The Star Wars 8 SPOILER thread.

#127
#127
VOLtownUSA said:
And then you'd be on here complaining that they copied from Empire too closely "like Force Awakens did A New Hope" ...
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False, I actually enjoyed TFA. Though, I did get a little tired of the forced humor (BB-8 for one) in scenes which Disney has carried over. There is no way any true Star Wars fan can defend this pile of garbage. We would have been better served having a trilogy based on Thrawn or turning the NJO series into film. At least with the NJO you have an entirely new (foreign galactic invaders) enemy that had never been seen before in-universe. Haven't read it in a long time but I remember feeling that the heroes were utterly desperate (Chewie dying, New Republic being defeated left and right) before winning in the end.
 
#128
#128
Burhead said:
What would have been cooler was having the AT-ATs fire, Luke using the force to send them back, and than challenging Kylo to a duel before Obi-Wanning himself. No matter how much you defend this the force projection death is completely and utterly the worst way to send off the character of Luke Skywalker. Rian Johnson did a complete disservice to Luke and Mark Hamil, its like he never watched the original trilogy to star with. So Luke never gives up on Vader who did much, much worse things then Kylo will ever do but decides to kill his nephew in the middle of the night and than runs away and hides from the galaxy as the monster he has created rapes, pillages, and burns the known universe? I'm sorry I refuse to believe Luke would be such a coward given his character history up until this point.
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Bingo
 
#129
#129
Burhead said:
False, I actually enjoyed TFA. Though, I did get a little tired of the forced humor (BB-8 for one) in scenes which Disney has carried over. There is no way any true Star Wars fan can defend this pile of garbage. We would have been better served having a trilogy based on Thrawn or turning the NJO series into film. At least with the NJO you have an entirely new (foreign galactic invaders) enemy that had never been seen before in-universe. Haven't read it in a long time but I remember feeling that the heroes were utterly desperate (Chewie dying, New Republic being defeated left and right) before winning in the end.
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Heck they copied some of it already, in the NJO Jacen Solo eventually falls to the dark side (like Ben) and Jaina (which I have a feeling Rey is based off of) stops him.

Also another thing that irked me, why did force projection Luke use a blue light saber when in the flashbacks he clearly had his RoTJ green one?
 
#131
#131
MrAtkins said:
Let's assume it all happens the same, but for real. Writers can write - well, not evidenced here. But assuming they can write accordingly, this works fine. All they have to do is undo a few craptastic prior choices, any of which work. Remove the flashback cornball moment where Rey has to use her power to move - rocks. That would save time and our continued death by comic relief! Or maybe they actually find accurate maps of the base, and some no name in the background says "This way, hurry!". Or maybe Meathead Poe as he is portrayed, isn't the first one enlightened enough to the fact Luke is stalling for them. He obviously hurts his brain deliberating for some time on this matter.

Aside from the low hanging fruit of doing the above, what else could happen? Now, I’m no writer but I know what I like:

1. He literally brings Ren's walker to its knees. Being blasted never happens. Talking, fighting, running away, etc. happens next.

2. They duel to the death with Luke's blood pooling and contrasting with the salt and red soil. Maybe you frame the shot with his robot hand and saber flickering out.

3. He hurls really, really, really, big rocks off the mountain like a jedi boss and crushes the GRLA-ATS. –sarcasm-

4. He and Rey both go out and fight Ren. Rey turns and fights against Luke however due to her conflicting views on Ren. They both strike Luke down in the end. Damn!

5. He flies away. No sarcasm, it is canon people c’mon!

6. He introduces a new Jedi power, like… projection/hologram/teleportation. Maybe there are a hundred of him. Maybe they are in the GRLA_AT’s too, killing First Order troops with bad jokes. – sarcasm-

7. and on and on…

See. It’s not hard people. Disney et al did not even try hard and are making a killing. But go ahead, give them your money while they force feed you more crap and tell you how wonderful it is, all while educating you on the evil of war and big companies, etc. Oh the irony.
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1-2. Make no sense. Why does being blasted never happen? You want Kylo to pull a Grievous and try and take Luke on all by himself? Then you'd be complaining that idea was already played out. And do you honestly expect Kylo to be able to beat Luke? Imagine the backlash on that one.

