This Isn’t Working Out (Allen West Statement)

#102
#102
1972 Grad said:
Then, how about a compromise on sanctuary cities that instead of turning them over to ICE, we let the criminals out of jail and give them a 48 hour head start before we start looking for them, and maybe give them a $2 co-pay, instead of free medical care? How about letting illegals only bring 14 family members in the country legally to join them? How about giving up half of your guns and 3/4 of your ammunition? I mean this is the way to compromise. And, how about we start legalizing sex between adults and let's say 15-1/2 year olds, and maybe dropping the age to 14, if it is with a trusted teacher. Maybe even 13 if it's a man/boy type of thing.
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Lol yep we’re mostly close in agreement on views we just need to tweak it a little I guess 😂
 
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#107
#107
AM64 said:
I'd still disagree. See ND40's comment a few posts back; he says it very well. There's a great divide, and I don't see agreement anywhere. It's not this simple but a good starting point would be that some of us want the America that used to be and some want something like a new socialized European country with a lot of US history erased. That's a big difference.
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Those are differences. Find the common points. We all want peace, security, etc, no? We are human beings. I don't see anything worth going to civil war over. Another thing most of us want - stability.

The beginning of all this is not demonizing others and being cognizant that we are all humans with similar needs and wants.
 
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#110
#110
NorthDallas40 said:
The issue isn’t our government organization in fact I like our system organization. The problem is the assholes divided up in dodgeball teams playing us off each other. Instead of reorganizing the government work instead to bust up the teams

Ranked choice voting
Attack party funding of candidates
Attack lobbyist funding of candidates

More along those lines.
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Yeah, I would at least agree its anomalous in our system since only more recent history sees the delineation of only two parties. I like parliament because it allows room for variety and more calibrated representation, with the majority party gaining leadership while still allowing the other parties to maintain influence rather than having all representatives capitulate to a binary ideology that is incapable of representing the diverse opinions in a country like ours

My List:
overturn Citizens United and any form of corporate personhood
public funding of elections
return to serious news outlets having to agree not to allow advertising revenue
overhaul of lobbying ethics or removal of lobbying altogether
no Super PACs, no party fundraising arms
i haven’t thought enough at length on ranked choice voting, I‘ll have to process that one a bit
 
#111
#111
Devo182 said:
Those are differences. Find the common points. We all want peace, security, etc, no? We are human beings. I don't see anything worth going to civil war over. Another thing most of us want - stability.

The beginning of all this is not demonizing others and being cognizant that we are all humans with similar needs and wants.
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You could say the people of the USSR had peace, security, and stability. I don't think you could say they had good lives. What good is peace and security if you are a virtual prisoner in a world that doesn't suit your beliefs?
 
#112
#112
canitpro said:
Yeah, I would at least agree its anomalous in our system since only more recent history sees the delineation of only two parties. I like parliament because it allows room for variety and more calibrated representation, with the majority party gaining leadership while still allowing the other parties to maintain influence rather than having all representatives capitulate to a binary ideology that is incapable of representing the diverse opinions in a country like ours

My List:
overturn Citizens United and any form of corporate personhood
public funding of elections
return to serious news outlets having to agree not to allow advertising revenue
overhaul of lobbying ethics or removal of lobbying altogether
no Super PACs, no party fundraising arms
i haven’t thought enough at length on ranked choice voting, I‘ll have to process that one a bit
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I’m not a fan of parliamentary style it inbreeds the executive and legislative branches we have. I like divided government as long as the bastards are working towards common ground. They are no longer doing that.

Your list doesn’t look that different from mine. Get the money away from the bastards and get them focused on their constituents again.
 
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#113
#113
AM64 said:
And here we were quietly doing our own thing - occasionally mentioning the kind of people who annoy us and why ...
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I've said this before, but it's worth repeating... You guys are only serving to make Trump's defeat that much better for us by denying reality and making these baseless accusations of fraud. This wouldn't be as much fun if Trump was being gracious, and his supporters were living in reality. Your tears are what makes this sweet. *Cue the Cartman tasting Scott Tenorman's tears gif.
 
#115
#115
AM64 said:
You could say the people of the USSR had peace, security, and stability. I don't think you could say they had good lives. What good is peace and security if you are a virtual prisoner in a world that doesn't suit your beliefs?
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You're missing the point. Americans all want similar ends - peace, liberty, justice, you could go on. As a Christian, I see we are all god's children. If you are not, I am OK with that, the point is the principle - we are all human and want similar things. Look for the commons in one another, not the differences friend. That is a personal choice. No politician or political party forces us to divide ourselves. Peace and Go Vols!
 
