Theisman says Tebow should Retire

#51
#51
lylsmorr said:
A good amount of players get drafted/signed based on fundamentals and decision making, such as quarterbacks. That's where I was mostly going with that last sentence. Vick was as talented as they come but couldn't win it all because he didn't have the decision making abilities, or consistent accuracy to be successful as a passing QB. A quarterback can't make it on potential alone, in the league.

See: Kurt Warner for proof of the bold
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Here is the thing with VICK that MOST of you don't realize..He went through 4 different offences in 5 yrs..He also didn't have a front line that would block..Ask Matt Ryan about being on his back side so much this year..And Vick's WRs could catch a cold...But if you t ook VICK and put him in N.E. or IND. he would have been a great QB that had TIME in the pocket..Without time you will end up like STAFFORD!!!! HURT!!!!!!!!!!:thumbsup:
 
#52
#52
Tennsolider1 said:
Here is the thing with VICK that MOST of you don't realize..He went through 4 different offences in 5 yrs..He also didn't have a front line that would block..Ask Matt Ryan about being on his back side so much this year..And Vick's WRs could catch a cold...But if you t ook VICK and put him in N.E. or IND. he would have been a great QB that had TIME in the pocket..Without time you will end up like STAFFORD!!!! HURT!!!!!!!!!!:thumbsup:
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No, Vick would not have been a great QB behind any line. His accuracy makes Crompton look like Montana.
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#53
#53
lylsmorr said:
Out of everything in this thread that's all you can come up with? Who even brought Meyer up? I just replied to the OP and barely read any posts, so that's a serious question
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Your boy "tri vol" has single handedly accounted for nearly half the posts in this entire thread, with a majority of them completely ripping Urban Meyer's abilities. If you can't beat somebody, you don't criticize them (unless you want to look like a moron; see Lane Kiffin).

hmanvolfan said:
I can't believe you have the mental capacity to type a response on an internet sports message board.
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:birgits_giggle:
 
#54
#54
Lawrence Wright said:
No, you can't promise that.

Meyer has been successful wherever he's coached, and the fact that he doesn't have a high profile NFL QB to point to has no effect whatsoever in his ability to bring in top flight talent to fit his system at UF.

If all HS QBs cared about was which college had the most QBs in the NFL, every pro-style recruit would flock to Michigan or Southern Cal. It doesn't matter nearly as much as you think (or hope) it does.
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I didn't say anything about QB's. These kids flocking to Florida are going there to be int he NFL. But, hell, I'd say Tebow is a little miffed that we went to the all-star game woefully unprepared for the NFL. These 5* kids don't roll down to Florida to win a few games and get a real job. They go so that they can get into the NFL.

Now, they want to go to a place they'll have fun and fit in because they're there for 3-4 years, but the ultimate goal is still the same. Without a 3 year rule, there's a lot of these kids who would try their hand at skipping out.

Get over the idea that kids are flocking to Florida for Urban and their education. There are plenty of kids that, save being talented athletes, don't belong anywhere NEAR an institute of higher learning.
 
#56
#56
So Tebow should just walk away from guranteed millions because there is at least a decent shot that he will be "bust" in the NFL?

To this day I've never understood why Theismann was a color commentator so long. He's a guy that obviously likes to hear himself talk and he's one of the worst at talking a ton and actually saying nothng. And these comments are just stupid.
 
#57
#57
jwells said:
I didn't say anything about QB's. These kids flocking to Florida are going there to be int he NFL. But, hell, I'd say Tebow is a little miffed that we went to the all-star game woefully unprepared for the NFL. These 5* kids don't roll down to Florida to win a few games and get a real job. They go so that they can get into the NFL.

Now, they want to go to a place they'll have fun and fit in because they're there for 3-4 years, but the ultimate goal is still the same. Without a 3 year rule, there's a lot of these kids who would try their hand at skipping out.

Get over the idea that kids are flocking to Florida for Urban and their education. There are plenty of kids that, save being talented athletes, don't belong anywhere NEAR an institute of higher learning.
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Man, you're all over the place.

Kids ARE flocking to Florida because it's a successful program, due largely in part to Urban Meyer. The 6-7 UF players scheduled to be drafted in a couple months are all Meyer recruits. So it seems to me he's doing a great job of getting guys ready to go to the NFL while at the same time winning and competing for championships.

