Tony Dungy Stepping down

#76
#76
Vercingetorix said:
I didn't call him a "joke"; he just can't win in the playoffs. I'm sure he's a great guy, revered by everybody, etc. etc., but I've never seen any evidence that he does much to earn his reputation other than stand on the sideline while Peyton Manning plays offense. (Dungy's a defensive guy, right? They why have they pretty much sucked on that side of the ball almost every year?) He clearly never figured out football in Janary, If I were a Colts fan, I'd be pretty sick of racking up all those 11-win seasons and then flaming out in the playoffs. I mean, for all those great teams, Dungy's Colts only even made it to the AFC Championship game twice. That's failure.
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Hahaha, that is an oxymoron. You can sit there and give all of the credit to Peyton and none to Tony. Fine.

But Tony Dungy's defenses did just fine, and by they way the worst year they had on defense, they magically shut down everyone throughout the playoffs and carried the Colts to a Super Bowl win.

I don't know who you may be a fan of, but I am willing to bet the coach of your favorite team comes nowhere close to Dungy unless you are a patriots fan.

If TD is a failure, what are all the other coaches in the league? They must not deserve to even step on a football field.
 
#77
#77
The Colts have been the best team in the NFL a few times during the Dungy era. During some of those years they looked like the worst team in the playoffs. Take from that what you will.
 
#78
#78
OHvol40 said:
Hahaha, that is an oxymoron. You can sit there and give all of the credit to Peyton and none to Tony. Fine.

But Tony Dungy's defenses did just fine, and by they way the worst year they had on defense, they magically shut down everyone throughout the playoffs and carried the Colts to a Super Bowl win.

I don't know who you may be a fan of, but I am willing to bet the coach of your favorite team comes nowhere close to Dungy unless you are a patriots fan.

If TD is a failure, what are all the other coaches in the league? They must not deserve to even step on a football field.
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Before the Colts hired Tony Dungy, they had an offensive team based around the Peyton Manning/Marvin Harrison duo that flamed out early in the playoffs. After they hired Dungy....well, they still had an offensive team based around Manning/Harrison that flamed out early in the playoffs. That's the bottom line. If Dungy were truly the great coach that everyone seems to be claiming he is, then you would have expected him to move the needle a little more than that.

I mean, in his seven years in Indy, the Colts went one-and-out in the playoffs four times -- including teams that finished 14-2, 13-3, 12-4, and 10-6. He's basically Marty Schottenheimer, if you gave Schottenheimer better players. But yet Schottenheimer is regarded as a joke, while people are wringing their hands over Dungy as though we're losing one of the immortals.

I have no problem with Dungy; he's a decent pro coach. (So is Schottenheimer.) I just don't understand the hagiography that seems to be going on here. And I can understand why Colts fans might be sick of seeing the same movie over and over and over again.

(In fact, since my original post in the thread, I've talked to a friend of mine who roots for the Colts, and he at least is ecstatic. Rough quote: "Nothing against Tony himself, but I'm just glad he quit while Peyton still has a few years left in him. I knew we were gonna lose that game when it turned out to be the Chargers instead of the Broncos. I've never been able to figure out what Dungy's doing over on the sideline during all these playoffs chokes to keep it from happening -- he seems to be pretty much just watching the game play out along with the rest of us.")

kptvol said:
The Colts have been the best team in the NFL a few times during the Dungy era. During some of those years they looked like the worst team in the playoffs. Take from that what you will.
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Exactly.
 
#79
#79
volsgal03 said:
When I saw him interviewed a few weeks ago, I got the feeling he was going to leave the colts. I wish him all the best.
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he almost retired last year. i saw this coming, but didnt want it to. anyway, go Coach Caldwell!

I advise reading his book
 
#80
#80
Vercingetorix said:
Before the Colts hired Tony Dungy, they had an offensive team based around the Peyton Manning/Marvin Harrison duo that flamed out early in the playoffs. After they hired Dungy....well, they still had an offensive team based around Manning/Harrison that flamed out early in the playoffs. That's the bottom line. If Dungy were truly the great coach that everyone seems to be claiming he is, then you would have expected him to move the needle a little more than that.

