Vaccine or not?

[LouderVol]

You still don't get it. Employees can demand raises, all day every day. If they don't get what they want, they have the power to terminate their employment. You seem to believe that employers hold all the cards, they don't.

I find it ironic that you'd try to point out a 'huge' difference after trying to conflate criminals having the ability to leave the US before prosecution with the principle of at will employment.

I was pointing out the fallacy in Waffle's argument, sorry if not waffle. He defined force as only physically making someone. I pointed out how we have established force as far far more than that, especially when it comes to government action. Only under his definition would fleeing jail not constitute force. You may want to keep up.

Clearly you arent following the actual conversation either, because I am against what Texas is doing to businesses.

 

[LouderVol]

I have no dog in your unjust justice system fight.

What I do know is that you're selling the power of employees short.

As if on que: A record number of workers are quitting their jobs, empowered by new leverage (msn.com)

Sorry, I have had my pay docked, not been informed, recieved a pay check saw the difference. Talked with my boss, told it must be an HR issue to take it up with them. By the time I got a straight answer from HR another pay check had come and gone for me to figure out pay had been changed without informing me.

I cant think of a similar circumstance an employee has. Unless his boss was so bad as to not notice him not working at all but for some reason still paying the employee.

Never said employees were powerless, so nice straw man.

 

[SlipKidVol]

My company is not doing anything until there are office guidlines. They have, however, already stated several times that they wil not, on their own, make a mandate themselves

 

[Septic]

Thank god Dr Gottlieb who sits on the board for Pfizer and Illumina doesn’t think governors should be able to block vaccine mandates.

I wouldn’t know who to trust if it wasn’t for him, ya know the guy getting paid hundreds of thousand if not millions of dollars by Pfizer.

Also 53 seconds in let’s you know where this guy is.

Be sure to chime in with your support of government interference in business when the next baker gets sued for not making a gay cake.

 

[Septic]

Sorry, I have had my pay docked, not been informed, recieved a pay check saw the difference. Talked with my boss, told it must be an HR issue to take it up with them. By the time I got a straight answer from HR another pay check had come and gone for me to figure out pay had been changed without informing me.

I cant think of a similar circumstance an employee has. Unless his boss was so bad as to not notice him not working at all but for some reason still paying the employee.

Never said employees were powerless, so nice straw man.

Your anecdotal example of you not seeking legal remedy to the issue is noted.

You implied and continue to imply through your own story of paycheck shenanigans that you believe the employees are powerless. Also, it wouldn't be a strawman since the crux of the conversation is literally about the employee/employer dynamic.

 

[LouderVol]

Your anecdotal example of you not seeking legal remedy to the issue is noted.

You implied and continue to imply through your own story of paycheck shenanigans that you believe the employees are powerless. Also, it wouldn't be a strawman since the crux of the conversation is literally about the employee/employer dynamic.

I did quit. After I was powerless for two weeks to get the truth that pay had been changed. Exactly what recourse did I have, and would it have been worth the legal fees? Because I thought you were saying they could just change my pay at will, and that was the legal advice I got.

 

[Fun coupon VOL]

Be sure to chime in with your support of government interference in business when the next baker gets sued for not making a gay cake.

nice leap.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Large Canadian Town Bars Unvaccinated Couples From Getting Married | ZeroHedge

 

[RockyTop85]

I think the base of the constitution prohibition is an extremely high/low bar. Considering that the document allows for changes and laws based in a democratic process, what is or isnt overreach can extend beyond immediate issues of Constitutionality.

Especially in regards to presidential actions. Many have been ruled unconstitutional and gone thru. Lincoln is a favorite to point at, John Marshall may have an opinion on the matter too.

I think that kind of opinion typically falls under one of the two categories I listed.

Of course there can be discussion of a better set of limits on government, but that’s almost never what it’s about on here, in my experience.

 

[LouderVol]

I think that kind of opinion typically falls under one of the two categories I listed.

Of course there can be discussion of a better set of limits on government, but that’s almost never what it’s about on here, in my experience.

I agree. It's why I called out ND40.

