Vaccine or not?

#4,276
#4,276
AshG said:
Those of you who are still vaccine hesitant and have not had Covid, what is the information you are waiting to have addressed that will appreciate your hesitancy?
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As someone who has had Chinese Flu and survived, I can tell you that I am waiting for the hysteria over simply being vaccinated to subside and to see recognition of what is really important, and that is IMMUNITY, regardless of how it is obtained. And as it turns out, there is only one way so far to obtain that.
 
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#4,277
#4,277
AshG said:
Thank you. The name callers here are actually the outliers, they're just easier to remember.

I falter and stumbled sometimes - I am mostly human, after all - but I think if everyone tried to approach difficult subjects with curiosity and empathy instead of with swords drawn we'd find most of our differences are artificial and overestimated.
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Depends on who our differences are with: Irrational people or rational ones.

Here's another, more shadowy reason why I think some are not getting the vaccine: The fact that US health officials have been sending money to a lab controlled by the ChiComs for research into viruses, and tried to cover that up. We know these things are fact.

But we don't know why. Think about it for a second: Why would ANY US government official send money to ANYTHING controlled by the Chinese Communist Party/Government/military? Rand Paul says our officials should have known the money would be used for gain of function (i.e engineering of the virus to make it more potent), and our officials say it wasn't intended for that. Fauci received an email from a top virologist in the early days of the pandemic. The virologist said it looks engineered to him. Later, he and Fauci and others signed a letter demonizing anyone who thought the virus came from that lab. A year later, after anyone speculating about it was condemned and called ugly names, these very people are saying yes, it probably did come from that lab. So, was it engineered or not? Why did our virology and public health policy officials act the way they acted early in the pandemic to quash speculation about the virus and the lab?

If it was engineered, what implications does that have for mutations? Most mutations of natural viruses are weaker than the original. And yet we have a delta variant much more contagious than the original. Why?

And what does all of that have to do with vaccine hesitancy? Well, why take a vaccine with possible harmful side effects if it isn't going to protect you from the next variant? And if the original was indeed engineered, how many more of these lethal variants are waiting for us round the corner? What good would a vaccine do us if it will be obsolete very soon?
 
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#4,278
#4,278
youcancallmeAl said:
Well, why take a vaccine with possible harmful side effects if it isn't going to protect you from the next variant? And if the original was indeed engineered, how many more of these lethal variants are waiting for us round the corner? What good would a vaccine do us if it will be obsolete very soon?
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^^^^^THIS^^^^^RIGHT^^^^^HERE^^^^^
 
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#4,279
#4,279
youcancallmeAl said:
And what does all of that have to do with vaccine hesitancy? Well, why take a vaccine with possible harmful side effects if it isn't going to protect you from the next variant? And if the original was indeed engineered, how many more of these lethal variants are waiting for us round the corner? What good would a vaccine do us if it will be obsolete very soon?
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Because getting a shot is better than being sick for a week?
 
#4,280
#4,280
AshG said:
Those of you who are still vaccine hesitant and have not had Covid, what is the information you are waiting to have addressed that will appreciate your hesitancy?
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More time. We have no idea what he long term effects of these vaccines/therapeutics are. We just had Pfizer release a new list of side effects just this week. The info is slowly trickling out. I don't see what the hurry is for wanting to get everyone jabbed up with a virus that has a 99.5% survival rate and why they are only leaning towards the vaccines to be the only option when there are several therapeutics that are out there.
 
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#4,283
#4,283
NEO said:
27 on a cruise, I believe Carnival, who were vaccinated just caught it.
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Question: These cruise ships that have all of their passengers vaccinated... do they still unload passengers at ports and allow them to do excursions? Doesn't that defeat the purpose if the island or port residents can still be a source of infection?

May as well just have the boat just sit at the dock in Ft. Lauderdale for 4 days instead of risking have an island native infect everyone.
 