3. Ok

4. I'm not sure if that was a serious idea or not, but having one of the most beloved characters in the franchise killed off by the character you're banking on being equally beloved isn't exactly a foolproof plan.

5-7. Haha good ones...

You don't have to like Disney or the movie, but the rest of that last paragraph is laughable. And "Meathead Poe" 😂
 
#132
#132
Burhead said:
False, I actually enjoyed TFA. Though, I did get a little tired of the forced humor (BB-8 for one) in scenes which Disney has carried over. There is no way any true Star Wars fan can defend this pile of garbage. We would have been better served having a trilogy based on Thrawn or turning the NJO series into film. At least with the NJO you have an entirely new (foreign galactic invaders) enemy that had never been seen before in-universe. Haven't read it in a long time but I remember feeling that the heroes were utterly desperate (Chewie dying, New Republic being defeated left and right) before winning in the end.
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The gatekeeping for what "true Star Wars fans" should and shouldn't accept is really ****ing annoying tbh.
 
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#133
#133
BigOrange15 said:
The gatekeeping for what "true Star Wars fans" should and shouldn't accept is really ****ing annoying tbh.
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I'm tired of Lucas and now Disney butchering my all-time favorite franchise. Seeing the POS that been produced since RoTJ I just wish Lucas had ended it there and never made any more movies. If Disney fricks up the Han Solo movie as bad as TLJ you may read about me in the papers.
 
#134
#134
Just watched it - Watching the Avengers trailer on the big screen was the best thing of the night
 
#135
#135
Burhead said:
False, I actually enjoyed TFA. Though, I did get a little tired of the forced humor (BB-8 for one) in scenes which Disney has carried over. There is no way any true Star Wars fan can defend this pile of garbage. We would have been better served having a trilogy based on Thrawn or turning the NJO series into film. At least with the NJO you have an entirely new (foreign galactic invaders) enemy that had never been seen before in-universe. Haven't read it in a long time but I remember feeling that the heroes were utterly desperate (Chewie dying, New Republic being defeated left and right) before winning in the end.
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I’ll be 40 years old next week. I’m essentially eight months younger than the day A New Hope dropped. I had older sisters who liked it and had toys surrounding me pretty much from the day I was born. As a little kid on the playground I had two soundtracks constantly playing in my head, John Williams Superman and John Williams Star Wars. One of my earliest memories of going to the theatre was to see Empire when I was barely 3 years old. I clearly remember waiting on my front porch on a rainy Saturday afternoon for my friends mom’s van to round the corner and pick me up to see Return of the Jedi (and by God I loved the Ewoks). I remember my mom taking me to Hills Department Store to pick out anything I wanted for my birthday in 1983 and I got an Imperial Shuttle because I liked how the wings folded up and down. As a small child my favorite hero was Luke. As a teenager it was Han.

I could go on and on about how Star Wars has shaped my life. I would consider myself a “True Star Wars” fan.

If I was writing it there are certainly things I would have done different. There was plenty of things I would have liked to see in regards to an all powerful Luke Skywalker. I didn’t get that but I’m not going to cry about it because personally I was satisfied with how Luke went out.
 
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#136
#136
#137
#137
Rockytoptalker said:
1-2. Make no sense. Why does being blasted never happen? You want Kylo to pull a Grievous and try and take Luke on all by himself? Then you'd be complaining that idea was already played out. And do you honestly expect Kylo to be able to beat Luke? Imagine the backlash on that one.

3. Ok

4. I'm not sure if that was a serious idea or not, but having one of the most beloved characters in the franchise killed off by the character you're banking on being equally beloved isn't exactly a foolproof plan.

5-7. Haha good ones...

