Vaccine or not?

#20,001
#20,001
OHvol40 said:
I don’t think we’re on the same page here. Ok… Yeah, PCPs are fine, important even. But there are HC professionals (mostly community/public health nurses, but also epidemiologists, biologists, social workers, etc.) whose entire job is to promote health within a population. They could be employed by your city, county, state, religious establishment, civic organization, school… but their purpose is to monitor and assess the overall health and health trends within a given population and try to address any prevailing issues. They also help create emergency preparedness plans as well as addressing communicable diseases within the community.


For instance, in my county there is a high rate of Lyme Disease compared to the rest of the state, so the community health nurse employed by my county has started an education program addressing tick bite prevention & treatment and presents it to rod & gun clubs, local park rangers, bicycling clubs, kayaking groups, schools, and so on.

These individuals are also charged with promoting vaccinations for the wellness of their community. These people aren’t behind some conspiracy to force people to take an unsafe vaccine, sorry. They use evidence based practice to steer public health, and that hasn’t changed during COVID.
Click to expand...
And I never called out those individuals. I have been pretty specific in stating the CDC or FDA pushing one size fits all strategies.

But I really doubt those people, especially social workers, know enough to really know why a particular vaccine should or should not be taken when talking about specific individuals.

I am just not comfortable with any institution pushing such slanted advertising as I have seen with the Covid vaccines.
 
#20,002
#20,002
DC_Vol said:
There probably was no need to run an intensive vaccine campaign, as just about everyone knew it was available.

But, yeah, if they were to run one they should have been honest about the knows and unknowns and left it up to each individual to decide. Now these campaigns have lost a lot of credibility due to the dishonesty within them. What’s not said is often more important that what is.
Click to expand...
I am unaware of both widespread local public/community health workers spreading misinformation as well as any instances where the public health community has forced anyone to get a vaccine. Maybe you can shed light on that.
 
#20,003
#20,003
LouderVol said:
And I never called out those individuals. I have been pretty specific in stating the CDC or FDA pushing one size fits all strategies.

But I really doubt those people, especially social workers, know enough to really know why a particular vaccine should or should not be taken when talking about specific individuals.

I am just not comfortable with any institution pushing such slanted advertising as I have seen with the Covid vaccines.
Click to expand...
Community health workers are precisely qualified to distribute information about who should get a vaccine and why. I’m not sure who you think is more qualified.
 
#20,005
#20,005
OHvol40 said:
I am unaware of both widespread local public/community health workers spreading misinformation as well as any instances where the public health community has forced anyone to get a vaccine. Maybe you can shed light on that.
Click to expand...

I am aware that the local ones where I am presented no downsides to the vaccine.

I never said or implied the bolded. Not sure who you are arguing with there.

In essence, I’m agreeing that any public vaccine campaign should be: we’ve got it, study the pros and cons, and make a choice individually. That is not really what happened, though.
 
#20,006
#20,006
DC_Vol said:
I am aware that the local ones where I am presented no downsides to the vaccine.

I never said or implied the bolded. Not sure who you are arguing with there.

In essence, I’m agreeing that any public vaccine campaign should be: we’ve got it, study the pros and cons, and make a choice individually. That is not really what happened, though.
Click to expand...
1. What did happen at the local level, then?

2. You said “it should be left up to the individual to decide.” So you either implied the bolded or you are incenserely raising a false concern, as I pointed out. It has always been, and remains up to the individual.
 
#20,007
#20,007
OHvol40 said:
1. What did happen at the local level, then?

2. You said “it should be left up to the individual to decide.” So you either implied the bolded or you are incenserely raising a false concern, as I pointed out. It has always been, and remains up to the individual.
Click to expand...

Good grief. You’re making this much more difficult than it needs to be, and I’m beginning to wonder why.

This post was what started this conversation.

OHvol40 said:
You think public health professionals should have run a vaccine campaign in which the theme was “We have a COVID vaccine, you can take it, or don’t, it’s up to you.” Really?
Click to expand...

My answer is, yes, really. From your own words above, you know this is not what happened. They did not present a complete picture of the knowns and unknowns. It was we all need to get the vaccine to be safe.
 
  • Like
Reactions: NurseGoodVol, 0nelilreb and red butler
#20,008
#20,008
OHvol40 said:
Community health workers are precisely qualified to distribute information about who should get a vaccine and why. I’m not sure who you think is more qualified.
Click to expand...
You specifically mentioned social workers as part of this apparatus. There is no way in heck some art school drop out is qualified to tell me about my health.

You seriously think most of those individuals are qualified to make their own personal judgement on: 1. The vaccine effectiveness and safety, and 2. Who should and/or should not be taking these vaccines? Sure they can speak in generalities about what some professional tells them to say, but that's not the judgement call people need from an actual health care professional trained to work with/on patients.

I am so glad we have such well trained social workers laying around that can take over the job of cops, and now doctors. JFC. I guess this is what happens when so many people get worthless degrees, they get in power and then find ways to justify their own existence over actual professionals.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Rickyvol77
#20,009
#20,009
DC_Vol said:
Good grief. You’re making this much more difficult than it needs to be, and I’m beginning to wonder why.

This post was what started this conversation.



My answer is, yes, really. From your own words above, you know this is not what happened. They did not present a complete picture of the knowns and unknowns. It was we all need to get the vaccine to be safe.
Click to expand...
And my points are:

1. No “They” did not. Though you need to explain who “they” are because I’ve made it very clear who specifically I’m speaking of.

