The Democratic Party cheated the 2020 election

#376
#376
evillawyer said:
Republicans are fundamentally a minority party and anti-democratic. They can't win if eligible voters vote in high numbers. So they do all they can to limit voting. They've made that abundantly clear with their actions, from gerrymandering to voter roll purges.
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They're definitely not anti-democratic but you may be right that they are a minority. My guess is because they're the adults in the room that don't give out goodies for votes such as student loan forgiveness. Republicans make you eat your vegetables and most voters want goodies from their gov't
 
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#377
#377
turbovol said:
Signature verification is a dangerous joke--something Republicans ginned up to cheat people out of their votes. Anybody who thinks real people are supposed to sit down and examine ballots one by one to compare the signatures of voters is insane: I can't think of a more absurd idea. It would take forevever and there would be a million bad decisions, as people don't sign their names the same way every time. And if a computer did it you'd have the same problem.

At the end of the day it's up to state election officials to attest to the validity of votes. If they are satisfied, then we all should be satisfied. Everyone has always been satisfied except for the hanging chad fiasco in Florida--and the corrupt Supreme Court decision that followed--that surely cheated Al Gore out of the presidency. You want a real stolen election? That was surely it. There should have been a full recount and there wasn't. Of course the punch-hole ballot was a stupid idea to begin with--and then to not count hanging chads because they weren't fully punched and dropped when it was obvious who the citizen was voting for was a freakin' disgrace--real cheating.

There are imperfections in our system, to be sure, starting with the fact that states use different voting procedures--but at the end of the days we've all accepted the outcomes until the vile, corrupt gangster came along and further poisoned itsy bitsy MAGA brains.
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We actually agree that signatures change and their use is absurd. What you are pushing is voting anytime, anywhere, as often as desired, and with no verification. What you are advocating is voting without eligibility or without having to prove eligibility plain and simple. Funny that just when having to show identification to vote finally was in place, it was overruled by a "crisis". Get over the nonsense that positive identification is in place to prevent people from voting; it's a BS argument, and you know it.
 
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#378
#378
BenGrimm said:
Funny it’s been used in deep red Utah without any complaints for a decade. Vote by mail leaned red in FL too until 2020. Not a peep from the critics for years.

In the case of errant ballots sent to an address, the fraudster would have to know what the signature of that person looks like in order to forge it. Then you are talking about multiple forgeries good enough to pass verification. Also, said voters are tracked to ensure multiple votes for one person weren’t cast OR that they don’t cast one by mail then try to show up in person for a second vote. In which case the fraudster would have to hope the real person didn’t also cast a ballot and their signature looked better than the real persons.

While I do agree that voter rolls need to be updated on a regular basis I don’t see it as some massive problem that can swing an election. Not as much as purges that prevent eligible voters from casting a ballot without any notification.

PA recently enacted automatic voter registration when you get your ID updated. Seems like a small but simple step any state could take to keep their rolls up to date.
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Did you really stop to consider any of the nonsense you posted?

Question: If you do happen to move and change ID (presumably you mean a drivers license since we don't require people to carry state or federal identification papers), do you think they automatically delete the old voter registration when they create a new one??????????????? Any number of us here can tell you that registering one place does not take your name off the voter roll elsewhere.
 
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#379
#379
AM64 said:
Did you really stop to consider any of the nonsense you posted?

Question: If you do happen to move and change ID (presumably you mean a drivers license since we don't require people to carry state or federal identification papers), do you think they automatically delete the old voter registration when they create a new one??????????????? Any number of us here can tell you that registering one place does not take your name off the voter roll elsewhere.
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If you move instate it should update your profile. I know I am no longer on the roll for my previous address from 7 years ago.

Moving from state to state is another topic but again you are talking about fraudulent votes of someone either knowingly casting two votes in separate states (which is a crime), or someone else knowing an individual is no longer a state resident and casting a ballot in there name by forging their signature (also a crime) which would require them to know that person’s signature in order to attempt the forgery.

Could that happen? Sure. A few people get caught doing it in almost every election (in 2020 a few PO1135809 voters got caught). They get caught because there is a verification process.

Could 1 or two slip through? Perhaps. Enough to swing an election? Very doubtful.
 