You don't have to like Disney or the movie, but the rest of that last paragraph is laughable. And "Meathead Poe" 😂
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1. Well, if he brings Kylo's walker down, Kylo likely never gives the order to fire does he? And why wouldn't he fight Luke? He fought fake Luke thinking he was real didn't he?!?! I am at a loss for your your argument. All the negative counter arguments you make are actually in the movie and they are fake Luke on top of all that.

4.Is totally serious and makes the most sense to me on many levels. Rey joins Luke to confront Kylo Ren. Or maybe she follows Luke urging him not to make the confrontation because she knows his mind state is not good/prepared. If the battle were to turn where both kill Luke, I imagine something like the end of The Graduate - what have we done and now what do we do. I imagine the two of them being at vast opposing odds immediately after, but both grappling with similar existential issues and "coming up". That would have set up for an amazing final movie as they both work through the angst of their decisions and how the future should be formed . They could both be bad, good, one or the other, on and on. What a shocking ending with high expectations for the next film and a heroes epic ending.
 
#138
#138
Ulysees E. McGill said:
That was a very interesting read, as was the David Simms article in The Atlantic that was linked in it. It discussed the reason why Finn and Roses story was important.
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Well, Finn and Rose failed miserably... which was basically the theme of the movie, right? Everyone is incompetent and is destined for failure.
 
#140
#140
MrAtkins said:
1. Well, if he brings Kylo's walker down, Kylo likely never gives the order to fire does he? And why wouldn't he fight Luke? He fought fake Luke thinking he was real didn't he?!?! I am at a loss for your your argument. All the negative counter arguments you make are actually in the movie and they are fake Luke on top of all that.

4.Is totally serious and makes the most sense to me on many levels. Rey joins Luke to confront Kylo Ren. Or maybe she follows Luke urging him not to make the confrontation because she knows his mind state is not good/prepared. If the battle were to turn where both kill Luke, I imagine something like the end of The Graduate - what have we done and now what do we do. I imagine the two of them being at vast opposing odds immediately after, but both grappling with similar existential issues and "coming up". That would have set up for an amazing final movie as they both work through the angst of their decisions and how the future should be formed . They could both be bad, good, one or the other, on and on. What a shocking ending with high expectations for the next film and a heroes epic ending.
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The next movie, or this trilogy for that matter, is not supposed to be about Luke. If you haven’t picked up on it this is Rey, Finn, Poe, and Kylo’s Story. This is Star Wars moving along to the next generation. The original characters are just the connective tissue to the past but it’s not their story.
 
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#141
#141
Reading through a few articles on why the media thinks The Last Jedi is such an awesome movie makes me dislike it even more.

They largely ignore the plot holes, contradictions and lore and instead just say it's great because it features women/minorities and it isn't what's expected. And if you don't like the movie, those are the reasons why.

If that's what makes TLJ great then here's what Game of Thrones should do next year to have it's best season..... Kill the dragons in the first episode of season 8. Then waste an entire episode showing Tyrion walking around King's Landing handing out money and bread to poor people. Ignore Brandon Stark's abilities and instead have him run around fighting with a sword. The Night King? He gets killed by a falling rock when the wall collapsed. And we can't forget to have them create a new female/minority character that goes on a pointless quest to kill Cersei and ultimately dies, thus contributing nothing at all.
 
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#142
#142
MrAtkins said:
1. Well, if he brings Kylo's walker down, Kylo likely never gives the order to fire does he? And why wouldn't he fight Luke? He fought fake Luke thinking he was real didn't he?!?! I am at a loss for your your argument. All the negative counter arguments you make are actually in the movie and they are fake Luke on top of all that.

4.Is totally serious and makes the most sense to me on many levels. Rey joins Luke to confront Kylo Ren. Or maybe she follows Luke urging him not to make the confrontation because she knows his mind state is not good/prepared. If the battle were to turn where both kill Luke, I imagine something like the end of The Graduate - what have we done and now what do we do. I imagine the two of them being at vast opposing odds immediately after, but both grappling with similar existential issues and "coming up". That would have set up for an amazing final movie as they both work through the angst of their decisions and how the future should be formed . They could both be bad, good, one or the other, on and on. What a shocking ending with high expectations for the next film and a heroes epic ending.
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You're at a loss for a lot of things. Kylo and Hux are just going to sit there in silence as Luke brings down their Walker and not give the order to fire? Makes perfect sense...
 
