The Official “Regular Posters of the Basketball Forum” Thread

#23,277
#23,277
orangemadam said:
He needs to stop trying to block the 3 pt shots. Blocking 1 in 50 does not compute well to continued tries
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He isn’t actively trying to block them. He is just closing out trying to speed up and change the natural angle of the shot.

But even though it was a super weak call and the guy flopped, he needs to be more careful not to touch them
 
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#23,279
#23,279
cncchris33 said:
Not a popular opinion, but one I think Barnes may be coming around to, himself.

Mashack doesn't need to be on the floor for 25-30 minutes a night. There, I said it.

I've felt this way for a while, but knew it wouldn't be met with a lot of support because people love the guy. I do, too. He plays hard, defends his guts out, but we are a team that so often struggles to score the ball. Just go back and watch Mizzou...they didn't even attempt to guard him outside of 20'. They just stuff off on him and essentially add an extra zone paint defender.

And as good of a defender as he is, we have plenty of good defenders. Chaz is the worst defender in that lineup without Shack, and even he isn't an embarrassment. We can live with one average defender if that guy is an offensive threat, which Chaz obviously is when he's working to get open looks.

Mashack was tied with Dubar with the lowest +/- at -7 last night if you need any indication of his overall contribution, and he actually gave us 7 points.

The only argument for him to continue starting is that if you replace him with Gainey, then you have zero scoring punch coming off the bench. Mashack, Phillips, Dubar, and Boswell don't provide much offense if that's all you have available.
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Agree all around. And much like bringing the offensive punch off the bench in Gainey, bringing shack back in for the 2nd half of each half as a defensive punch could add more juice, after letting the offensive lineup run teams ragged.
 
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#23,280
#23,280
cncchris33 said:
Not a popular opinion, but one I think Barnes may be coming around to, himself.

Mashack doesn't need to be on the floor for 25-30 minutes a night. There, I said it.

I've felt this way for a while, but knew it wouldn't be met with a lot of support because people love the guy. I do, too. He plays hard, defends his guts out, but we are a team that so often struggles to score the ball. Just go back and watch Mizzou...they didn't even attempt to guard him outside of 20'. They just stuff off on him and essentially add an extra zone paint defender.

And as good of a defender as he is, we have plenty of good defenders. Chaz is the worst defender in that lineup without Shack, and even he isn't an embarrassment. We can live with one average defender if that guy is an offensive threat, which Chaz obviously is when he's working to get open looks.

Mashack was tied with Dubar with the lowest +/- at -7 last night if you need any indication of his overall contribution, and he actually gave us 7 points.

The only argument for him to continue starting is that if you replace him with Gainey, then you have zero scoring punch coming off the bench. Mashack, Phillips, Dubar, and Boswell don't provide much offense if that's all you have available.
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Yup I think last nights game was night and day difference in how the offense look the second Mashack was taken out. Unfortunately he's kind of indecisive so throws wild passes and his shot is unreliable.

He can have magical defensive performances like a couple of times against bama last couple of years or Florida last week. But on a whole it's time to let Gainey close. I also think Dubar should lose his minutes. He does so many wild things and his FT shot looks like Shaq 2.0. Rotate Cade, Igor, Felix 4/5 slots. I'm ok with continuing to give Boswell minutes, seems to not make huge mistakes and plays within the system.
 
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#23,281
#23,281
bleedingTNorange said:
Yup.

1st half: 28-34
Mashack 19
Gainey 16
Lanier 14
Zeigler 14
Milicic 14
Okpara 12
Phillips 8
Dubar 3

2nd half: 57-47
Lanier 20
Zeigler 20
Milicic 18
Gainey 18
Okpara 15
Philips 5
Mashack 2
Boswell 2
Dubar 0



Final 18 minutes when Mashack sat we outscored them 57-42
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I am not picking a fight. I'm analytical. And I wear orange colored glasses. In fact, @bleedingTNorange is one of the few posters on here that has my unmitigated respect.
Just trying to look at the data and see if there are other potential 'explanations' that are possible.
The line-up against Missouri worked REALLY well. That IS indisputable. But it is not a forgone conclusion that it will work really well against every team. It might, I will grant that.
But now that we put it on display for 18 minutes ... which is a long length of time for scouts ... almost the entire 2nd half. All teams will be scouting it and looking for loop holes and things to exploit and various ways to counter it.
One of the biggest problems we could face with this lineup ... is going to be fouls ... you are not going to be able to keep that lineup on the floor ... if ZZ or Gainey or Igor or Chaz ... picks up two quick fouls.
Last night, we used it exclusively in the 2nd half of the game ... and our foul situation was favorable.

