The (many) indictments of Donald Trump

[RockyTop85]

What do you make of this one? Or is it too early.

Haven’t read it, yet. Don’t know much about TN RICO law, much less Georgia. Doubt I’ll have much in the way of original thoughts on the law of this one, either.

My thoughts on the Smith indictment and the entire course of conduct from November to January remains unchanged: some of what happened ought to be criminalized. I won’t be that surprised if existing statutes turn out to not cover it. I’m torn about whether or not it’s worth testing that on a likely nominee, but also I want people who might be tempted to do this same sheisty stuff in 2024 to have concerns about whether it is legal and whether they will be punished.

 

[GAVol]

I believe that Trump announced his candidacy as soon as he did, because he wanted to have the "They are just doing this, because I'm running for President," response ready.

So ... I guess we are both pretending that we have the ability to read minds? Aren't we fortunate.

It's about as easy as reading a STOP sign in both cases.

 

[GVF]

You know how Trump could have avoided this mess? Acted like every other losing presidential candidate in this nation's history -- admit defeat and leave with dignity.

It would have been more easily, and ethically, averted if the left didn't start targeting him for impeachment before he was even sworn in, and just ACCEPTED the FACT they LOST that election cycle. THe only true crime Trump really committed was lowering himself to their tactics. Does Hills still not say she really won in 2016?? Is that not another way of saying 2016 was rigged?

 

[Septic]

The ones who actually stole it will never be held accountable

Well, when your only proof is butthurt, twitter rants and crackpot attorneys, you get what you get.

Hillary called his fat orange ass out in 2016 - he'd never accept defeat, never. He brainwashed you into believing he couldn't be defeated, and you bought it. Most cult leaders are very convincing like that. I'm just thankful Heaven's Gate didn't get their hooks into you.

 

[GAVol]

You know how Trump could have avoided this mess? Acted like every other losing presidential candidate in this nation's history -- admit defeat and leave with dignity.

I'm not sure his conduct was the last straw. He's still a threat either way and an overzealous prosecutor was going to come after him.

 

[Septic]

It would have been more easily, and ethically, averted if the left didn't start targeting him for impeachment before he was even sworn in, and just ACCEPTED the FACT they LOST that election cycle. THe only true crime Trump really committed was lowering himself to their tactics. Does Hills still not say she really won in 2016??

If any of the 91 charges stick and he's convicted, will you continue to believe that he's innocent and simply a victim?

 

[Majors]

How was that a jab at blue collar workers? I said he strikes me as a person who has spent his life at the smartest on the garbage truck.

You chose to go city worker/contracted trash collector and not say Atlanta area public school teacher. Like I said, the liberal arrogance flows freely.

 

[BowlBrother85]

I have seen nothing debunking the videos of Ruby Freeman.


https://www.oann.com/newsroom/dershowitz-the-4th-trump-indictment-is-very-very-dangerous/


45th President Donald Trump was indicted for the fourth time Monday night on a slew of charges in relation to alleged attempts to overturn the 2020 election results.

“This indictment is very, very dangerous,” criminal defense attorney Alan Dershowitz told One America News.​

“This changes the rules of the game,” Dershowitz said. “This basically says RICO is not just applicable to organized crime or to organized, commercial crime with hierarchies, but it also applies to protests against election results. It’s going to deter and chill people from challenging legitimate election results.”​

​

The 98-page indictment claims Trump worked with his alleged co-conspirators to “unlawfully change the outcome of the election in favor of Trump.”

But Dershowitz points out that it is not illegal to challenge the results of elections.

“Let’s remember, we have a process for challenging elections,” Dershowitz said. “It involves alternate electors. It involves going to court. What this indictment basically says is if you do that, we’re going to indict you.”​

You linked an article to OAN in this post, supporting your contention that Ruby Freeman and her daughter Shaye Moss, rigged the state of Georgia against Donald Trump.

Are you aware that Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss sued OAN for defamation as a result of their reporting, and OAN settled with Freeman and Moss out of court, while admitting that neither Freeman or Moss were guilty of election fraud?

OAN Dismissed From Ga. Election Workers' Suit After Settlement | Daily Report

https://truthout.org/articles/far-r...on-officials-didnt-steal-election-from-trump/

I will be posting several more links to articles which de-bunk the theory that Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss were guilty of election fraud ... as Donald Trump and Rudy Giuliani falsely claimed.

 

[GVF]

Probably because you live in a right wing echo chamber and are searching on places such as OAN.

Look ... Giuliani has admitted that they were lies, but if you want me to post proof here, I will post links. I just don't think you will ever click on them. You don't want to know the truth. You only want an echo chamber.

I'm sure there is a letter of immunity tucked away somewhere for him to all of a sudden say my bad, we lied.

 

[jmacvols1]

You linked an article to OAN in this post, supporting your contention that Ruby Freeman and her daughter Shaye Moss, rigged the state of Georgia against Donald Trump.

Are you aware that Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss sued OAN for defamation as a result of their reporting, and OAN settled with Freeman and Moss out of court, while admitting that neither Freeman or Moss were guilty of election fraud?

OAN Dismissed From Ga. Election Workers' Suit After Settlement | Daily Report

https://truthout.org/articles/far-r...on-officials-didnt-steal-election-from-trump/

I will be posting several more links to articles which de-bunk the theory that Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss were guilty of election fraud ... as Donald Trump and Rudy Giuliani falsely claimed.

THe link is to Dershowitz, a Democrat, and what he said about this sham indictment..

