The sissification and emasculation of the American male

[GVF]

I disagree.

I was spanked frequently as a kid, and I was still a hellion in public. My sister was never spanked, and was a very well-behaved child.

There are exceptions. And I would be taken aback if you weren't one of them. lol.

My sister was the most defiant, at home and had the most run-ins.
My brother was the meanest and wildest.
I was smart enough to learn what got them in the cross hairs and minimized it.

Did it make us perfect teens. Nah. Still gonna do things. Part of growing up. But, we never made scenes in public, always showed respect to others, and all the other good phrases I could insert here. Is it the only effective way to be raised. Couldn't be. Is it wrong. Nope.

What we are seeing in today's youth and young adults is a lack of teaching coupled with zero discipline. And the generation before us probably said that about us. But, it is on a far different plane now I think.

 

[GVF]

I disagree.

I was spanked frequently as a kid, and I was still a hellion in public. My sister was never spanked, and was a very well-behaved child.

I would also add that even though we all know you as still being a hellion on VN, I would guess there is a great chance there is a core base you were taught that you still keep, even if you may be more open or liberal than some others of us.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

I would also add that even though we all know you as still being a hellion on VN, I would guess there is a great chance there is a core base you were taught that you still keep, even if you may be more open or liberal than some others of us.

Definitely.

I wouldn't say those most valuable core creeds were reinforced through spanking. Honesty, integrity, helping the less fortunate, sticking up for those who can't do it themselves. Those were relayed to me through lessons.

 

[GVF]

Definitely.

I wouldn't say those most valuable core creeds were reinforced through spanking. Honesty, integrity, helping the less fortunate, sticking up for those who can't do it themselves. Those were relayed to me through lessons.

Same. Spankings are for "heirarchy" for lack of a better word. My parents lived every bit of it. 90% of what I hold on to today were learned by example not rules. The other 10% was understanding discipline and why. Our home was always open. Always meals if needed. No status requirements to be invited in. Dad was always one who would not pass an opening to offer to pray or study...in a very christian not in your face way. Mind you, we're CoC. When door knockers would come around, he'd say yeah I'll be glad to study with you and invite them in. Sometimes for hours. In time, as we grew up, I started noticing all the Mormon and JW's would byass our house. I suppose enough mission people returned to the building questioning teachings and bible and our house became marked to avoid.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

That is an age old paraphrase of the biblical teaching of discipline. Had switches and belts myself. I would strongly agree that someone using some kind of hard object like rods or pipes or broom handles needs their own flogging. Not advocating that all punishment/discipline should be corporal punishment. Far from it, although corporal punishment is indeed biblical in the sense it was intended. But, at some point, if your other parenting skills are to be cemented, there will be an occasion or two, maybe three, where it is all but necessary. Like anything in life, there are zealots that will reside at one extreme end or the other. That's unavoidable, unfortunately for many.

I promise you one thing. You show me a kid in public that is acting out and will not obey and is pitching immortal fits, and I'll show you one that has not been spanked. When we were told to straighten up and behave, we knew what would happen if we did not. Positive re-enforcement.

That is not positive reinforcement.

 

[WoodsmanVol]

I don't think my kid will ever move out of my house. So, I am moving out and renting it to her.

You'd be a bad golden eagle mommy.
In truth, that might not be a bad idea. Make sure she signs an agreement to be response for all upkeep and maintenance.
Thereby, keeping the lesson of persona responsibility intact. You might even have your golden eagle mommy certificate reinstated.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

There are exceptions. And I would be taken aback if you weren't one of them. lol.

My sister was the most defiant, at home and had the most run-ins.
My brother was the meanest and wildest.
I was smart enough to learn what got them in the cross hairs and minimized it.

Did it make us perfect teens. Nah. Still gonna do things. Part of growing up. But, we never made scenes in public, always showed respect to others, and all the other good phrases I could insert here. Is it the only effective way to be raised. Couldn't be. Is it wrong. Nope.

What we are seeing in today's youth and young adults is a lack of teaching coupled with zero discipline. And the generation before us probably said that about us. But, it is on a far different plane now I think.

The fact that you believe that whacking a child should be part of a disciplinary program is indicative of a lack of creativity on your part. There are so many better ways to discipline or encourage good behavior.

When the discipline arm is needed - you’ve already failed as a parent. The motivation should be a positive reinforcement not avoidance of corporal punishment. My daughter and I are very close. We would come up with things she wanted and we put together a game plan for her to exhibit certain behaviors or reach certain goals which allowed her to earn her wants.