#380
#380
BenGrimm said:
If you move instate it should update your profile. I know I am no longer on the roll for my previous address from 7 years ago.

Moving from state to state is another topic but again you are talking about fraudulent votes of someone either knowingly casting two votes in separate states (which is a crime), or someone else knowing an individual is no longer a state resident and casting a ballot in there name by forging their signature (also a crime) which would require them to know that person’s signature in order to attempt the forgery.

Could that happen? Sure. A few people get caught doing it in almost every election (in 2020 a few PO1135809 voters got caught). They get caught because there is a verification process.

Could 1 or two slip through? Perhaps. Enough to swing an election? Very doubtful.
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You still don't get it. This was about unsolicited ballots being mailed out to everybody, and many extras went out because voter rolls don't get purged like they should. There is no clearinghouse that checks to remove someone when he registers in another location - one problem. Most people who move never give a thought to deregistering; they are too busy to think of something like that - another problem. When a locality does get around to purging voters (generally because they didn't vote for x number of years), people like you go nuts and claim discrimination - another problem.

There were a ton of unsolicited ballots mailed out; ballots that a voter who had moved would never have known about. Those could have been filled in by anyone and returned with the intended voter never having known. Signature verification is absurd and no way to identify the voter. There was too little time to put safeguards in place IF the people pushing mail in voting even wanted safeguards. I doubt just like you that many people are enrolled multiple places and use the opportunity, but the 2020 election was flawed in so many ways. Nobody running the show ever wants voting fraud to be uncovered, and it won't be if the right questions aren't asked and tracked down.
 
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#381
#381
hUTch2002 said:
But you're assuming where those 3rd party votes went and that they followed the norm from prior elections. They clearly didn't. Those voters that normally went 3rd party were likely turned off by Trump and voted Biden this time. You're overcomplicating it.
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Again, it's the point I've been making all along, Trump didn't lose because of cheating but he lost because normal R leaning constituencies such as Suburban voters and Libertarians voted against him in an unprecedented manner...He underperformed nearly every other R in those areas that ultimately decided the Presidency...

Had he performed in line with the average R in those districts, he's the POTUS today. Instead, his (just like Kari Lake 2 yrs later), performance was in the bottom 10% of Rs....
 
#382
#382
AM64 said:
You still don't get it. This was about unsolicited ballots being mailed out to everybody, and many extras went out because voter rolls don't get purged like they should. There is no clearinghouse that checks to remove someone when he registers in another location - one problem. Most people who move never give a thought to deregistering; they are too busy to think of something like that - another problem. When a locality does get around to purging voters (generally because they didn't vote for x number of years), people like you go nuts and claim discrimination - another problem.

There were a ton of unsolicited ballots mailed out; ballots that a voter who had moved would never have known about. Those could have been filled in by anyone and returned with the intended voter never having known. Signature verification is absurd and no way to identify the voter. There was too little time to put safeguards in place IF the people pushing mail in voting even wanted safeguards. I doubt just like you that many people are enrolled multiple places and use the opportunity, but the 2020 election was flawed in so many ways. Nobody running the show ever wants voting fraud to be uncovered, and it won't be if the right questions aren't asked and tracked down.
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It makes no difference if errant ballots were mailed out if they weren’t sent back in. If I get a ballot at my house for the previous resident there is no way I could haphazardly sign it and it get verified. It wouldn’t take a signature expert to tell difference UNLESS I had seen the previous resident’s signature to I could attempt to copy it.

Arizona has had early vote by mail for 30 years. Nearly 80% of voters used it in 2016. No one complained until PO1135809 lost. All of a sudden it’s full of fraud? Give me a break 🙄
 
#384
#384
BigOrangeTrain said:
Now we know why Biden and liberals get so much of the young “educated” votes. Because they are dumb. Higher education, especially the elite liberal ones, are worthless.

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You guys have hated bill for years and now you think he’s a genius. He still destroys both democrats and republicans, as he always has, but y’all love him because you get your news in a 4 second sound bite from a comedian.
 
