure she's better at all from a winning basketball perspective until she gets her game maybe 5% more under control
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Can handle the physicality of the international game? Oh come on. “Winning basketball”?

You guys are acting like this team was put together to ensure victory or something. The next 12 left out could probably win this tournament.

It. Is. A. Foregone. Conclusion.

Vegas has em at 1800. Gold. It’s in the bag.
 
#21,759
#21,759
NashVol11 said:
The far worse supporting cast is why she gets to score as much as she does, and has the ball all the time despite probably leading the league in turnovers. I think she's a better passer but not a better defender at this point, and rebounds (4.9-4.8) and FG% (37.3-37.1) are basically the same.

The international game is also more physical and DT has shown she can handle it, whereas handling physicality is one of the things CC needs to improve most. I don't think DT is one of the best 12 (and I like CC way more) but I don't think CC is "far" better, and not sure she's better at all from a winning basketball perspective until she gets her game maybe 5% more under control
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DT can't keep anyone in front of her anymore. She's an inefficient PG who doesn't distribute well and a huge liability on defense. She's 42 and she's getting worse defensively as the seaon progresses.

Og should have got the spot but if you are going to blow spot 12, you blow it on the future, not a relic of the past...
 
#21,760
#21,760
Diana Taurasi was clearly placed on this team for some combination of reasons other than “strictly one of the best 12”.

And I really have no problem with that.

Caitlin Clark isn’t some Anna Kournikova Instagram model moonlighting as a basketball player - she can play.

She could have easily been placed on this team. And it would have juiced excitement and engagement for Women’s Basketball in this prime-time exhibition.

But she wasn’t. Cause “integrity of the game” lol.
 
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#21,761
#21,761
85SugarVol said:
Nah, it was specifically called out -



Those averages were the ones ESPN displayed on the player pages. Caitlin’s percentages aren’t demonstrably worse than a couple of those other girls.

Turnovers sure. But really grasping there. Turnover rate from the #12 spot isn’t impacting this team’s performance in Paris.
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No it's not grasping, their game is much more advanced because of their experience. Turnovers are among the most important stats at her position. If you ask me to decide between player A&B and they are comparable in every stat but turnovers you'd be foolish to pick the player who turns the ball over.

Now in a year or two I think this is a moot point. I think she adjusts some, learns her teammates and the pace of the game some and is likely to be among the best at her position...... She just isn't there yet.

To me it's a lot like the year that Bird made the dream team..... An argument could have been made for a few other players, younger guys....... But leaders like Jordan stood up for him because his experience and leadership was without question and he deserved it, earned it....... And when it mattered they could count on him.
 
#21,763
#21,763
KB5252 said:
No it's not grasping, their game is much more advanced because of their experience. Turnovers are among the most important stats at her position. If you ask me to decide between player A&B and they are comparable in every stat but turnovers you'd be foolish to pick the player who turns the ball over.

Now in a year or two I think this is a moot point. I think she adjusts some, learns her teammates and the pace of the game some and is likely to be among the best at her position...... She just isn't there yet.

To me it's a lot like the year that Bird made the dream team..... An argument could have been made for a few other players, younger guys....... But leaders like Jordan stood up for him because his experience and leadership was without question and he deserved it, earned it....... And when it mattered they could count on him.
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This new attempt to frame it in the context of “experience” or turnovers is laughably transparent.

It assumes these games will be in question - they won’t be.
It assumes the #12 player will play an integral role - they won’t.

Your Bird analogy gives away that you are perfectly fine with players being selected for reasons other than “one of the best 12”.

It’s why Diana Taurasi is on the team.
It’s why Caitlin Clark should be on the team.

How those averages you were goin on about look lol?
 
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#21,764
#21,764
85SugarVol said:
This new attempt to frame it in the context of “experience” or turnovers is laughably transparent.

It assumes these games will be in question - they won’t be.
It assumes the #12 player will play an integral role - they won’t.

Your Bird analogy gives away that you are perfectly fine with players being selected for reasons other than “one of the best 12”.

It’s why Diana Taurasi is on the team.
It’s why Caitlin Clark should be on the team.

How those averages you were goin on about look lol?
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You mean like leading the entire league in turnovers...... Yeah stellar!