When I had to get negative, I would find her prized possession and take it away. One year it was a pair of jeans, other times it was her makeup, others it was a cell phone. If I had offered her the choice between being spanked and losing the item de jour. she’d have taken a whooping.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

You'd be a bad golden eagle mommy.
In truth, that might not be a bad idea. Make sure she signs an agreement to be response for all upkeep and maintenance.
Thereby, keeping the lesson of persona responsibility intact. You might even have your golden eagle mommy certificate reinstated.

Yeah, she and 2 friends, are paying a little below market value but they all understand I will enforce late fees and evict quickly. One of the friends is in law school and my daughter and the other roomie are working on their undergrads.

 

[82_VOL_83]

Can you define what limp wristed means?

If you have to ask.......

 

[82_VOL_83]

The sight of a skinny dude bringing one to the point of vomiting absolutely makes that person a grade A p*ssy.

Skinny dudes can't defend themselves?

 

[82_VOL_83]

You weren't arguing the rationale. You said spanking was not hitting. It is. The definition of hitting is not subjective. If you spank someone you hit them by definition.

I have been educated on the other side of the issue. I was spanked as a child. I made a conscious decision to avoid it as a parent. More often than not children are spanked when the parent is angry and frustrated with the behavior of the child. I view that as a weakness when your only solution when frustrated is to hit the child. I do believe there are better ways than showing your children that violence is acceptable as long as you're angry and have a good reason.

Yes, because stand in the corner or go to your room (where there are a zillion toys) is really going to get their attention. I spanked mine, hard. About two or three times each. It is a deterrent if done properly. I had two of the best behaved kids you will see. I've never seen a sit in the corner kid that behaved worth a crap.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

Yes, because stand in the corner or go to your room (where there are a zillion toys) is really going to get their attention. I spanked mine, hard. About two or three times each. It is a deterrent if done properly. I had two of the best behaved kids you will see. I've never seen a sit in the corner kid that behaved worth a crap.

Apparently, you are unable to read.

 

[LouderVol]

Show me how to spank a child without hitting the child.

Discipline can be administered without hitting a child. The fact you believe violence is the answer in child rearing says a lot about your personality.

define violence. I think you are putting way too fine of a point on "physical force with the intent to harm, damage, or kill"

you pat your kid on the head, that's violence. you "hit" them.
you give your kid a hug, that's violence, you are constricting their breathing.
flicking your kid on the arm before they say the wrong thing, thats violence.
pushing your kid standing in the way before they get hit by something larger than them is violence.

if anything a spanking as a form of punishment is applying physical force with the intent to improve, teach, and grow, your child. of course people take it too far, but that doesn't make the base act of physical punishment wrong.

I never saw anything wrong with it as a kid, I did something wrong, and was punished. It was usually used as a way to get my attention and to take whatever criticism/critique was coming seriously instead of just zoning out and waiting for it to be over.

 

[82_VOL_83]

Apparently, you are unable to read.

Nah, I stopped at spanking is hitting and I vowed to not "hit" my kids.

 

[82_VOL_83]

define violence. I think you are putting way too fine of a point on "physical force with the intent to harm, damage, or kill"

you pat your kid on the head, that's violence. you "hit" them.
you give your kid a hug, that's violence, you are constricting their breathing.
flicking your kid on the arm before they say the wrong thing, thats violence.
pushing your kid standing in the way before they get hit by something larger than them is violence.

if anything a spanking as a form of punishment is applying physical force with the intent to improve, teach, and grow, your child. of course people take it too far, but that doesn't make the base act of physical punishment wrong.

I never saw anything wrong with it as a kid, I did something wrong, and was punished. It was usually used as a way to get my attention and to take whatever criticism/critique was coming seriously instead of just zoning out and waiting for it to be over.

The lack of the willingess by liberal parents to do the bolded is why we are in the shape we are in today.

 

[LouderVol]

I think you have confused being masculine with being a redneck. Not entirely surprising, considering.



When citizenship was earned or paid for it was more limited. Those were also the people paying taxes - but they were also the only ones who got to vote. When citizenship went wide, to everyone without cost or responsibility, they discovered that they could vote themselves increases in the dole (a Roman word). The fall of Rome was due to many factors but chiefly among them were the cultural collapse, where people understood what it meant to be Roman (and endeavored to live up to that), and the aforementioned acts of giving votes to people who were not responsible citizens and who then voted in their personal interest and not the public's.

yeah, I am not naïve enough to think that the pre-Edict Romans weren't voting their own personal interests. Their society could have collapsed for any number of reasons, it was the leadership that got them through. when the leadership failed it wouldn't have mattered what type of people made up their society.

