The murder of Ahmaud Arbery

#1,101
#1,101
bamawriter said:
In all likelihood, Arbery wouldn't have done so. But one way or the other, there isn't a scintilla of physical evidence that links Arbery with the thefts.
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I agree. Everything is very circumstantial. It’s possible he’s the wrong guy. He does have a theft charge from 2018 and it was a violation of his probation from a 2015 weapons charge. None of that means he’s guilty. But mixed in with the images of him on surveillance on the new construction property, it’s interesting for sure. I’d say it’s a coin flip as to if he’s the right guy or not. You 100% don’t kill a guy based on a hunch. Granted I don’t think that was their intentional intent.
 
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#1,102
#1,102
Vol8188 said:
I agree. Everything is very circumstantial. It’s possible he’s the wrong guy. He does have a theft charge from 2018 and it was a violation of his probation from a 2015 weapons charge. None of that means he’s guilty. But mixed in with the images of him on surveillance on the new construction property, it’s interesting for sure. I’d say it’s a coin flip as to if he’s the right guy or not. You 100% don’t kill a guy based on a hunch. Granted I don’t think that was their intentional intent.
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I don't think they set out with the intent to kill Arbery, but I also don't think intent really matters here. I suppose it matters when it comes to the charge, but not when it comes to determining criminal responsibility.
 
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#1,103
#1,103
Rickyvol77 said:
Do you have evidence he ever pointed the gun at Arbery? or are you fantasizing about what you "think probably happened"
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just pause it at 11 seconds. The man is clearly outside the truck and has a certain stance. If that still can be cleaned up, I think you might find the gun pointed in the direction of the victim who immediately cuts right.
 
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#1,105
#1,105
ClearwaterVol said:
just pause it at 11 seconds. The man is clearly outside the truck and has a certain stance. If that still can be cleaned up, I think you might find the gun pointed in the direction of the victim who immediately cuts right.
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And if not?
 
#1,106
#1,106
Vol8188 said:
And if not?
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If not the case is more circumstantial regarding whether the gun was actually pointed. However, pointing the gun is icing on the cake because the shooter has admitted to attempting to make a citizens arrest for which he has no justification. The other yahoo who called 911 has said they were in "hot pursuit." When the shooter is chasing you and gets out of a truck to confront you holding a shotgun... I think it is reasonable to be in fear of your own life.
 
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#1,107
#1,107
Vol8188 said:
Can you explain the significance to me?
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If I'm in Arbery's shoes, I'd consider the two guys pulling up next to me and shouting at me to be much less threatening than them creating a half-assed blockade and waiting on me with guns drawn. Not sure he could have even known they were armed if all they did was pull up and yell at him.

Perhaps you disagree. But it doesn't matter what you or I would find more threatening, but what an average person could reasonably consider more threatening. I don't think you'd argue that such a thought would be unreasonable.
 
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#1,109
#1,109
bamawriter said:
I don't think they set out with the intent to kill Arbery, but I also don't think intent really matters here. I suppose it matters when it comes to the charge, but not when it comes to determining criminal responsibility.
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Exactly. My hope is these guys plead out and spare everyone the discord and violence that is going to occur because of their idiotic actions.
 
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#1,110
#1,110
bamawriter said:
If I'm in Arbery's shoes, I'd consider the two guys pulling up next to me and shouting at me to be much less threatening than them creating a half-assed blockade and waiting on me with guns drawn. Not sure he could have even known they were armed if all they did was pull up and yell at him.

Perhaps you disagree. But it doesn't matter what you or I would find more threatening, but what an average person could reasonably consider more threatening. I don't think you'd argue that such a thought would be unreasonable.
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I think the distance most anyone would agree is less threatening especially given that they let him close the distance. If someone is threatening your life, it’s unlikely they’d allow you to run at them for 30 yards and then get your hands on their weapon. I think that negates the threat.
 
#1,112
#1,112
Bigun said:
Exactly. My hope is these guys plead out and spare everyone the discord and violence that is going to occur because of their idiotic actions.
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Crystal ball hot take: They won't plead, it'll go to trial. They'll probably get off and the black community will freak out and the racists will be all:


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Rinse and repeat.
 