I mean, in his seven years in Indy, the Colts went one-and-out in the playoffs four times -- including teams that finished 14-2, 13-3, 12-4, and 10-6. He's basically Marty Schottenheimer, if you gave Schottenheimer better players. But yet Schottenheimer is regarded as a joke, while people are wringing their hands over Dungy as though we're losing one of the immortals.

I have no problem with Dungy; he's a decent pro coach. (So is Schottenheimer.) I just don't understand the hagiography that seems to be going on here. And I can understand why Colts fans might be sick of seeing the same movie over and over and over again.

(In fact, since my original post in the thread, I've talked to a friend of mine who roots for the Colts, and he at least is ecstatic. Rough quote: "Nothing against Tony himself, but I'm just glad he quit while Peyton still has a few years left in him. I knew we were gonna lose that game when it turned out to be the Chargers instead of the Broncos. I've never been able to figure out what Dungy's doing over on the sideline during all these playoffs chokes to keep it from happening -- he seems to be pretty much just watching the game play out along with the rest of us.")



Exactly.
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how many rings has schottenheimer got? i'd say dungy is more like bob stoops. it's pure hypocrisy that you have praised stoops in some of your posts.
 
#81
#81
Vercingetorix said:
Before the Colts hired Tony Dungy, they had an offensive team based around the Peyton Manning/MAfter arvin Harrison duo that flamed out early in the playoffs. they hired Dungy....well, they still had an offensive team based around Manning/Harrison that flamed out early in the playoffs. That's the bottom line.

how many super bowls had peyton and harrison won before dungy. that's the bottom line. i hate the colts but i respect anyone that has coached a super bowl winning team. there have been many great teams and coaches that have come short of the ultimate goal.
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#83
#83
BigPapaVol said:
compare the talent.
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dungy had talent in tampa. dungy had talent in indy. every coach needs talent. jj had talent, parcells had talent, knoll had talent, walsh had talent, etc. etc. that excuse is getting old. gruden is a good coach as is dungy, i don't know who's better. but i can't love one and hate the other, they're both winners.
 
#84
#84
thagodfather said:
dungy had talent in tampa. dungy had talent in indy. every coach needs talent. jj had talent, parcells had talent, knoll had talent, walsh had talent, etc. etc. that excuse is getting old. gruden is a good coach as is dungy, i don't know who's better. but i can't love one and hate the other, they're both winners.
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but the falloff in Tampa, which you were using to make a point about the relative ability of the coaches, was precipitated by a loss of talent on both sides of the ball. They were starting Chris Simms for goodness' sake.
 
#85
#85
BigPapaVol said:
but the falloff in Tampa, which you were using to make a point about the relative ability of the coaches, was precipitated by a loss of talent on both sides of the ball. They were starting Chris Simms for goodness' sake.
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no i wasn't. the firing of tony dungy was brought up and i pointed out that gruden should have been fired a couple of seasons ago if tampa's management was using the same standard whether to retain a coach or not. that was my point, not which was the better coach.
 
#86
#86
thagodfather said:
no i wasn't. the firing of tony dungy was brought up and i pointed out that gruden should have been fired a couple of seasons ago if tampa's management was using the same standard whether to retain a coach or not. that was my point, not which was the better coach.
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I misunderstood. In fact, I still don't understand. Coaches get fired for underperforming expectations. Dungy did it regularly and Gruden didn't.
 
#87
#87
thagodfather said:
how many super bowls had peyton and harrison won before dungy. that's the bottom line. i hate the colts but i respect anyone that has coached a super bowl winning team. there have been many great teams and coaches that have come short of the ultimate goal.
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Manning and Harrison had four years without Dungy. They did not win a Super Bowl in those 4 years. They did not win a Super Bowl until Dungy's 5th year.
 
#88
#88
BigPapaVol said:
I misunderstood. In fact, I still don't understand. Coaches get fired for underperforming expectations. Dungy did it regularly and Gruden didn't.
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gruden has had playoff caliber teams and not made the playoffs. i would call that under performing. that's not hard to understand. i'm done with this argument, however. everyone has an opinion on this.
 