 

[LouderVol]

Effective parenting and rearing doesn't always require spanking.

and spanking doesn't mean its bad or ineffective either.

 

[LouderVol]

The fact that you believe that whacking a child should be part of a disciplinary program is indicative of a lack of creativity on your part. There are so many better ways to discipline or encourage good behavior.

When the discipline arm is needed - you’ve already failed as a parent. The motivation should be a positive reinforcement not avoidance of corporal punishment. My daughter and I are very close. We would come up with things she wanted and we put together a game plan for her to exhibit certain behaviors or reach certain goals which allowed her to earn her wants.

When I had to get negative, I would find her prized possession and take it away. One year it was a pair of jeans, other times it was her makeup, others it was a cell phone. If I had offered her the choice between being spanked and losing the item de jour. she’d have taken a whooping.

and that wouldn't have worked on me, spankings didn't either. The "I am disappointed in X" talk is what worked on me. doesn't mean that either of the other two forms of punishment were inherently morally wrong.

 

[Matt2496]

I think something important to note in this conversation is how males are portrayed in movies. More often than not, they seem to be portrayed as these super emotionally fragile creatures prone to outbursts of emotion. Most men don't act like that. That level of emotionalism is typical of women, not men. I'm not saying that there are no super emotional men or less emotional women, but it is the exception rather than the norm. In my opinion, this is an attempt by Hollywood to remove the normal, masculine male from society and promote a more effeminate version. I think this especially has a great impact in fatherless homes, where the only version of what a man acts like is what they see in the movies.

 

[allvol123]

I think something important to note in this conversation is how males are portrayed in movies. More often than not, they seem to be portrayed as these super emotionally fragile creatures prone to outbursts of emotion. Most men don't act like that. That level of emotionalism is typical of women, not men. I'm not saying that there are no super emotional men or less emotional women, but it is the exception rather than the norm. In my opinion, this is an attempt by Hollywood to remove the normal, masculine male from society and promote a more effeminate version. I think this especially has a great impact in fatherless homes, where the only version of what a man acts like is what they see in the movies.

Commercials are also into this big time. The male is the buffoon that can’t figure some product out or keeps doing something stupid and the female saves the day with the superior product you need to buy.

 

[Matt2496]

Commercials are also into this big time. The male is the buffoon that can’t figure some product out or keeps doing something stupid and the female saves the day with the superior product you need to buy.

Absolutely. Wasn't there a commercial that said "It's so easy, even a man can do it"? I think it was some brand of cleaner, but it definitely speaks to the overall denigration of males by these woke companies and the modern man-hating feminists that have infiltrated them.

 

[StarRaider]

Absolutely. Wasn't there a commercial that said "It's so easy, even a man can do it"? I think it was some brand of cleaner, but it definitely speaks to the overall denigration of males by these woke companies and the modern man-hating feminists that have infiltrated them.

me and this guy edit wikipedia

 

[Carl Pickens]

Beating kids isn't the solution.

Paddling isn’t the same as beating …. Just sayin’

 

[Carl Pickens]

Whatever the number is, it's high. It's getting out of control. The average overweight kid to a boomer in their day is a skinny kid now by today's standard. Count the 40 YO's you see in a day and how many of them are fit? Is it 3/10? I know where you live makes a difference, and if you're in an affluent area you're gonna see some nice looking people more. Last year I was at a Cracker Barrel in AL and it was jam-packed with people and I swear there was not 1 fit person in at least 100.

I had a similar experience just today at lunch. I looked around the restaurant and thought this place is like the diner of the living dead.

 

[Weezer]

That is not positive reinforcement.

When I got a spanking, I was positive I didn't plan on getting caught doing whatever I was doing to get the spanking again.


I'm guessing you had a tough childhood yourself that made you vow "never to hit your children". And if you were able to raise your child that way, good for you. Not all kids respond to more passive punishments. Spankings work for those that don't. Some kids need that physical stimulus. It should never crossover to abuse, but spankings work.

Whatever your reasons for the holier-than-thou posts, the passive aggressive suggesting that spankers are somehow bad parents is wrong IMO. Different strokes for different folks.