The murder of Ahmaud Arbery

#2,226
#2,226
1972 Grad said:
Number one, I wouldn't have been armed. Number two, if I was armed and was being beaten and that person was trying to take my gun away, I would probably shoot him because I would think he might shoot me with it if he got ahold of it.
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Exactly the point
 
#2,228
#2,228
82_VOL_83 said:
Would you initiate the issue though? Would you follow someone down the street or actually block them with a drawn gun? Everything that I have learned in my self defense classes says you can't do that. If you approach a situation with a firearm drawn, you are AN aggressor at that point. Maybe not the bad guy, but you are escalating the confrontation by having a drawn firearm.
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No to both questions.
 
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#2,229
#2,229
Rickyvol77 said:
if that kid had matched the description told to them by neighbors of the recent thefts in the neighborhood, i don't think it would matter what color he was...they would've tried the exact same thing
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And if they were acting off what they were told by neighbors, it'd be 100% illegal for them to attempt to detain him.
 
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#2,230
#2,230
1972 Grad said:
Number one, I wouldn't have been armed. Number two, if I was armed and was being beaten and that person was trying to take my gun away, I would probably shoot him because I would think he might shoot me with it if he got ahold of it.
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#2a - You wouldn't end up exposed, standing in the street like Buford Pusser with an unpredictable person walking toward you.
 
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#2,232
#2,232
GAVol said:
#2a - You wouldn't end up exposed, standing in the street like Buford Pusser with an unpredictable person walking toward you.
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Nope. Like I said, all parties deserve some blame. It took all of them to get the result. I do not think that they guy would have been shot if he hadn't gone all gangster on the shooter. I do not believe that he would have been shot if the shooter didn't go all Charles Bronson "Death Wish" on the victim.
 
#2,236
#2,236
82_VOL_83 said:
Would you initiate the issue though? Would you follow someone down the street or actually block them with a drawn gun? Everything that I have learned in my self defense classes says you can't do that. If you approach a situation with a firearm drawn, you are AN aggressor at that point. Maybe not the bad guy, but you are escalating the confrontation by having a drawn firearm.
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In theory there is some cover to be had under GA law regarding such actions.

GA 17-4-60
A private person may arrest an offender if the offense is committed in his presence or within his immediate knowledge. If the offense is a felony and the offender is escaping or attempting to escape, a private person may arrest him upon reasonable and probable grounds of suspicion.

What's really at issue though is it's more than a little iffy the requirements cited above were being met at the time of the incident which is exceedingly problematic for the McMichaels.
 
#2,237
#2,237
Septic said:
If your intent is to play the devil's advocate here, you're failing miserably. If you honestly believe that Arbery is at fault for fighting for his life during the commision of an aggravated assault felony against him, the failure is worse than the former.

Which is it?
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I don't know if I'd say he was at fault. He has the right to do what he thinks best in that situation.

But if he didn't run at the guy and try to take the shotgun, he'd probably still be alive. If they intended on shooting him from the get go I don't think they would have called they cops and I don't think they would have waited for him to rush them and actually have his hands on the shotgun. If they intended on shooting him I think it would have happened earlier when it wasn't such a risky setting as fighting for control of the shotgun.
 
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#2,238
#2,238
1972 Grad said:
I think you just want to think that anybody who doesn't see this as cold blooded racial murder is a racist. I see it as 2 cowboy vigilantes who shouldn't have been involved , and one of them getting attacked and possibly getting his gun taken away from him. If I was armed and somebody was beating on me and trying to take my gun away, I would probably shoot in order to stop him.
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If that's what you think you're as big of a joke as Ricky. Ive been clear about that from the beginning and Ricky knows it but still gives you a like.

Seems you and Ricky are fine with these white rednecks chasing them down a black guy and killing him for no reason.
 
#2,239
#2,239
TheDeeble said:
I don't know if I'd say he was at fault. He has the right to do what he thinks best in that situation.

But if he didn't run at the guy and try to take the shotgun, he'd probably still be alive. If they intended on shooting him from the get go I don't think they would have called they cops and I don't think they would have waited for him to rush them and actually have his hands on the shotgun. If they intended on shooting him I think it would have happened earlier when it wasn't such a risky setting as fighting for control of the shotgun.
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You are correct sir
 
#2,241
#2,241
Behr said:
If that's what you think you're as big of a joke as Ricky. Ive been clear about that from the beginning and Ricky knows it but still gives you a like.

