Venezuela's Triumphant Socialist Paradise

#1,005
#1,005
I have always wondered how we pull off putting sanctions on Russia...other countries, sure...but russia has a nuclear stockpile bigger than ours, and a very formidable military...I know its a UN thing and not just us...but I mean if we decide to freeze their assets, or embargo certain goods etc, whats to keep Russia from making it a dick measuring contest? I remember we had like 100s of millions of russian oligarchs dollars frozen in accounts in various world banks...whats to keep Putin from threatening retaliation against those huge banks? Hes not going to blow up Deutsch Bank headquarters in Europe, I get that...but these huge banks have billions of dollars tied up in say loans for infrastructure in developing countries, or oil fields in the middle east...Putin could easily just tell them that they will either release those funds or assets, or he will militarily seize or destroy their assets all over the globe. I am not sure he would even have to do that, pretty sure the economic might coupled with their intel services could take down any bank without ever firing a round if they were serious about it...i guess it just seems strange to me. I think about some other country or entitity trying to impose sanctions on the US as well...i just dont see that ever happening. We would light somebody up like we did Baghdad... Russia and China are formidable in their own rights. Seems weird to me .
 
#1,008
#1,008
By normal wall of text post up there was actually a question if any of yall are more learned about how sanctions actually work? Is it just that basically we can put sanctions on Russia because they dont care enough to really fight them? Seems like if they were really wrecking their economy or causing unrest, Russia would do the same thing that we would do in that position...we would wage war against whoever we needed to in order for us to succeed.
 
#1,009
#1,009
Marcus, as with most things its probably a mix of factors, but my guess would be.
1. it keeps the US the boogey man. Putin needs that more than most politicians. fixing the issue is only a temporary fix for Putin, that only keeps people happy for so long. but having a constant enemy that he can drum up is far more helpful
2. It keeps those oligarchs in line. they can't buck Putin's line if they need his help with money, or dealing with the American boogey man, see item 1.
3. I am thinking at some point it doesn't effect their economy as much as we think, or they are just willing to absorb the losses, where people more free wouldn't. similar to losses in war, losses in economy are acceptable there, that wouldn't be here. - just some thinking no facts on this.
4. Russia does have issues, the gulags aren't empty, and there are plenty of disodents. so I don't think they are having NO effect, just not enough, which is why Putin doesn't take action. similar to his micro aggressions and land grabs in Moldavia, Georgia, Ukraine the sanctions aren't a big enough item to justify a larger response. that may tie into item 3
5. at least stereotypically Russia has always been a bit of a "black market" economy, official sanctions don't matter THAT much when a decent portion of your economy is off the books. probably stems from their time as communists.

being an overt aggressor would make him the bad guy on the world stage, and with Putin's strategy of making the world his enemy, or at least the "West", he has boxed himself in on choices.

imo
 
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#1,012
#1,012
LouderVol said:
Marcus, as with most things its probably a mix of factors, but my guess would be.
1. it keeps the US the boogey man. Putin needs that more than most politicians. fixing the issue is only a temporary fix for Putin, that only keeps people happy for so long. but having a constant enemy that he can drum up is far more helpful
2. It keeps those oligarchs in line. they can't buck Putin's line if they need his help with money, or dealing with the American boogey man, see item 1.
3. I am thinking at some point it doesn't effect their economy as much as we think, or they are just willing to absorb the losses, where people more free wouldn't. similar to losses in war, losses in economy are acceptable there, that wouldn't be here. - just some thinking no facts on this.
4. Russia does have issues, the gulags aren't empty, and there are plenty of disodents. so I don't think they are having NO effect, just not enough, which is why Putin doesn't take action. similar to his micro aggressions and land grabs in Moldavia, Georgia, Ukraine the sanctions aren't a big enough item to justify a larger response. that may tie into item 3
5. at least stereotypically Russia has always been a bit of a "black market" economy, official sanctions don't matter THAT much when a decent portion of your economy is off the books. probably stems from their time as communists.

being an overt aggressor would make him the bad guy on the world stage, and with Putin's strategy of making the world his enemy, or at least the "West", he has boxed himself in on choices.

imo
Click to expand...

Well thought out post, Louder.. i had rhe same thought about economic sanctions not hurting as much with black markets and bribery at every turn. Never thought about several of those but they make good logical sense. I am sure if we put sanctions on them that really did hurt, they would act up.
 
#1,016
#1,016
marcusluvsvols said:
I have always wondered how we pull off putting sanctions on Russia...other countries, sure...but russia has a nuclear stockpile bigger than ours, and a very formidable military...I know its a UN thing and not just us...but I mean if we decide to freeze their assets, or embargo certain goods etc, whats to keep Russia from making it a dick measuring contest? I remember we had like 100s of millions of russian oligarchs dollars frozen in accounts in various world banks...whats to keep Putin from threatening retaliation against those huge banks? Hes not going to blow up Deutsch Bank headquarters in Europe, I get that...but these huge banks have billions of dollars tied up in say loans for infrastructure in developing countries, or oil fields in the middle east...Putin could easily just tell them that they will either release those funds or assets, or he will militarily seize or destroy their assets all over the globe. I am not sure he would even have to do that, pretty sure the economic might coupled with their intel services could take down any bank without ever firing a round if they were serious about it...i guess it just seems strange to me. I think about some other country or entitity trying to impose sanctions on the US as well...i just dont see that ever happening. We would light somebody up like we did Baghdad... Russia and China are formidable in their own rights. Seems weird to me .
Click to expand...
Oil in dollars has been the historic bully pulpit, but Russia has set up their own system now, so I don't think we have the same pull that we used to.
 
#1,017
#1,017
Orange_Crush said:
If they show that black face in public, his entire military will be killed by a dirty dozen Oregon Antifa members.
Click to expand...


Good grief that video is astoundingly bad. When they finished eating crayons, our Marines would laugh their asses off at that video...as they should. Good grief. Wow
 
#1,021
#1,021
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#1,022
#1,022
Velo Vol said:
He already did.

My issue is that the administration escalated the rhetoric to the point of portraying a crisis, but Maduro could remain for many months.
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Probably. We can only do so much. We can only cut off so much money. Other countries have to do their part too, and he will not be removed just by us.
 
#1,023
#1,023
Grand Vol said:
Yes and no. I don't think we need to be getting militarily involved, no.

Neither do the Russians either.

There is serious international condemnation for the current lunatic in charge there including most Latin American nations condemning him. Russia is about the only backer he's got at the moment.
Click to expand...
RAS and Pacer don’t count?
 
#1,025
#1,025
Velo Vol said:
We're going to see how much Russia is willing to spend to keep him propped up. My hunch is not enough.
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depends on how much control of the oil they get. They don't have enough control at the moment to warrant it. But things can change rapidly.
 
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