And what Giuliani says is of his own business and does not debunk the tapes of Ms Freeman. You seem to follow Giuliani more than I, what has he said about the tapes?

Here is what Trump has said:


Donald J. Trump

@realDonaldTrump


The Ruby Freeman tapes that I put up on Truth Social are AMAZING. Now they have been heard and seen all over America, together with the actual act of “stuffing the ballot boxes” with far more votes than needed for me, and Senator Perdue, to win GEORGIA. At first she thought that they had been caught, got VERY nervous, and wanted to “spill the beans” on everyone. Then the SOS, GBI, FBI, calmed her down, helped CLEAN her social media, took her away (for two months!). SHE THEN CHANGED HER STORY!

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Jan 04, 2023, 5:43 AM

 

[Septic]

I'm sure there is a letter of immunity tucked away somewhere for him to all of a sudden say my bad, we lied.

Rudy flip on Trump?

 

[GVF]

If any of the 91 charges stick and he's convicted, will you continue to believe that he's innocent and simply a victim?

If he had been treated as a duely elected sitting president, none of this would have ever transpired. I was not claiming innocence or guilt. I was claiming bulls**t. But, they all better start wiping their email servers cause once this is done, none of them have safety anymore.

 

[GVF]

Rudy flip on Trump?

Sure. He's a snake. Mayor of NYC = Head Mobster.

 

[Orangeburst]

Because he "sticks it to the libs."

That's it.

nope. i liked much of his policy.

 

[Septic]

If he had been treated as a duely elected sitting president, none of this would have ever transpired. I was claiming innocence or guilt. I was claiming bulls**t. But, they all better start wiping there email servers cause once this is done, none of them have safety anymore.

I'm not sure that answers my question.

If he's convicted, will you believe it's because the evidence was there, or will you continue to believe he's a victim?

Is there a scenario where you finally believe he's guilty as charged?

I ask because it's starting to feel like there's no chance the Trump faithful will ever turn their back on him, because doing so would be tantamount to admitting they were wrong.

 

[luthervol]

You chose to go city worker/contracted trash collector and not say Atlanta area public school teacher. Like I said, the liberal arrogance flows freely.

Arrogance? Please, don't be ignorant.

 

[Septic]

nope. i liked much of his policy.

I hear that a lot, like what? What policies did he implement that were game changers for you?

 

[hog88]

He can't. An outside shot of pardoning himself is his only lifeline.

The die has been cast.

These RICO charges appear to be something he can't have pardoned or commuted.

It must be particularly devastating for Rudy, he made a name for himself prosecuting RICO cases.

A president can't issue a pardon for state convictions.

 

[Septic]

A president can't issue a pardon for state convictions.

I'm aware, that's why I said that he can't have pardoned or commuted.

Though I can't imagine a scenario where a sitting president would be compelled to go to jail because of a State conviction.

By that same token, I also can't imagine why a criminally indicted person would be leading in the polls.

I wouldn't hire a guy to cut my grass if he was indicted for 91 felonies in four different jurisdictions.

 

[GVF]

I'm not sure that answers my question.

If he's convicted, will you believe it's because the evidence was there, or will you continue to believe he's a victim?

Is there a scenario where you finally believe he's guilty as charged?

I ask because it's starting to feel like there's no chance the Trump faithful will ever turn their back on him, because doing so would be tantamount to admitting they were wrong.

That's a loaded question. If everything GA has indicted him on looks like the 3 that were posted above, then BS. If they execute everything publically like they did, and show no integrity, like leaking the jury list, etc., then BS. So far they have been bumbling idiots, just like every other attempt on Trump. I'm not a Trump the person fanboy. But, I do wish he and his policies were still running the country. Hard to say if he's ever guilty or not. Prisons are full innocent criminals wrongly convicted for courtroom stats.

 

[hog88]

If any of the 91 charges stick and he's convicted, will you continue to believe that he's innocent and simply a victim?

It will be years before we know if these charges and/or convictions will stick.

 

[Orangeburst]

A president can't issue a pardon for state convictions.

it is argued this isnt even the jurisdiction of a county DA.

 

[LadyVolette]

You are wrong ... but I realize that you don't care.

Okay I’m always nice.. that went south quick

 

[Septic]

That's a loaded question. If everything GA has indicted him on looks like the 3 that were posted above, then BS. If they execute everything publically like they did, and show no integrity, like leaking the jury list, etc., then BS. So far they have been bumbling idiots, just like every other attempt on Trump. I'm not a Trump the person fanboy. But, I do wish he and his policies were still running the country. Hard to say if he's ever guilty or not. Prisons are full innocent criminals wrongly convicted for courtroom stats.

It's not loaded.

I'm simply asking if there's any scenario that would convince you he's not a victim? It's a simple yes or no answer - you seem to be offering up excuses why you wouldn't.

If the evidence is there and he's convicted in a court of law, will you accept it?

 

[GVF]

I'm aware, that's why I said that he can't have pardoned or commuted.

Though I can't imagine a scenario where a sitting president would be compelled to go to jail because of a State conviction.

By that same token, I also can't imagine why a criminally indicted person would be leading in the polls.

I wouldn't hire a guy to cut my grass if he was indicted for 91 felonies in four different jurisdictions.

Track record. The entire "we'll get Trump if it's the last thing we do" saga that started before he moved into the WH, is taken straight from the story of the boy who cried wolf. In the end it matters not if he is guilty of any one single thing, no one is going to believe it cause it all still comes from the same boy that is still crying wolf.