bleedingTNorange said:
Plus/minus can sometimes be a useless stat, especiallly for a singular game, but with a big sample size it’s usually pretty telling. In SEC play only, so 10 games…

Gainey has the team best at +65 and Mashack has the team worst at -15
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JM is great defensive with lots of steals per minute played ... which results is more offensive opportunities. But that has to be countered by the plus minus!!!
This is VERY telling.
Here is my postulation: Barnes told JM in post season 24, that one of his weaknesses was shooting the 3 ball.
Off season, he worked on it like a beast ... but they had to change his shot to improve his percentage.
He still reverts to old habits from time to time ... and the coaches remind him to fix it.
But taking a shot from the practice court into a game time situation ... is a lot like taking something from the golf range out on to the course .... it takes time. Sometimes, a long time.
And reworking a shot can mess with your shooting confidence in pressure situations. (JM looks reluctant to shoot the 3 ball - that is assuming he has the green light.)
I am proposing that they have left JM out there to try and get him to develop himself into a 3 level scorer.
But his mind is still stuck in the old habits and he does not naturally think score.

Coaches have one more think to consider: 'starting' vs 'coming off the bench.' We often overlook this ... and recklessly dismiss this with ..."they just need to suck it up."
Some people can do fine coming off the bench, in fact they excel at it. Others, see it as a demotion and it affects them mentally.
So, there is the psyche part of players ... to consider as well.

And Gainey, brings a dimension that nobody has ... he can drive off a screen back up and shoot the three ... or drive in and pull up and shoot the pullup in the lane ... or take it to the rim (my least favorite of his options - but he is getting fouled more, so ... I'm wavering).
And Igor added something unexpected ... he was taking to the rim with confidence, more than I remember in the past.
We can see the in season development in Igor, and Gainey, and also a little bit more is coming out in Chaz and Okpara.
I have no idea what Rick will do. In fact, I am excited to see. They typically change their offensive and defensive schemes every game ... so, who knows???
Just trying to offer up ... some other thoughts that may play into the lineup decisions. So, we are not overly critical of a hall of fame's coaching decisions. :^))))))
 
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#23,282
#23,282
bleedingTNorange said:
I would stick with the same starting 5, but I would be handling substitutions in the first half much like they did the 2nd half last night. Mashack comes out early for Gainey and that lineup rides for awhile, Mashack can then get in there and give most of those guys a blow as he’s versatile.
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Would not surprise me in the least. WELL SAID.
 
#23,283
#23,283
Chaz-Vol said:
Yup I think last nights game was night and day difference in how the offense look the second Mashack was taken out. Unfortunately he's kind of indecisive so throws wild passes and his shot is unreliable.

He can have magical defensive performances like a couple of times against bama last couple of years or Florida last week. But on a whole it's time to let Gainey close. I also think Dubar should lose his minutes. He does so many wild things and his FT shot looks like Shaq 2.0. Rotate Cade, Igor, Felix 4/5 slots. I'm ok with continuing to give Boswell minutes, seems to not make huge mistakes and plays within the system.
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I’m fine with us using Stone like last night/how we have a few times this season: toss him out there in the 1H if we are struggling or someone needs a 60-90 second break before a TV TO. If he’s got it - great! If he doesn’t knock down a quick shot - take him out. He can absolutely win us games if he gets hot, but I don’t see his as someone that’s gonna give us 10+ mins consistently (not that anyone thinks that).
 
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#23,284
#23,284
On the season Zeigler, Lanier, Mashack, Milicic and Okpara have played together for 174 total minutes and have a total plus minus of +47.

The lineup of Zeigler, Gainey, Lanier, Milicic and Okpara have played together for 89 total minutes and have a total plus minus of +66.

So nearly 3x better/more efficient in total has the lineup with Gainey been.
 
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#23,285
#23,285
bleedingTNorange said:
On the season Zeigler, Lanier, Mashack, Milicic and Okpara have played together for 174 total minutes and have a total plus minus of +47.

The lineup of Zeigler, Gainey, Lanier, Milicic and Okpara have played together for 89 total minutes and have a total plus minus of +66.