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#4,284
#4,284
AthensVol2007 said:
So other Dr’s viewpoints aren’t considered relevant? Watch Pandemic on Netflix, UCSF is is heavily involved in vaccine/virus research, they’re fully invested in this. The CDC and WHO have proven to be extremely reliable and apolitical….
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This article printed the viewpoints of other doctors, which you then tried to marginalize by saying it was “journalists” fact-checking this one doctor. So maybe you should ask yourself that.
Worst thing the article did was act like their citations closed the discussion, which in my opinion is pretty easy to get past as it doesn’t go much to the substance of the content and is easy enough to read past.
 
#4,285
#4,285
Velo Vol said:
Because getting a shot is better than being sick for a week?
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The shot itself makes some people sick for the first week or few days. And how do you know the shot won't make you very sick via some unknown side effect a year or two or three down the line? It isn't just some "shot", it is an experimental type of vaccination for which there is no long term side effects data. You might call it a shot in the dark.
 
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#4,286
#4,286
RockyTop85 said:
This article printed the viewpoints of other doctors, which you then tried to marginalize by saying it was “journalists” fact-checking this one doctor. So maybe you should ask yourself that.
Worst thing the article did was act like their citations closed the discussion, which in my opinion is pretty easy to get past as it doesn’t go much to the substance of the content and is easy enough to read past.
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The journalist labeled his claims as false simply by citing dissenting viewpoints/conclusions from other Dr’s. They are telling society that a Dr. is wrong and spreading misinformation based on that information. There are also studies according to multiple Dr’s, including one from John’s Hopkins, that says masks are negligible to non-effective. Myriad of Dr’s who are worried about the potential side effects, or just the facts of the unknown, with the concept of mRNA vaccines. Robert Redfield just this past week said that he’s seen no data or study that supports masking kids in school, and if he finds it grounded in science/data then he’ll support it. Are they going to cancel the former director of the CDC? Actually they will; he said he’s already been sidelined, ousted and chastised for having nuanced views on the entire Covid situation. You’re an ostrich if you don’t think or see that there’s but one viewpoint allowed today and anything that is the antithesis of that viewpoint is false & worthy of being labeled as such.
 
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#4,287
#4,287
Rasputin_Vol said:
Question: These cruise ships that have all of their passengers vaccinated... do they still unload passengers at ports and allow them to do excursions? Doesn't that defeat the purpose if the island or port residents can still be a source of infection?

May as well just have the boat just sit at the dock in Ft. Lauderdale for 4 days instead of risking have an island native infect everyone.
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I can see that point.

My biggest issue is why take a vaccine that does not prevent me from getting sick but supposedly prevents me free dying from a virus with a 1 percent death rate. I just don’t see the gain at all.
 
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#4,288
#4,288
NEO said:
I can see that point.

My biggest issue is why take a vaccine that does not prevent me from getting sick but supposedly prevents me free dying from a virus with a 1 percent death rate. I just don’t see the gain at all.
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That's just it... they are not vaccines... or at least not vaccines in the traditional sense. Normally, a "vaccine" contains a weakened form of the virus that is injected and the body fights of the weakened and builds up antibodies. Then when the "real" virus is encountered, the body already has antibodies built up and is (usually) able to fight it off.

I am of the belief (my opinion) that what we have are therapeutics. They do not prevent the body from being infected. What they do is minimize the severity of the infection by having the body create antibodies that are supposed to overwhelm the virus (from my understanding).

IMO, I think more can be determined about the effectiveness of this method if we have one more winter/flu season cycle. I think most of the vaccine hesitant would likely come over to get the jab next year, assuming all things are clear. I would (probably) include myself in that group. Plus that reflects the opinion of most of the people that I know that are not vaccinated yet.
 
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#4,289
#4,289
Rasputin_Vol said:
That's just it... they are not vaccines... or at least not vaccines in the traditional sense. Normally, a "vaccine" contains a weakened form of the virus that is injected and the body fights of the weakened and builds up antibodies. Then when the "real" virus is encountered, the body already has antibodies built up and is (usually) able to fight it off.

