To Hell With Boise State.

#52
#52
KnoxVillain said:
I'd think even a One loss Alabama would get the nod over an undefeated Boise...
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So if it ended up:

1) Boise 12-0
2) TCU 12-0
3) Alabama 12-1

you feel it's very justified to just bump bama up top, even though the #1 and #2 ranked teams haven't lost any games?
 
#53
#53
TrueOrange said:
So if it ended up:

1) Boise 12-0
2) TCU 12-0
3) Alabama 12-1

you feel it's very justified to just bump bama up top, even though the #1 and #2 ranked teams haven't lost any games?
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Yeah, because if either of those teams switched schedules with Alabama, they would lose 2-3 games MINIMUM.
 
#54
#54
bleedorange0037 said:
Yeah, because if either of those teams switched schedules with Alabama, they would lose 2-3 games MINIMUM.
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Says who!!!? You? Thanks for clearing that up for the rest of us. Afterall, no way a Wyoming team from a crappy conference could ever beat a mighty SEC team.
 
#55
#55
bleedorange0037 said:
Yeah, because if either of those teams switched schedules with Alabama, they would lose 2-3 games MINIMUM.
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that's not how the polls work though; the polls have to deal with what you're seeing, not hypotheticals

you have to look at it in that case and say - not is it justifiable to drop boise state or tcu - but is it justifiable to drop an undefeated #1 team or an undefeated #2 team for a one loss team. Is it ok to drop down #1 or #2 if they didn't lose a game?

That's a very hard move, for pollster who ranks games mainly on a weekly basis, to just say "ok" with, especially with the special treatment those two spots in the rankings usually carry
 
#56
#56
It really is a shame that BYU and Utah left the MWC. Put Boise in that conference, give them the automatic BCS bid that was looking likely, and most of these problems would have gone away. I'd have a lot less trouble taking Boise as seriously worthy of a title shot if they had to play even three or four tough conference games beforehand. But at the end of the year Boise's going to have this last-minute win over probably a Peach Bowl-quality Virginia Tech team, a home win over a .500-ish Oregon State team, and a whole lotta nothing beyond that. Which means that somebody like Alabama or Ohio State is going to play half a dozen ranked teams this year, go almost undefeated against that schedule, and then get left out of the game in favor of a team that didn't play anybody. And that kind of sucks.

But what can Boise do? They're never going to get into a major conference, and every time they beat a team like Va Tech, it makes it that much less likely that they'll get regular-season shots against serious contenders in the future. And of course a big reason for Boise's rise is precisely that they aren't in a major conference to begin with, so they can end up taking a bunch of non-qualified and/or risky California kids that the Pac 10 schools don't take. If you put them in a conference where they played good enough competition to not have everybody sneer at them, then they'd have to deal with the higher standards too, and then suddenly the pipeline of California kids to Idaho would dry up.

Basically the whole thing stinks all the way around.
 
#57
#57
Dbake005 said:
They SHOULDN'T have lost to the number 3 team in the country??

Virginia Tech is good. Very good. All i'm saying

"Oh they lost tonight"

Cool.
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...technically, it was the 5th ranked team vs the 10th ranked team

espn uses the AP poll rankings even though it doesn't count for anything
 
#58
#58
TrueOrange said:
that's not how the polls work though; the polls have to deal with what you're seeing, not hypotheticals

you have to look at it in that case and say - not is it justifiable to drop boise state or tcu - but is it justifiable to drop an undefeated #1 team or an undefeated #2 team for a one loss team. Is it ok to drop down #1 or #2 if they didn't lose a game?

That's a very hard move, for pollster who ranks games mainly on a weekly basis, to just say "ok" with, especially with the special treatment those two spots in the rankings usually carry
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What I think will happen at the end of the year is what happened that year when Ohio State and Michigan were #1 and #2 going into the last game of the year. After USC unexpectedly wet the bed against UCLA, everybody realized that if voters followed all the usual "rules" for moving teams up, we were going to get an OSU-Michigan rematch, and so voters basically took matters into their own hands and moved Florida up in a way that ordinarily just doesn't happen. I think the same thing will happen this time. It will come down to the smell test, I think -- I don't think some voters will hesitate too much to vault a one-loss Alabama or Ohio State team over an undefeated Boise or TCU if they feel like they've got clearly better resumes.

Boise has a lot riding on what kind of season Virginia Tech and Oregon State have. If at least one of those wins doesn't look really impressive in December, they're likely to get jumped.
 
#59
#59
Bumi said:
Boise State would smack FSU in my opinion. The discrepancy in coaching is drastic.

That aside, if Boise State runs the table, by seasons end they'll be the #2 or #1 ranked team in the nation. At that point, there's no way to justify them being left out of the title game.

There's only 3 teams that can keep Boise out of the title game, and that's Alabama, Ohio State, and Florida. Teams ranked high enough and with strong enough schedules to pass Boise in the poles if the run the table. 2 of the 3 would have to go undefeated though, and I personally don't see that happening.
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Yeah, and you know why? Because they have to play 3-5 teams as good as VT to go undefeated. Boise st does not.
 
#62
#62
I LOOOVE the haters. Boise tries to strengthen their schedule and the strong teams duck em. UF and Texas were challenged by Boise and they ducked em. So much for the all powerful SEC and Big 12. Heck we ducked UNC. SEC hype gets a bit ridiculous.

I love the SEC, but head to head the PAC 10 has a better winning precentage the past ten years. We lost to em 3 out of 4 years and we lost to a WAC team. That's why teams need to play each other to settle disputes. Bama got worked by Utah, too.