So nearly 3x better/more efficient in total has the lineup with Gainey been.
Click to expand...

Does what app show the opponent for the distribution of minutes?
 
#23,287
#23,287
Chaz-Vol said:
Yup I think last nights game was night and day difference in how the offense look the second Mashack was taken out. Unfortunately he's kind of indecisive so throws wild passes and his shot is unreliable.

He can have magical defensive performances like a couple of times against bama last couple of years or Florida last week. But on a whole it's time to let Gainey close. I also think Dubar should lose his minutes. He does so many wild things and his FT shot looks like Shaq 2.0. Rotate Cade, Igor, Felix 4/5 slots. I'm ok with continuing to give Boswell minutes, seems to not make huge mistakes and plays within the system.
Click to expand...
I’m surprised some folks post favorably about Dubar’s play. It’s shocking he averaged 18 last season and shot 40% from 3 then produces nothing this season. The team and Barnes continue to make positive comments about Dubar in interviews so maybe he’s going to light it up and win us a game this year….we can hope anyway.
 
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#23,288
#23,288
walkenvol said:
I’m surprised some folks post favorably about Dubar’s play. It’s shocking he averaged 18 last season and shot 40% from 3 then produces nothing this season. The team and Barnes continue to make positive comments about Dubar in interviews so maybe he’s going to light it up and win us a game this year….we can hope anyway.
Click to expand...

He has demonstrated some good vision and found cutters and thrown some sharp passes. He might prove to be a good zone breaker because it wouldn’t shock me to start seeing some zone played against us
 
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#23,289
#23,289
bleedingTNorange said:
On the season Zeigler, Lanier, Mashack, Milicic and Okpara have played together for 174 total minutes and have a total plus minus of +47.

The lineup of Zeigler, Gainey, Lanier, Milicic and Okpara have played together for 89 total minutes and have a total plus minus of +66.

So nearly 3x better/more efficient in total has the lineup with Gainey been.
Click to expand...
I think that the lineup with Gainey has to be the one that you play the majority of the time @kentucky. Going to have to have some offensive firepower to win at Rupp and can’t afford to have Pope try to clog the lane and sag off of Mashack.
 
#23,294
#23,294
Chaz-Vol said:
He started slow but he's turning into vols best offensive player. Really can score from all 3 levels.
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He’s had a few rough games here and there, but overall he’s a very, very talented player. Has size, can handle the ball, good passer, good shooter ( better than his percentages suggest), aggressive on the boards. If he can find some consistency, there’s no reason he can’t carve out a career in the NBA.
 
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#23,295
#23,295
walkenvol said:
I’m surprised some folks post favorably about Dubar’s play. It’s shocking he averaged 18 last season and shot 40% from 3 then produces nothing this season. The team and Barnes continue to make positive comments about Dubar in interviews so maybe he’s going to light it up and win us a game this year….we can hope anyway.
Click to expand...

Think missing so much time preseason has negatively impacted him. Also think he just probably isn’t built for the speed of the game at this level. Some mid major guys translate. Some don’t. He appears to be one who doesn’t, at least not consistently. I suspect he will have another game or two like the Texas game where we look back knowing we wouldn’t have won without him. Aside from another one or two of those, he largely is a 2-7 minutes per game guy who serves the purpose of just giving guys a brief breather.
 
#23,296
#23,296
Volprofch05 said:
Insurance companies shouldn’t be allowed to sponsor contests

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Obviously I'm not a UMASS women's basketball fan, so I suppose it is entirely possible this contest is sponsored by an insurance company, but more likely is that the contest is protected with prize indemnity insurance, and it is the insurance company holding that policy that is refusing to pay out.

Likely the most famous instance of this is the Bulls fan who made a ¾ court shot for a million bucks (maybe 35 years ago, or so...Jordan was on the team), but was disqualified by the insurance company that held the indemnity policy because the man had played college basketball (for one year at some no-name school) which was a violation of the contest rules. The sponsors of the event agreed to pay him if the insurance company wouldn't, sp one way or another, he ended up getting the money.

The Calhoun Shot - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org
 
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#23,297
#23,297
bleedingTNorange said:
Plus/minus can sometimes be a useless stat, especiallly for a singular game, but with a big sample size it’s usually pretty telling. In SEC play only, so 10 games…

Gainey has the team best at +65 and Mashack has the team worst at -15
Click to expand...
Any idea how Phillips stacks up? It seems like he is always having an effect.
 
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