2. The job of local level public/community health workers is to promote wellness within the community, which the COVID vaccine clearly qualifies for based on evidence-based practice.
 
#20,010
#20,010
LouderVol said:
You specifically mentioned social workers as part of this apparatus. There is no way in heck some art school drop out is qualified to tell me about my health.

You seriously think most of those individuals are qualified to make their own personal judgement on: 1. The vaccine effectiveness and safety, and 2. Who should and/or should not be taking these vaccines? Sure they can speak in generalities about what some professional tells them to say, but that's not the judgement call people need from an actual health care professional trained to work with/on patients.

I am so glad we have such well trained social workers laying around that can take over the job of cops, and now doctors. JFC. I guess this is what happens when so many people get worthless degrees, they get in power and then find ways to justify their own existence over actual professionals.
Click to expand...
You brought social workers into the equation regarding vaccines when I clearly was just using them amongst a host of examples to demonstrate there is an entire sector of HC workers that I don’t think you knew even existed.

Public healthcare workers have the same qualifications and often (much) more experience than the 20-something nurse on the med-surg floor at the hospital taking care of you after you get your gall bladder out. Specifically, the nurses that are trusted with public health positions often have graduate healthcare degrees and decades of patient care experience. They are absolutely qualified to determine who should and should not receive a vaccine, it’s quite literally one of the most important parts of their job description.

Please don’t argue about something you don’t know about.
 
#20,012
#20,012
OHvol40 said:
You think public health professionals should have run a vaccine campaign in which the theme was “We have a COVID vaccine, you can take it, or don’t, it’s up to you.” Really?
Click to expand...
OHvol40 said:
You think public health professionals should have run a vaccine campaign in which the theme was “We have a COVID vaccine, you can take it, or don’t, it’s up to you.” Really?
Click to expand...
as opposed I’m going to threaten your job if you don’t take this experimental gene therapy? Absolutely yes.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Rasputin_Vol, SpaceCoastVol and VolinWayne
#20,014
#20,014
OHvol40 said:
That’s hyperbole and also not the approach taken by community health workers.
Click to expand...
I’m not a community health worker. Hyperbole no. I received the same email as all my cohorts stating dates that I had to be immunized by or I would be put on unpaid leave until I did or barring an exemption. Ah, good times.
You can’t use evidence based practice if the evidence is hidden from you. Just like the CDC saying it is safe and effective. Given what I’ve seen in the original trials that was incorrect.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Rasputin_Vol
#20,015
#20,015
OHvol40 said:
You think public health professionals should have run a vaccine campaign in which the theme was “We have a COVID vaccine, you can take it, or don’t, it’s up to you.” Really?
Click to expand...
Yes - 100%

The attempt to control the narrative led to the CDC suppressing data so as “not to confuse the public”. How did that work out.
 
  • Like
Reactions: SpaceCoastVol
#20,016
#20,016
C-south said:
Heard a CDC advertisement on the radio the other day and the vaccine selling point was “vaccines help prevent severe illness”.
Click to expand...
That is the only selling point. Allot different than the roll out statements. They still aren’t listing the side effects in ads. If the government is running interference and paying for the ads for “ a vaccine” they don’t have to follow the law that applies to any other drugs as to listing side effects,
 
  • Like
Reactions: Rasputin_Vol
#20,017
#20,017
NurseGoodVol said:
I’m not a community health worker. Hyperbole no. I received the same email as all my cohorts stating dates that I had to be immunized by or I would be put on unpaid leave until I did or barring an exemption. Ah, good times.
You can’t use evidence based practice if the evidence is hidden from you. Just like the CDC saying it is safe and effective. Given what I’ve seen in the original trials that was incorrect.
Click to expand...
The evidence is in front of your face as a bedside nurse.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ohhbother
#20,018
#20,018
85SugarVol said:
Yes - 100%

The attempt to control the narrative led to the CDC suppressing data so as “not to confuse the public”. How did that work out.
Click to expand...
Everyone wants to invoke the CDC, that’s not relevant to this discussion. I’m talking about real people that work in your community to promote health and wellness.
 
#20,019
#20,019
OHvol40 said:
You brought social workers into the equation regarding vaccines when I clearly was just using them amongst a host of examples to demonstrate there is an entire sector of HC workers that I don’t think you knew even existed.

Public healthcare workers have the same qualifications and often (much) more experience than the 20-something nurse on the med-surg floor at the hospital taking care of you after you get your gall bladder out. Specifically, the nurses that are trusted with public health positions often have graduate healthcare degrees and decades of patient care experience. They are absolutely qualified to determine who should and should not receive a vaccine, it’s quite literally one of the most important parts of their job description.

Please don’t argue about something you don’t know about.
Click to expand...
They have 8 years of education and an MSN behind their name.
 
#20,020
#20,020
OHvol40 said:
Everyone wants to invoke the CDC, that’s not relevant to this discussion. I’m talking about real people that work in your community to promote health and wellness.
Click to expand...
What happened to the CDC was a direct result of trying to control the narrative - which was to push the vaccine.

Give people the facts. Then stop.
 
  • Like
Reactions: SpaceCoastVol, VolinWayne and 0nelilreb
#20,022
#20,022
85SugarVol said:
What happened to the CDC was a direct result of trying to control the narrative - which was to push the vaccine.

Give people the facts. Then stop.
Click to expand...
Again, this conversation had nothing to do with the CDC. You must be thinking of a different conversation.
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top