It remains to be seen what affect Charlie leaving will have on the defense, but based on this past recruiting class it appears that whatever we're selling, the top recruits are buying. Feel free to come up with your own conspiracy theories as to why that's the case....
 
#58
#58
yea even with QB's not being prepared well FLA's still been putting alot of kids in the draft lately. this year especially


you can do fine with 4* QB's tho, you dont need first round draft picks
 
#59
#59
Lawrence Wright said:
Man, you're all over the place.

Kids ARE flocking to Florida because it's a successful program, due largely in part to Urban Meyer. The 6-7 UF players scheduled to be drafted in a couple months are all Meyer recruits. So it seems to me he's doing a great job of getting guys ready to go to the NFL while at the same time winning and competing for championships.

It remains to be seen what affect Charlie leaving will have on the defense, but based on this past recruiting class it appears that whatever we're selling, the top recruits are buying. Feel free to come up with your own conspiracy theories as to why that's the case....
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What do you mean all over the place? Your argument was that Meyer is there to win games, not prepare kids for the NFL.

My argument was that any coach that tells a kid he only wants to win--not prepare for the NFL won't coach long. Kids don't want to hear that.

Also, I didn't say Meyer didn't prepare any kids for the NFL, but he sure didn't help Tebow. 4 years and can barely take a snap under center. You can bet other schools will use that when they recruit QBs.

Again, since you haven't comprehended me: I didn't say Meyer and his staff can't prepare players, in general, for the NFL. What they have not done is prepare a QB for the NFL, and if they go around telling recruits that they aren't helping them get to the next level, they won't be around too much longer.
 
#60
#60
jwells said:
What do you mean all over the place? Your argument was that Meyer is there to win games, not prepare kids for the NFL.

My argument was that any coach that tells a kid he only wants to win--not prepare for the NFL won't coach long. Kids don't want to hear that.

Also, I didn't say Meyer didn't prepare any kids for the NFL, but he sure didn't help Tebow. 4 years and can barely take a snap under center. You can bet other schools will use that when they recruit QBs.

Again, since you haven't comprehended me: I didn't say Meyer and his staff can't prepare players, in general, for the NFL. What they have not done is prepare a QB for the NFL, and if they go around telling recruits that they aren't helping them get to the next level, they won't be around too much longer.
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This was the point I was trying to make in this thread.
 
#61
#61
tri_vol said:
Look at Meyer's track record for QBs. Alex Smith has been in the league for 5 yrs and has finally gotten to the point of mediocre but isn't a consistent starter. Leak wasn't even drafted and now Tebow's only shot is to be a H-Back or Wildcat guy. It's pretty obvious that Meyer can win but he is not developing QBs to play at the next level.
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and I thought Alex Smith went to Utah...who knew?
 
#62
#62
Again, since you haven't comprehended me: I didn't say Meyer and his staff can't prepare players, in general, for the NFL. What they have not done is prepare a QB for the NFL, and if they go around telling recruits that they aren't helping them get to the next level, they won't be around too much longer.
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In one post you say you aren't talking about QBs, then in your last post you specifically state your point is that Meyer cannot properly prepare QBs for the next level, based solely on Tebow's shortcomings.

Winning is Meyer's primary goal. Period. Getting kids ready for the next level is a part of that, but you and I both know if Meyer went 7-5 every year it wouldn't matter if Tebow was the consensus #1 pick in the draft. Ask Mark Richt how that's working out for him right now....he's another UT/UF/Ga Tech beatdown from looking for another job in spite of Stafford's lofty draft status.

If John Brantley fails to develop as a QB, I'd be more inclined to agree with you. He fits the mold of a prototypical NFL QB. That said, after this next draft, Meyer will be batting .750 on his starting QBs getting drafted. Tebow will get drafted, as did Josh Harris and of course Alex Smith.
 
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#63
#63
Lawrence Wright said:
In one post you say you aren't talking about QBs, then in your last post you specifically state your point is that Meyer cannot properly prepare QBs for the next level, based solely on Tebow's shortcomings.

Winning is Meyer's primary goal. Period. Getting kids ready for the next level is a part of that, but you and I both know if Meyer went 7-5 every year it wouldn't matter if Tebow was the consensus #1 pick in the draft. Ask Mark Richt how that's working out for him right now....he's another UT/UF/Ga Tech beatdown from looking for another job in spite of Stafford's lofty draft status.