Seems you and Ricky are fine with these white rednecks chasing them down a black guy and killing him for no reason.
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That is not what we are saying, why is it so hard for you to separate these two lines of thinking?

- The Mcmichaels acted foolish and shouldn't have been so gung-ho with their actions
- Arbery shouldn't have attempted to physically assault the son and attempt to take his shotgun

if McMichael Jr hadn't stepped out with the shotgun in hand (although we can't see from video if he ever pointed it at Arbery), he wouldnt be relying on a jury to test the Agg Assault charge which will either be dropped or convict him.

If Arbery hadn't cut back and ran 30 feet to assault McMichael, and attempt to steal his gun, there likely wouldve been no other outcome other than Arbery running away or the police arriving and figuring out the situation and this incident is NEVER heard of from any of us.
 
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#2,242
#2,242
Rickyvol77 said:
That is not what we are saying, why is it so hard for you to separate these two lines of thinking?

- The Mcmichaels acted foolish and shouldn't have been so gung-ho with their actions
- Arbery shouldn't have attempted to physically assault the son and attempt to take his shotgun

if McMichael Jr hadn't stepped out with the shotgun in hand (although we can't see from video if he ever pointed it at Arbery), he wouldnt be relying on a jury to test the Agg Assault charge which will either be dropped or convict him.

If Arbery hadn't cut back and ran 30 feet to assault McMichael, and attempt to steal his gun, there likely wouldve been no other outcome other than Arbery running away or the police arriving and figuring out the situation and this incident is NEVER heard of from any of us.
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Yea, I didn't read past "that's not what we're saying". You want to read what you want from my comments, I'll read what I want from yours.
 
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#2,245
#2,245
Rickyvol77 said:
That is not what we are saying, why is it so hard for you to separate these two lines of thinking?

- The Mcmichaels acted foolish and shouldn't have been so gung-ho with their actions
- Arbery shouldn't have attempted to physically assault the son and attempt to take his shotgun

if McMichael Jr hadn't stepped out with the shotgun in hand (although we can't see from video if he ever pointed it at Arbery), he wouldnt be relying on a jury to test the Agg Assault charge which will either be dropped or convict him.

If Arbery hadn't cut back and ran 30 feet to assault McMichael, and attempt to steal his gun, there likely wouldve been no other outcome other than Arbery running away or the police arriving and figuring out the situation and this incident is NEVER heard of from any of us.
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If Arbery had succeeded in taking the gun he would have been killed dead in his tracks by Billy Bob Sr.
 
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#2,246
#2,246
If I'm prosecuting this case, I make a big deal about the fact that McMichael didn't call 911 until he and his son were already in their truck chasing Arbery.

McMichael sees this dude running down the street, thinks he looks like the guy caught on his cameras who might have stolen stuff in the neighborhood, and rather than grabbing his cell and calling 911, his first instinct is to tell his son to arm up and jump in the truck to begin a vehicle-vs-pedestrian pursuit.
 
#2,247
#2,247
bamawriter said:
If I'm prosecuting this case, I make a big deal about the fact that McMichael didn't call 911 until he and his son were already in their truck chasing Arbery.

McMichael sees this dude running down the street, thinks he looks like the guy caught on his cameras who might have stolen stuff in the neighborhood, and rather than grabbing his cell and calling 911, his first instinct is to tell his son to arm up and jump in the truck to begin a vehicle-vs-pedestrian pursuit.
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and the first 911 call which apparently was the guy yelling at him at the house when Arbery ran away from the house? did you watch the entire video in the youtube link?

Arbery also wasn't jogging and looked around twice before sneaking into the house
 
#2,248
#2,248
Rickyvol77 said:
and the first 911 call which apparently was the guy yelling at him at the house when Arbery ran away from the house? did you watch the entire video in the youtube link?

Arbery also wasn't jogging and looked around twice before sneaking into the house
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I've acknowledged all of that.

I'm still waiting for someone to explain how it could possibly make a difference because the McMichaels did not know he had gone in that house.
 
#2,250
#2,250
Rickyvol77 said:


Interesting video
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Facts not emotions. He lays it out pretty straight but I'm sure there will be plenty of people who view this and vehemently disagree, and that is understandable.

The most important thing that he says is that nobody has all the facts yet and more will come out particularly as this case goes to trial.
 
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