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#143
#143
After watching this movie I see why JJ is coming back to direct the final installment. Probably desperate to salvage his original story that was tossed aside like a used wetnap in The Last Jedi.
 
#144
#144
burntorangeVOLffle said:
The next movie, or this trilogy for that matter, is not supposed to be about Luke. If you haven’t picked up on it this is Rey, Finn, Poe, and Kylo’s Story. This is Star Wars moving along to the next generation. The original characters are just the connective tissue to the past but it’s not their story.
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In other news, the sky is blue and grass is green. I am learning so much today.
 
#145
#145
Rockytoptalker said:
You're at a loss for a lot of things. Kylo and Hux are just going to sit there in silence as Luke brings down their Walker and not give the order to fire? Makes perfect sense...
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Yes, considering the First Order's repeated inability to fire on a planet base, shoot down a single X-Wing, catch a crawling away Resistance fleet, be stalled by corny communique dialogue, etc. WTH can't Luke bring down a GRLA-AT? This seems downright conservative and boring considering the bonkers stuff that we had seen to that point. I mean hell, he can be in two places at once, this is surely mere child's play! You are right, I am at a loss for this movie and the apologist explanations at attempting to excuse this steaming pile of crap.
 
#146
#146
burntorangeVOLffle said:
The next movie, or this trilogy for that matter, is not supposed to be about Luke. If you haven’t picked up on it this is Rey, Finn, Poe, and Kylo’s Story. This is Star Wars moving along to the next generation. The original characters are just the connective tissue to the past but it’s not their story.
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The problem with this is that Finn just isn't interesting and no one really cares about the character... plus he's incompetent. And Poe is basically the same way, he's a hothead pilot who ends up getting most of his people killed. We're supposed to really care about them? Or Rose, a random mechanic... no one cares.

Rey and Kylo though, definitely want to see how that goes. There's a reason why the Rey & Kylo scenes were the best parts of The Last Jedi.
 
#147
#147
BRTiger said:
The problem with this is that Finn just isn't interesting and no one really cares about the character... plus he's incompetent. And Poe is basically the same way, he's a hothead pilot who ends up getting most of his people killed. We're supposed to really care about them? Or Rose, a random mechanic... no one cares.

Rey and Kylo though, definitely want to see how that goes. There's a reason why the Rey & Kylo scenes were the best parts of The Last Jedi.
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To add to that, Kylo and Rey are only as good as the development of the characters around them. Snoke adds nothing to Kylo, Luke doesn't really add much either. The rest of the cast certainly does not. If I think Snoke was pointless and died too easily, Kylo Ren just suffered a blow as well. Weak, weak, weak.
 
#148
#148
MrAtkins said:
To add to that, Kylo and Rey are only as good as the development of the characters around them. Snoke adds nothing to Kylo, Luke doesn't really add much either. The rest of the cast certainly does not. If I think Snoke was pointless and died too easily, Kylo Ren just suffered a blow as well. Weak, weak, weak.
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But at the very least I'm still interested in the fate of those two characters.
 
#149
#149
BRTiger said:
But at the very least I'm still interested in the fate of those two characters.
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That's good that you and other people feel that way. I know I do not any longer care and it is really disappointing. All I can see is what could have been done to make these characters good (not even great mind you) instead of marginally serviceable and surrounded by a cast I more or less detest.
 
#150
#150
FLVOL_79 said:
After watching this movie I see why JJ is coming back to direct the final installment. Probably desperate to salvage his original story that was tossed aside like a used wetnap in The Last Jedi.
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I have no earthly idea about what Disney saw in TLJ that made them decide Rian Johnson is the right man to develop the next trilogy.
 
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