All the Boise haters need to realize their arguments about strength of schedule really make no sense. Teams need to man up and face each other, and that's why the BCS system is stupid. We need a playoff!
 
#63
#63
Yes their schedule is weak but if they get past Oregon State and run the schedule like they should they deserve a shot at the NC. You can't fault them for playing in a weaker conference. Each time they have played one of the big boys they have beaten them.
 
#64
#64
FireMedic75 said:
Yes their schedule is weak but if they get past Oregon State and run the schedule like they should they deserve a shot at the NC. You can't fault them for playing in a weaker conference. Each time they have played one of the big boys they have beaten them.
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+1

Did lose to UGA, but that's beside the point.
 
#65
#65
I hope there are five teams setting there with 1 loss or three or four that are unbeaten. The BCS is pretty much a bad joke. These old fart traditionalist need to get off their collective butts and make a playoff happen.
 
#66
#66
Cartervol said:
I hope there are five teams setting there with 1 loss or three or four that are unbeaten. The BCS is pretty much a bad joke. These old fart traditionalist need to get off their collective butts and make a playoff happen.
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Will not happen. The BCS was created by a pro-playoff guy because as a substitute for the impossible playoff.
 
#67
#67
rjd970 said:
Says who!!!? You? Thanks for clearing that up for the rest of us. Afterall, no way a Wyoming team from a crappy conference could ever beat a mighty SEC team.
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How does Wyoming help your argument? The odds are very good that Boise and TCU would drop at least a game in the SEC. They simply do not have the depth or talent to run through a major conference undefeated. They can take a couple of major conference teams per year and play them and sure, they have a great shot at winning. You could even say the odds are in their favor because they have more to prove and more to play for in a out of conference matchup. If they had to do it every week then it would become obvious that the talent advantage lies with the SEC, Big XII, Pac 10, etc...

Right now they are just playing the hand that they are dealt to full effect. I believe those teams are better off as outsiders because I do not believe they would be as competitive in a major conference and their wins make a mockery of the current BCS system. It is fun to watch and it is exactly what the BCS deserves. Do I respect them? Sure. Are they the best in the country? Hell no.
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#68
#68
While I am a HUGE proponent of a playoff system, I don't think that it's the end answer to all this debate. Say Boise runs the table, makes the "playoffs", wins three-four playoff games and wins the NC. There will still be plenty of people walking around saying "the only reason BSU made the playoffs was because they're in a weak conference and played cupcakes all year".

A "strong" conference doth not a great team make, in my opinion. Take a look at the Big East - where is the strength there?! They don't appear to have much better strength than some of the "lower-tier" conferences out west and they get an automatic bid for heaven's sake!

I think that wholesale conference realignment is in order. "Spreading the wealth" so to speak by evenly distributing the traditionally strong programs in to conferences with the newer and weaker teams. It would kill some traditional rivalries and that would be a shame but if CFB is going to continue to separate the "power" conferences from the "also-rans" and go out of its way to keep teams like Boise out of the NC game then it seems to be the only solution.

I know that this will likely never happen but in my perfect world the NCAA would set the conferences and every school's schedule. This would make CFB a true "level playing field".

It's a radical idea that sounds sort of like "socialized football" however I am a staunch conservative :)

The root of the problem is that with the current system we will never know if Boise can be successful facing an SEC-type schedule because they will never have that opportunity. I believe that last year Boise issued a challenge to play any team, anywhere and got no bites. They will never be invited to a stronger conference because of their market and academics and they will play fewer games against "powerhouse" teams. So what are their options? Just keep winning and hope to end up in a meaningless BCS bowl game (and let's face it - they are ALL meaningless except for the NC game).

Is the point of college football great competition or making money? I guess it depends on who you ask..
 
#69
#69
kptvol said:
Will not happen. The BCS was created by a pro-playoff guy because as a substitute for the impossible playoff.
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Yeah , well they don't have a good argument against it. They can keep their precious trash bowl or toilet bowls. Just put in a 8 team, 4 team, something. Teams like Boise screw this thing up every year. Let them into that playoff and let them prove it. Teams shouldn't be awarded NC games just because a few buttheads think they deserve it. Make them earn it.
 
#70
#70
I'd love to see Utah win the PAC 12, just to shut up the "conference quos"
 
#71
#71
MDBJJC said:
I'd love to see Utah win the PAC 12, just to shut up the "conference quos"
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It would prove absolutely nothing. If they win that conference, and I'm sure they will one day, it will not be as a true outsider. They will have all of the advantages that being in a major conference carries.
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#72
#72
I's like to see a 16-team playoff format. Every conference champion gets in and have 4 at large bids, and have a seeding system similar to how BB does it in the NCAA tourney.
Weaker conferences get the crap seeds..and the big boys get the best seeds.
 
#73
#73
Every year the media says, "this is the year for them to prove themselves!" Yeah, they just beat a top 10 team on national TV, but did they not do something to a similar effect last season?

They didn't get bumped into national title consideration by beating Oregon last season (who went on to play in the Rose Bowl). It is always the same; they start out in the top 5, the media says this is the year, they beat the teams they needed to beat and everyone else, and by seasons end they don't get a sniff at the title game.

I don't see how it is going to be any different this season either. Even if Alabama lost 1 game if they beat Florida in the SEC Championship they will leap frog BS, and you can say that for other teams as well.
 
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#75
#75
kptvol said:
Will not happen. The BCS was created by a pro-playoff guy because as a substitute for the impossible playoff.
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Why is a playoff impossible? Every other division of football has one.
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