If John Brantley fails to develop as a QB, I'd be more inclined to agree with you. He fits the mold of a prototypical NFL QB. That said, after this next draft, Meyer will be batting .750 on his starting QBs getting drafted. Tebow will get drafted, as did Josh Harris and of course Alex Smith.
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I'm not saying he can't, I'm just saying he didn't. And he needs to tell kids he will get them ready for the NFL, get them exposure, and use his connections to get them looks by scouts.

I'd be more inclined to say to kids that you'll get them in the NFL and if your staff produces NFL talent, then the wins and championships will come.

If I'm the coach and in my recruiting I place the emphasis on winning rather than development, I won't recruit well.
 
#64
#64
jwells said:
I'm not saying he can't, I'm just saying he didn't. And he needs to tell kids he will get them ready for the NFL, get them exposure, and use his connections to get them looks by scouts.

I'd be more inclined to say to kids that you'll get them in the NFL and if your staff produces NFL talent, then the wins and championships will come.

If I'm the coach and in my recruiting I place the emphasis on winning rather than development, I won't recruit well.
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Your recruiting philosophy sounds like a sure fire way to bring in a bunch of kids looking out for their own self-interest as opposed to playing within the framework of a team.
 
#65
#65
jwells said:
I'm not saying he can't, I'm just saying he didn't. And he needs to tell kids he will get them ready for the NFL, get them exposure, and use his connections to get them looks by scouts.

I'd be more inclined to say to kids that you'll get them in the NFL and if your staff produces NFL talent, then the wins and championships will come.

If I'm the coach and in my recruiting I place the emphasis on winning rather than development, I won't recruit well.
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so which in-home visits between a head coach with the credentials of Urban Meyer and a recruit did you sit in on? You think every single player looking for a D1 scholarship to go play football ONLY cares about how likely they are to get to the NFL? Get real.

Urban could NEVER have another qb get drafted and he would still produce championship caliber teams. He's a college football coach, nothing more.
 
#66
#66
jwells said:
I can promise you that if he doesn't develop NFL draft picks, he won't be coaching very much longer. Kids don't continue to attend a school that can't get them to the league.
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One of the most uninformed, wishful thinking posts that I've ever seen.

UF had FIVE players...FIVE players leave school early because the NFL draft committee advised them that they might be successful in the NFL.

This garbage about QBs, RBs or any other kids eventually not wanting to attend UF under Meyer because of developing NFL talent is ignorant wishful thinking at its best.

Your lame attempts to find issues with Meyer continue to highlight your own envy and desperation.

Support Coach Dooley and stop acting like Monte's kid.
 
#67
#67
lylsmorr said:
Funny...The people that won the Gators those championships are in the NFL or sure fire picks to go to the NFL. Harvin, Jarvis Moss, Dunlap, Haden, Eye gouger, Hernandez, Derrick Harvey, Reggie Nelson, etc. Maybe Charlie was more adept at putting people in the league. Harvin and Hernandez are/were locks to the league solely on talent and potential/need at the position.
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Maybe Charlie AND Meyer were adept at putting people in the NFL.
And undersized kids with character issues are locks for the NFL out of high school (VA and CT). WRONG.

Another ridiculously wrong theory.

Typical jealous, clueless rival arguments.

NFL caliber talent won't go to UF.
NFL talent leaving UF did not benefit from UF/Meyer.
UF is only good because of in-state talent.
Meyer can't coach.
UF players benefit from Meyer "system" of offense/coaching.

And my personal favorite:

The Gators will no longer be successful in the future because of ___________________. (please fill with any hypothetical wishful thinking)

I understand frustrations, but actual facts might mean you have a point.

Keep trying. This is fun.
 
#68
#68
Incinigator said:
Maybe Charlie AND Meyer were adept at putting people in the NFL.
And undersized kids with character issues are locks for the NFL out of high school (VA and CT). WRONG.

Another ridiculously wrong theory.

Typical jealous, clueless rival arguments.

NFL caliber talent won't go to UF.
NFL talent leaving UF did not benefit from UF/Meyer.
UF is only good because of in-state talent.
Meyer can't coach.
UF players benefit from Meyer "system" of offense/coaching.