 

[Septic]

nice leap.

It's not a leap - either you advocate for a laissez-faire approach or you don't.

I do.

I believe in less regulation in every aspect of the government/business relationship. You must not if you believe what I stated was a "leap".

 

[NorthDallas40]

I agree. It's why I called out ND40.

Call me out all you like. Abbott’s action is a perfectly reasonable response to Biden’s action which isn’t even within his authority with regard to directly forcing a citizen’s action. I’d rather we didn’t have either action but in the case where Biden forced the issue Abbott’s response is called for to reset the status quo. Since OSHA’s inception in 1970 there has never been an instance where vaccination was mandated in the workplace and the current situation doesn’t warrant it either

 

[tnmarktx]

 

[tnmarktx]

 

[tnmarktx]

 

[Fun coupon VOL]

It's not a leap - either you advocate for a laissez-faire approach or you don't.

I do.

I believe in less regulation in every aspect of the government/business relationship. You must not if you believe what I stated was a "leap".

You are basing your statement on a business providing a service vs a business mandating medical demands on their employees.

Also, why limit it to 100 employees?

 

[VolinWayne]

It's not a leap - either you advocate for a laissez-faire approach or you don't.

I do.

I believe in less regulation in every aspect of the government/business relationship. You must not if you believe what I stated was a "leap".

If you truly felt this way you'd be condemning your fake president for all of the mandates he's tried to force businesses into.

 

[VolStrom]

Call me out all you like. Abbott’s action is a perfectly reasonable response to Biden’s the handlers action which isn’t even within his authority with regard to directly forcing a citizen’s action. I’d rather we didn’t have either action but in the case where Biden the handlers forced the issue Abbott’s response is called for to reset the status quo. Since OSHA’s inception in 1970 there has never been an instance where vaccination was mandated in the workplace and the current situation doesn’t warrant it either

FYP

 

[NorthDallas40]

With regard to the Abbott EO, both Southwest and American Airlines have stated at least for now it changes nothing as they are federal contractors. Not a peep from my company yet except they indicated in prior communications they would respect state and local laws in which the Montana example was explicitly offered where they will require testing to enter company facilities.

 

[NorthDallas40]

FYP

A reasonable update.

 

[Septic]

You are basing your statement on a business providing a service vs a business mandating medical demands on their employees.

Also, why limit it to 100 employees?

No, you're trying to squeeze in a distinction that makes you feel better about the mental gymnastics you're engaged in.

Either you believe the government should force their will into private business decisions or you don't. Being a feckless bandwagoner and riding your feels from one policy decision to the next is what I'd expect from the most unprincipled among us.

Does that describe you?

 

[VolStrom]

With regard to the Abbott EO, both Southwest and American Airlines have stated at least for now it changes nothing as they are federal contractors. Not a peep from my company yet except they indicated in prior communications they would respect state and local laws in which the Montana example was explicitly offered where they will require testing to enter company facilities.

If Biden's make America better plan continues, I might have to go back to work and make $800k a year just because the country has no people left that know wtf they're doing.

 

[Septic]

If you truly felt this way you'd be condemning your fake president for all of the mandates he's tried to force businesses into.

I absolutely think Biden is wrong in requiring the businesses require the shot or terminate the employees who don't get it.

Does that make you feel better? Also, when you say "fake" president - did you mean the President who keeps winning the same states over and over and over again? That fake president?

 

[NorthDallas40]

If Biden's make America better plan continues, I might have to go back to work and make $800k a year just because the country has no people left that know wtf they're doing.

I’m actually in the opposite camp. As each day passes I can’t wait till I can just give the company and DoD the finger and ride off into the sunset. I won’t say their isn’t enough money to get me to come back but I don’t think I’m worth the money and conditions it would take to get me to come back part time.

 

[Sandman 423]

I absolutely think Biden is wrong in arbitrarily making the businesses require the shot or terminate the employees who don't get it.

Does that make you feel better? Also, when you say "fake" president - did you mean the President who keeps winning the same states over and over and over again? That fake president?

I got a warm fuzzy feeling from it.............. or it could be a stro