I am of the belief (my opinion) that what we have are therapeutics. They do not prevent the body from being infected. What they do is minimize the severity of the infection by having the body create antibodies that are supposed to overwhelm the virus (from my understanding).

IMO, I think more can be determined about the effectiveness of this method if we have one more winter/flu season cycle. I think most of the vaccine hesitant would likely come over to get the jab next year, assuming all things are clear. I would (probably) include myself in that group. Plus that reflects the opinion of most of the people that I know that are not vaccinated yet.
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Do you not find it weird that we heard nothing of the flu last year or flu deaths?
 
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#4,292
#4,292
Rasputin_Vol said:
That's just it... they are not vaccines... or at least not vaccines in the traditional sense. Normally, a "vaccine" contains a weakened form of the virus that is injected and the body fights of the weakened and builds up antibodies. Then when the "real" virus is encountered, the body already has antibodies built up and is (usually) able to fight it off.

I am of the belief (my opinion) that what we have are therapeutics. They do not prevent the body from being infected. What they do is minimize the severity of the infection by having the body create antibodies that are supposed to overwhelm the virus (from my understanding).

IMO, I think more can be determined about the effectiveness of this method if we have one more winter/flu season cycle. I think most of the vaccine hesitant would likely come over to get the jab next year, assuming all things are clear. I would (probably) include myself in that group. Plus that reflects the opinion of most of the people that I know that are not vaccinated yet.
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All the vaccines are designed to cause the body to develop antibodies. The J&J is more of a traditional vaccine using a weakened form of the virus. The way I understand it the mrna vaccines use a copy of the spike that attaches to cells to cause the body to form antibodies. If I'm wrong I'll yield to the experts.
 
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#4,293
#4,293
InVOLuntary said:
All the vaccines are designed to cause the body to develop antibodies. The J&J is more of a traditional vaccine using a weakened form of the virus. The way I understand it the mrna vaccines us a copy of the spike that attaches to cells to cause the body to form antibodies. If I'm wrong I'll yield to the experts.
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Nope, you've got it.
 
#4,295
#4,295
Weezer said:
Nope, but if people choose to leave themselves vulnerable, that's on them. If you're vaccinated you're supposed to be protected. Also, if you're vaccinated and get a "breakthrough" case, it's not supposed to be as bad. So as long as YOU are vaccinated, you should be fine. Let other people do as they choose. It's called freedom.
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You should look up ADE.
 
#4,296
#4,296
Impossible Girl said:
Likely nothing. The vaccine itself doesn’t stay and is broken down pretty quick. It’s the residual antibody protection that remains.
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Likely???? That doesn't give me hard data...Covid will Likely not kill me....you will likely not get into a car accident..those experiences have proven data to back them up...except the vax
 
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#4,298
#4,298
marcusluvsvols said:
Well said comrade.

since youre apparently a free born American citizen...i might suggest some reading on the founding fathers, Constitution, why this country seceded (other than taxation without proper representation), the Bill of Rights, personal Freedoms , and perhaps not acting like a pinko commie beitch .





This too. Plus, not trying to force your ill founded faith in untested medicines on other free citizens like a pinko commie bei...
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Lmao
 
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#4,299
#4,299
whodeycin85 said:
Likely???? That doesn't give me hard data...Covid will Likely not kill me....you will likely not get into a car accident..those experiences have proven data to back them up...except the vax
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If you want to gamble that be my guest. There is actually a lot of hard data on Covid and the vaccine. My classmate who died at 52 from Covid doesn’t have the choice anymore.

Of course I had another fiend who was intubated and in a coma for 3 weeks tell me not to get the vaccine.

Personally I would like to see a more concerted effort on therapeutics like regeneron, it again you’re still putting a substance in your body. Hillarious that people will go to a Tack store and by ivermectin paste and eat it but won’t take a vaccine.
 
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