#89
#89
thagodfather said:
gruden has had playoff caliber teams and not made the playoffs. i would call that under performing. that's not hard to understand. i'm done with this argument, however. everyone has an opinion on this.
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really. which team of Gruden's was playoff caliber. Hell, half the ones that made it weren't playoff caliber.
 
#90
#90
thagodfather said:
gruden has had playoff caliber teams and not made the playoffs. i would call that under performing. that's not hard to understand. i'm done with this argument, however. everyone has an opinion on this.
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Dungy has had Super Bowl champion caliber teams and not made it out of the first round.
 
#93
#93
thagodfather said:
for the most part the new england patriots were the blame for the colt's shortcomings, not tony dungy.
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They played a part. The Colts should have spanked the Steelers in 2005. The Chargers this year and last year weren't any good. The playoff loss to the Pats in 2004 was a joke. They didn't even show up. 2002... lost by 41 to the Jets.

2003 and 2006 were really the only years they weren't horrible in the playoffs.
 
#96
#96
thagodfather said:
how many rings has schottenheimer got? i'd say dungy is more like bob stoops. it's pure hypocrisy that you have praised stoops in some of your posts.
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You clearly have me confused with some other idiot, because I don't remember talking about Stoops at all recently. That said, Stoops wins conference championships, which is the measure of a college coach. Dungy loses playoff games, which is the measure of a pro coach.

thagodfather said:
how many super bowls had peyton and harrison won before dungy. that's the bottom line. i hate the colts but i respect anyone that has coached a super bowl winning team. there have been many great teams and coaches that have come short of the ultimate goal.
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Hats off to the Colts for winning their ring. It's a great accomplishment, the highest achievement in the profession. However, it's not by itself an indicator of "greatness" -- at least, not unless you consider guys like Tom Flores, George Seifert, Barry Switzer, Dick Vermeil, and Brian Billick to be "great" coaches" too. Great coaches win Super Bowls, but not every coach who wins one is great.
 
#98
#98
kptvol said:
They played a part. The Colts should have spanked the Steelers in 2005. The Chargers this year and last year weren't any good. The playoff loss to the Pats in 2004 was a joke. They didn't even show up. 2002... lost by 41 to the Jets.

2003 and 2006 were really the only years they weren't horrible in the playoffs.
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i biased but, i don't think so. the steelers were champions that year. the chargers have been pretty good for a while and at 12-4 the colt's playing in san diego against an 8-8 team is ridiculous. i agree, they still shouldn't have lost. when you lose to the eventually champions, which they have done a few times, it's hard to say that you should have won.
 
#99
#99
Vercingetorix said:
You clearly have me confused with some other idiot, because I don't remember talking about Stoops at all recently. That said, Stoops wins conference championships, which is the measure of a college coach. Dungy loses playoff games, which is the measure of a pro coach.



Hats off to the Colts for winning their ring. It's a great accomplishment, the highest achievement in the profession. However, it's not by itself an indicator of "greatness" -- at least, not unless you consider guys like Tom Flores, George Seifert, Barry Switzer, Dick Vermeil, and Brian Billick to be "great" coaches" too. Great coaches win Super Bowls, but not every coach who wins one is great.
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is bob stoops a great college coach?
 
#100
#100
thagodfather said:
i biased but, i don't think so. the steelers were champions that year. the chargers have been pretty good for a while and at 12-4 the colt's playing in san diego against an 8-8 team is ridiculous. i agree, they still shouldn't have lost. when you lose to the eventually champions, which they have done a few times, it's hard to say that you should have won.
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I agree the Colts having to travel was stupid. That said, winning isn't supposed to be easy. The Steelers were pretty good in 2005. However, the Colts were better. The Colts were just as capable of beating that Seahawks team. They also won like 13 games that year and were able to beat the Steelers in the regular season. Even with the insanely horrible call overruling Troy Palomalu's INT, the Colts still couldn't win.
 
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