The Church of England

#102
#102
OrangeTsar said:
I think the issue here is how we are defining the word „bless“. If we mean a sincerely wish and prayer for one‘s health and happiness in life, I don’t think many people would object. If we mean a more formal invocation of God‘s sanction and grace on an activity then that would be expecting God to contradict Himself by condoning what He has forbidden. To do so would be to be no longer God
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So then no? No scripture against "prayers of blessing" for sinners?
 
#104
#104
n_huffhines said:
Again, can anybody point to the Bible teaching that says don't bless gays (or any type of sinner) or welcome them to church. If you can't, don't respond. I'm not looking for 500 words of deflection again.
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1. It's abundantly clear from the letters of St. Paul and the ancient disciplinary canons of the Church that homosexual acts are among the mortal sins. (If you doubt the truth of my assertion, but you're willing to examine the evidence in good faith, I'll gladly send citations).

2. There is no precedent in Holy Scripture of any sinner being given a blessing qua sinner. (It's logically impossible to prove a negative, so the onus is on you to find an example to the contrary.)

3. There are no liturgical prayers in the tradition of the Church blessing any sinner qua sinner. (Again, it's logically impossible to prove a negative, so the onus is on you to find an example to the contrary.)

4. No one has said that those engaged in sin, including those engaged in homosexual acts, should not be welcomed to church. If you object to this assertion, you'll have to define what you mean by "welcome." If by "welcome" you mean admission to Holy Communion and the priesthood, these things are explicitly forbidden in Holy Scripture and in the ancient disciplinary canons of the Church. (Again, if you doubt the truth of my assertion, but you're willing to examine the evidence in good faith, I'll send citations).

5. Given what you've written so far in this thread, it's difficult for me to believe that you're interested in discussing this topic in good faith. I've written this reply, however, in the hope that I may be wrong about your intentions and that, if I'm not wrong, it may at least be of use to someone else here.
 
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#108
#108
GroverCleveland said:
Visit a mosque. Not much in the way of liberal thought there along these lines.
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Liberal their thought is not, but their sexual ethics are vastly different from those of the Christians (one could argue that, in certain respects, their doctrine has some affinity with certain ideas of the sexual revolution).
 
#110
#110
GroverCleveland said:
Catholic friends of mine are becoming unenchanted with things in their church. Good friend of mine has even recently allowed he is about done with the current Pope and this guy is/was about as solid a Catholic as anyone I've ever known.
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It wasn’t all the pedophile priests, child rape and coverups?
 
#113
#113
OrangeTsar said:
Like I say, check the stats on public schools and tell me why people want to send their kids THERE.
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Groomers groomers everywhere. Meanwhile in Wyoming there’s Republican outrage at a bill that would RAISE the legal age of marriage to 16.
 
#114
#114
VolinMichigan said:
Groomers groomers everywhere. Meanwhile in Wyoming there’s Republican outrage at a bill that would RAISE the legal age of marriage to 16.
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Those EVIL Republicans. Gosh darn it if they aren’t the seat of all evil in the world. How will we EVER survive?????? Head for the hills folks (or Canada).
 
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#115
#115
OrangeTsar said:
Those EVIL Republicans. Gosh darn it if they aren’t the seat of all evil in the world. How will we EVER survive?????? Head for the hills folks (or Canada).
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I mean I’d consider it if some Wyoming farmer wanted to buy my daughter as his child bride.
 
#116
#116
DuckInAPen said:
Liberal their thought is not, but their sexual ethics are vastly different from those of the Christians (one could argue that, in certain respects, their doctrine has some affinity with certain ideas of the sexual revolution).
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I admit openly and without shame I am unfamiliar with the vagaries of Muslim sexual ethics. I can only speak to what I heard when visiting a mosque, at the invite of a friend and curiosity, not long after Obergefell. So I really can only speak about what I heard at one mosque. For all I know, the rest could be celebrating same-sex marriage with wild abandon, although I have strong doubts that is the case.
 
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#120
#120
GroverCleveland said:
I admit openly and without shame I am unfamiliar with the vagaries of Muslim sexual ethics. I can only speak to what I heard when visiting a mosque, at the invite of a friend and curiosity, not long after Obergefell. So I really can only what I heard at one mosque. For all I know, the rest could be celebrating same-sex marriage with wild abandon, although I have strong doubts that is the case.
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I have in mind such things as men being permitted four wives, no-fault divorce (for men), unlimited remarriages after divorce, temporary "pleasure marriages" (among the Shi'ites and some Sunnites), and the fleshly conception of paradise (including the reward of houri). The Islamic concept of chastity is fundamentally different from what Christ has taught us.
 
#124
#124
The majority of national Anglican Church bodies are walking away as predicted

Maybe upwards of 100 million Anglicans, mostly in Africa just told the Archbishop of Canterbury that they no longer recognize his authority
 
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#125
#125
OrangeTsar said:
The majority of national Anglican Church bodies are walking away as predicted

Maybe upwards of 100 million Anglicans, mostly in Africa just told the Archbishop of Canterbury that they no longer recognize his authority
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Good, centralized religious authority is not a good thing.
 
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