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#1,113
#1,113
Vol8188 said:
I think the distance most anyone would agree is less threatening especially given that they let him close the distance. If someone is threatening your life, it’s unlikely they’d allow you to run at them for 30 yards and then get your hands on their weapon. I think that negates the threat.
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Except that Arbery clearly still tried to initially avoid a confrontation. He ran to the side of the truck opposite the driver. If the driver had stayed where he was, I have a tough time believing that a physicial confrontation ever occurs.

All of this is amplified if the filming car was also involved in the pursuit. If Arbery was caught between the proverbial rock and a hard place, then the whole situation is exponentially more threatening.
 
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#1,114
#1,114
bamawriter said:
Except that Arbery clearly still tried to initially avoid a confrontation. He ran to the side of the truck opposite the driver. If the driver had stayed where he was, I have a tough time believing that a physicial confrontation ever occurs.

All of this is amplified if the filming car was also involved in the pursuit. If Arbery was caught between the proverbial rock and a hard place, then the whole situation is exponentially more threatening.
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100% agree with the last
 
#1,115
#1,115
bamawriter said:
Except that Arbery clearly still tried to initially avoid a confrontation. He ran to the side of the truck opposite the driver. If the driver had stayed where he was, I have a tough time believing that a physicial confrontation ever occurs.

All of this is amplified if the filming car was also involved in the pursuit. If Arbery was caught between the proverbial rock and a hard place, then the whole situation is exponentially more threatening.
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I don't understand why he cut back to the left in front of the truck where the guy was with the gun.

It seemed to me from my view that he was running on the left side of the road, saw the guy with the gun standing in the road in his path then cut to the right behind the truck and looked as though he was headed that way, then for some reason cut back to the left in front of the truck where he knew the guy with the gun was.
 
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#1,117
#1,117
Septic said:
Crystal ball hot take: They won't plead, it'll go to trial. They'll probably get off and the black community will freak out and the racists will be all:


giphy.gif




Rinse and repeat.
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I don't think the son that fired the weapon will get off. At least manslaughter considering there was a struggle for the weapon. But if he does get off, Katie bar the door. Wonder how the father will be charged, if at all. Accessory?
 
#1,118
#1,118
Vol737 said:
I don't think the son that fired the weapon will get off. At least manslaughter considering there was a struggle for the weapon. But if he does get off, Katie bar the door. Wonder how the father will be charged, if at all. Accessory?
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It comes down to who is blamed for the struggle for the weapon

The father didnt even get his gun out of the holster until Arbery attacked his son
 
#1,119
#1,119
Behr said:
I don't understand why he cut back to the left in front of the truck where the guy was with the gun.

It seemed to me from my view that he was running on the left side of the road, saw the guy with the gun standing in the road in his path then cut to the right behind the truck and looked as though he was headed that way, then for some reason cut back to the left in front of the truck where he knew the guy with the gun was.
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That's where I think we will see the struggle between voluntary/involuntary manslaughter and 2nd degree murder. The fact that it looks like Arbery initiated the struggle for the weapon makes things sketchy, IMO.
 
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#1,120
#1,120
Vol737 said:
That's where I think we will see the struggle between voluntary/involuntary manslaughter and 2nd degree murder. The fact that it looks like Arbery initiated the struggle for the weapon makes things sketchy, IMO.
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Yea, I guess in my mind there had to be a reason he decided to change directions and run towards a guy with a gun, other than because he was stupid.
 
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#1,123
#1,123
Matt2496 said:
Also, a truck with 2 armed guys standing in it, and you run right towards it?

How brain-dead must one be to do something like that?

So much stupidity to go around.
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Something I've noticed, is that for all Arbery knew, the guys in the van actually filming the ordeal could've been "in" on the ambush. Maybe he ran towards the white truck because he saw it as a choice between 2 evils.

Just spitballing here
 
#1,124
#1,124
ClearwaterVol said:
sick and tired of being chased by armed vigilantes and saw it as his best chance?
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The dumbest thing someone could do imo is run at a person holding a gun. Maybe if you're in an enclosed area or somewhere where no escape is possible, but he's outside. The whole neighborhood is an escape route.
 
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