If you make the Olympic team it's because you are one of the best at your position.......... Turnovers are important.

I didn't say those players were better, I Said those other players could have been considered...... But experience and trust were important to those players........ Should it surprise you the women's game would be any different?

Just admit your argument for Clark is emotional. You want to blame it on racism. But that's not why she isn't on the team. Read some articles on the subject. I did when I didn't know much about Clark or her game. Now it makes sense...... But keep the Boogeyman alive if you feel you need to. No skin off my back.
 
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#21,765
#21,765
KB5252 said:
You mean like leading the entire league in turnovers...... Yeah stellar!
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You said “average(s)” lol - not one. And you made no mention of turnovers.

But I understand your desire to now cling to turnovers in games that are a foregone conclusion. From the #12 player off the bench. In a game surrounded by fellow superstars instead of scrubs.
 
#21,766
#21,766
KB5252 said:
You mean like leading the entire league in turnovers...... Yeah stellar!

If you make the Olympic team it's because you are one of the best at your position.......... Turnovers are important.

I didn't say those players were better, I Said those other players could have been considered...... But experience and trust were important to those players........ Should it surprise you the women's game would be any different?

Just admit your argument for Clark is emotional. You want to blame it on racism. But that's not why she isn't on the team. Read some articles on the subject. I did when I didn't know much about Clark or her game. Now it makes sense...... But keep the Boogeyman alive if you feel you need to. No skin off my back.
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Because of racism? Nice strawman.

Two of the main comps I’m making are to…. white girls 😂🤷‍♀️
 
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#21,768
#21,768
85SugarVol said:
You said “average(s)” lol - not one. And you made no mention of turnovers.

But I understand your desire to now cling to turnovers in games that are a foregone conclusion. From the #12 player off the bench. In a game surrounded by fellow superstars instead of scrubs.
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I said stats, turnovers bring one of them.
 
#21,769
#21,769
85SugarVol said:
Because of racism? Nice strawman.

Two of the main comps I’m making are to…. white girls 😂🤷‍♀️
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No strawman at all. I'm trying to make sense of your emotional reaction to a player who isn't one of the best players at her position being passed on but the Olympic team.
 
#21,771
#21,771
NashVol11 said:
I think not winning gold would be a stronger argument for not including her, given that she isn’t one of the best 12
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Seems a strange choice given she is statistically equally to many on the team now..where will she be in 2 months...if she hits a wall it's the right call .if she excels it's a poor call. It'll be interesting to follow.
 
#21,772
#21,772
whodeycin85 said:
Seems a strange choice given she is statistically equally to many on the team now..where will she be in 2 months...if she hits a wall it's the right call .if she excels it's a poor call. It'll be interesting to follow.
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That’s fair. It might be good for her to get some time off anyway (and she’s reportedly an alternate so may still make it)
 
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#21,773
#21,773
KB5252 said:
You mean like leading the entire league in turnovers...... Yeah stellar!

If you make the Olympic team it's because you are one of the best at your position.......... Turnovers are important.

I didn't say those players were better, I Said those other players could have been considered...... But experience and trust were important to those players........ Should it surprise you the women's game would be any different?

Just admit your argument for Clark is emotional. You want to blame it on racism. But that's not why she isn't on the team. Read some articles on the subject. I did when I didn't know much about Clark or her game. Now it makes sense...... But keep the Boogeyman alive if you feel you need to. No skin off my back.
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Having seen minimal games but also reading up on CC and the turnover issue..I'm seeing a decent amount of turnovers on wide open passes fumbled by her teammates..its a similar argument to dropped passes by a WR...still counts as incomplete but when people talk about those stats it's always mentioned. She owns some turnovers but I'd say 2 a game are on her teammates at a minimum
 
#21,774
#21,774
NashVol11 said:
That’s fair. It might be good for her to get some time off anyway (and she’s reportedly an alternate so may still make it)
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I like her game..but I don't care for the WNBA..or the NBA but I probably would have watched her in the NBA more then now...I'm curious is she would have got drafted 2nd round if she would have made more money on contract...I know sponsors would be thru the roof more then now..imagine the 1st women nba player, and if she contributed...
 
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