And my personal favorite:

The Gators will no longer be successful in the future because of ___________________. (please fill with any hypothetical wishful thinking)

I understand frustrations, but actual facts might mean you have a point.

Keep trying. This is fun.
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You can kiss our _____.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#69
#69
This Meyer vs Saban debate is stupid. One is an offensive coach, the other is defensive. One should get offensive players drafted, the other is expected to develop great defensive players. It's really not difficult.
 
#70
#70
Gator fans:

Pay attention. I'm going to write out little bitty words you can understand:

I did NOT say Meyer couldn't develop any NFL talent.

I DID day that he didn't develop Tebow.

I did NOT say that he says those things to recruits.

I DID say anyone who would tell a recruit anything contrary to getting him ready for the NFL won't last long. Of course, he could be some "really great guy and mentor" in high school. Or at Maryville College.

I did NOT say that players ONLY want to be in the NFL.

I DID say that they look for schools that CAN get them in the league, then pick a school based on where they'll fit in for 3-4 years.


READ, COMPREHEND, THINK, then post. Of course, I know that's asking a lot from a group constantly defending a drama-queen coach and a QB that won't play on Sundays.
 
#71
#71
jwells said:
I'm not saying he can't, I'm just saying he didn't. And he needs to tell kids he will get them ready for the NFL, get them exposure, and use his connections to get them looks by scouts.

I'd be more inclined to say to kids that you'll get them in the NFL and if your staff produces NFL talent, then the wins and championships will come.

If I'm the coach and in my recruiting I place the emphasis on winning rather than development, I won't recruit well.
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So... A college coach tells recruits that he will "get them in the NFL, get them exposure, and use his connections to get them looks by scouts."

The kid signs on and proceeds to be overwhelmed with schoolwork and infinitely better competition. His growing stops and he never gets much bigger or faster. He never improves and winds up being a back-up at best.

A few D1 recruits don't pan out. Believe it or not.

That coach now is expected to make THOSE kids available to the media for interviews. ESPN would love that.

And then Coach NFL Developer calls his NFL Scout buddies and says that they need to come evaluate a 3rd string tackle and a 4th string WR to establish their draft position.

Come draft day, the kids are surprisingly passed over. No phone calls for free agent tryouts are forthcoming, either.

Now, wouldn't that make said college coach a liar or at least untruthful ?

IMO, that scenario would probably lead to an unsuccessful and very short career. Just my thoughts on the subject.
 
#72
#72
VolsSportsFan said:
So Tebow should just walk away from guranteed millions because there is at least a decent shot that he will be "bust" in the NFL?

To this day I've never understood why Theismann was a color commentator so long. He's a guy that obviously likes to hear himself talk and he's one of the worst at talking a ton and actually saying nothng. And these comments are just stupid.
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Ummm... That my friend is the definition of "color" talking for no apparent reason and in the end not saying anything. He is a master of his craft:eek:lol:
 
#73
#73
Incinigator said:
So... A college coach tells recruits that he will "get them in the NFL, get them exposure, and use his connections to get them looks by scouts."

The kid signs on and proceeds to be overwhelmed with schoolwork and infinitely better competition. His growing stops and he never gets much bigger or faster. He never improves and winds up being a back-up at best.

A few D1 recruits don't pan out. Believe it or not.

That coach now is expected to make THOSE kids available to the media for interviews. ESPN would love that.

And then Coach NFL Developer calls his NFL Scout buddies and says that they need to come evaluate a 3rd string tackle and a 4th string WR to establish their draft position.

Come draft day, the kids are surprisingly passed over. No phone calls for free agent tryouts are forthcoming, either.

Now, wouldn't that make said college coach a liar or at least untruthful ?

IMO, that scenario would probably lead to an unsuccessful and very short career. Just my thoughts on the subject.
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Generally terrible players don't get to talk to the media.

But while we're on it, yeah, Urban is a liar. It has been documented.
 
#74
#74
Sabanocchio said:
Theismann is an idiot.

Tebow does need someone in his ear telling him to play multiple positions at his pro day. And every QB considering Florida in the future better watch Tebow's journey closely.
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Look at Alex Smith who has taken years only to get competant at being a QB -- Theisman is not an idiot - Meyer really is pathetic getting a QB ready for the next level. In a few years Tebow will see that his good friend really did him no favors.
 
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