#385
#385
BenGrimm said:
It makes no difference if errant ballots were mailed out if they weren’t sent back in. If I get a ballot at my house for the previous resident there is no way I could haphazardly sign it and it get verified. It wouldn’t take a signature expert to tell difference UNLESS I had seen the previous resident’s signature to I could attempt to copy it.

Arizona has had early vote by mail for 30 years. Nearly 80% of voters used it in 2016. No one complained until PO1135809 lost. All of a sudden it’s full of fraud? Give me a break 🙄
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Without ballot tracking can you verify that those extra ballots sent out were now sent back in?
 
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#387
#387
whodeycin85 said:
Without ballot tracking can you verify that those extra ballots sent out were now sent back in?
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I'm in favor of some form of ballot tracking in the future just to silence the speculation that anything significantly wrong occurs. Avoid the whining from either side that they were cheated.

There is no evidence of any sort of widespread problem in the past that could even come close to changing a result, including 2020, and those outright guessing as to such just look more and more ridiculous with every month that goes by with no proof of anything, really.
 
#388
#388
whodeycin85 said:
Without ballot tracking can you verify that those extra ballots sent out were now sent back in?
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How it is conducted in each state is different but in AZ you can check online when and where your ballot was sent and when it was received back.

So if you moved in state you can see if your ballot was sent to your previous address by mistake and if someone else sent it back in.

TN has a similar tool for absentee ballots.

The difference between AZ and TN, the former has a one-time opt-in for early vote by mail without having to request it each time. So if someone opted in for early voting in 2012 they will then receive a ballot each election. If they move and they don’t get their ballot then they can track where it went and request another to the proper address.

This was all set up by Republican state legislature nearly 30 years ago and even expanded upon by Republicans. It wasn’t an issue until they started losing in the state.
 
#389
#389
ClearwaterVol said:
You guys have hated bill for years and now you think he’s a genius. He still destroys both democrats and republicans, as he always has, but y’all love him because you get your news in a 4 second sound bite from a comedian.
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He's not partisan to either side. I respect that and I think we need more of that in America today. What do you think?
 
#390
#390
BenGrimm said:
How it is conducted in each state is different but in AZ you can check online when and where your ballot was sent and when it was received back.

So if you moved in state you can see if your ballot was sent to your previous address by mistake and if someone else sent it back in.

TN has a similar tool for absentee ballots.

The difference between AZ and TN, the former has a one-time opt-in for early vote by mail without having to request it each time. So if someone opted in for early voting in 2012 they will then receive a ballot each election. If they move and they don’t get their ballot then they can track where it went and request another to the proper address.

This was all set up by Republican state legislature nearly 30 years ago and even expanded upon by Republicans. It wasn’t an issue until they started losing in the state.
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But if u dont personally check to see if a ballot came to your once address, how does anyone know if out was sent back in? And with weak signature verification rules makes it easy to do.
 
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#391
#391
lawgator1 said:
I'm in favor of some form of ballot tracking in the future just to silence the speculation that anything significantly wrong occurs. Avoid the whining from either side that they were cheated.

There is no evidence of any sort of widespread problem in the past that could even come close to changing a result, including 2020, and those outright guessing as to such just look more and more ridiculous with every month that goes by with no proof of anything, really.
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AZ signature verification cases that are proving the election committee ignored thirt own laws... same issues in GA, MI...3 swing states.
 
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#394
#394
whodeycin85 said:
AZ signature verification cases that are proving the election committee ignored thirt own laws... same issues in GA, MI...3 swing states.
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No evidence it mattered. That has always been the main shortcoming. Absent evidence it was reasonably likely to have changed a result it is a fool's errand.
 
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#396
#396
whodeycin85 said:
But if u dont personally check to see if a ballot came to your once address, how does anyone know if out was sent back in? And with weak signature verification rules makes it easy to do.
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My signature never looks the same. GOP just trying to frustrate voters into not voting.
 
#400
#400
ClearwaterVol said:
I disagree. I don't feel like going and wasting a couple hours to vote when there are easier ways to do it.
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If you don't care enough to spend a couple hours voting then you shouldn't vote.

People will wait in line 30 minutes for a crappy coffee but HOLY Chit once a year (or 4) you have to wait in line to exercise your franchise.
 
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