#119
#119
canitpro said:
Yeah, I would at least agree its anomalous in our system since only more recent history sees the delineation of only two parties. I like parliament because it allows room for variety and more calibrated representation, with the majority party gaining leadership while still allowing the other parties to maintain influence rather than having all representatives capitulate to a binary ideology that is incapable of representing the diverse opinions in a country like ours

My List:
overturn Citizens United and any form of corporate personhood
public funding of elections
return to serious news outlets having to agree not to allow advertising revenue
overhaul of lobbying ethics or removal of lobbying altogether
no Super PACs, no party fundraising arms
i haven’t thought enough at length on ranked choice voting, I‘ll have to process that one a bit
Click to expand...

Can't go with the parliamentary form of government. What we have is pretty good if not abused, and I fail to see where the parliamentary form is better.

The list is pretty good except for a couple of items. News organizations require advertising unless they are publicly funded in some manner; I'm not for tax supported news. I'm not at all sold on ranked choice voting.

I'll add one to the list. Just as no corporations can fund or support/influence elections then neither can any other organization - no unions, no societies, no groups of any kind - nothing like AARP. Only individuals who can vote in the particular election and with a very modest cap - and absolutely no means of aggregating to hide larger donations. Probably public funding with no possible adders is the best answer.
 
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#121
#121
1972 Grad said:
Based on bellwether counties, Republican House gains, crowds and enthusiasm for Trump versus zero for your hero, statisticians' breakdown of voting irregularities, signed affidavits of fraud, etc.
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Believe what you want to... but the notion of "bellwether counties" is rendered meaningless unless you are holding every value in the election equation constant. In the 2020 Presidential election, there was an increase of 16% in voter participation from 2016. That marks a significant shift in a key variable.

Also, when you cite "Republican House gains", you are being inconsistent within the premise of your argument. This is essentially expressing faith in at least one portion of the same ballot in which you are implying fraud. This is not only self-serving, but it's illogical. If the Democrats were capable of "fixing" the Presidential election, they wouldn't have stopped at just one close race on every ballot. It makes sense that they would have flipped the Senate as well by taking out Susan Collins in Maine and Thom Tillis in North Carolina. That didn't happen.
 
#122
#122
BowlBrother85 said:
Believe what you want to... but the notion of "bellwether counties" is rendered meaningless unless you are holding every value in the election equation constant. In the 2020 Presidential election, there was an increase of 16% in voter participation from 2016. That marks a significant shift in a key variable.

Also, when you cite "Republican House gains", you are being inconsistent within the premise of your argument. This is essentially expressing faith in at least one portion of the same ballot in which you are implying fraud. This is not only self-serving, but it's illogical. If the Democrats were capable of "fixing" the Presidential election, they wouldn't have stopped at just one close race on every ballot. It makes sense that they would have flipped the Senate as well by taking out Susan Collins in Maine and Thom Tillis in North Carolina. That didn't happen.
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They knew what they had to do around midnight in 4 or 5 counties where they temporarily stopped the vote count.
 
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#123
#123
AM64 said:
I'd still disagree. See ND40's comment a few posts back; he says it very well. There's a great divide, and I don't see agreement anywhere. It's not this simple but a good starting point would be that some of us want the America that used to be and some want something like a new socialized European country with a lot of US history erased. That's a big difference.
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I think there are factions of both parties that want to improve conditions for the working class, and see better representation of constituents over corporate interests. The problem is the status quo of both parties are abbhorent at the moment, and likely dont actually disagree much behind closed doors. I have always been an advocate of some approximation of the 2nd Bill of Rights to actually reference something from our own history. You can find staple achievements of both parties historically that would currently be labeled radical or fringe and find no modern support because some of our history doesn’t cater to corporate hegemony, wall street, and the sacred altar of colossal wealth accumulation.
 
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#124
#124
1972 Grad said:
They knew what they had to do around midnight in 4 or 5 counties where they temporarily stopped the vote count.
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Attorney General William Barr (who up until this point, has been subservient to Trump), has directed investigations into claims such as this, and he has concluded that there has been no evidence of fraud significant enough to alter the apparent outcome of the 2020 Presidential election.

Also, the Trump legal team has had 5 weeks to present their evidence of fraud to a federal court. Time and time again, the Trump legal team has been rebuked, and in at least one of these cases, the rebuke came from a Trump-appointed judge (Judge Stephanos Bibas).
 
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